jeffrogers

Yeah that is a very huge generalzation. I Find alot of the practioners who respect other arts and shows those who train in those arts respect. -Jeff

You will find most bouncers and correctional officers saying wrist locks in general don't work to well unless the component is already complinant. -Jeff

again and again

Okay Let me elborate. The nawww your wrong part. Was ment about hte fighters you choose. That Joe Son is the best. *Joke* -Jeff

awesome. I don't know much of Taijitsu. Met some sempai in some Ninpo or Taijitsu club in Arizona around Arizona State University. I wasn't impressed though. He tried some joint locks but wasn't really good at them. I read some books by Stevean K Hayes. I thought the moves in the books looked goofy though. So it would be nice to see some good practioners of the Art instead of looking at books or from my experience from one guy who didn't seem that good so I can get a better impression of the art. OH and yeah Jiu-Jitsu schools are pretty expensive. -Jeff

Okay for my opinion. I think the Gracies are awesome. They did a lot to revolustion martial arts to the mass public by exposing the weakness to us of are ground game and educating the importance of it to us. I think they are awesome at what they do. Yes Hero worship does drive me crazy. But then again some people need a hero some one to really look up to. Me I got my dad and few other people in life. What annoys me though is the people that watch the first 3 UFC's and think Royce in which they pronouce it ("R"ocye) Which gets on my nerves. But think he is unbeateable. Those who watched pride seen the Sakraba vs. Gracie matches. We seen the Dan Henderson vs. Renzo. The Wallid vs. Royce. They are invincible so the nuthuggers do drive me nuts. but I am greatful for the gracies have done and the art they taught. As well as others like the Machado's and other peoiple that spread this information. Jiu-Jitsu and MMA is my favorite sport. so in that I can say I am a biased fan of these sports compared to others. But that same Hero worship gets on my nerves like Bruce Lee. Great martial artist, good philospher which is alot of his therios and concepts of martial arts come from. Is eastern Philosophy and Taoism reworded. Or related to Martial arts. He braught alot of exposure to other martail arts becasue of Jeet Kune do concepts and through is movies and domonstration at the Ed Parker tourny's. So he is good in that respect. But I think people again think he is invincible. Oh and yes the people that Ride on a founders rep. Is a bit looney and dilusional. That goes for the BJJ'ers the JKD guys the Karate, TKD, the Ninpo or Taijitsu guys, MMA and many others. It goes to ways. Either you can make what you do work. Or you can't. What others can do is irrevelent. That being said. Thank you ever one so much for your opinions on this thread. Much appreciated -Jeff

hmmmm....Does it realy matter how old the system is I think not. Either it works or it doesn't. And becomes its old doesn't mean over time it hasn't been watered down. Thats quite irrevent.

I am sure there are fighters or TMA martial artist who can beat tyson. I would be dumb to say there isn't. But same time it hasn't been proven. So its an unknown. Sort of silly to argue about. -Jeff

Uechi kid ko'ed the correct. -Jeff

Also on a side note. TMA instructors know that when you open a school Big amount of that revune comes from kids. Kids have short attention spans so pushing off more stuff like point sparring to keep it safer and to have gymnastics in forms, musical forms, its more entertaining. Also stuff like Tae bo and other things to bring in more customers. After all its a business they run and they have to do what they need for a business. So in all honesty mass martail arts is going to be catered to the wants of the public. Look at UFC after that went crazy and every one started getting and is now getting into the BJJ and grappling craze. Schools offer that now. They will find some wrester with some sub skills or a judo guy and they go to wrestling clincis and martial arts seminars to pick things up. Or instructor of a TMA schools were they will watch some Gracie tapes and other stuff. Which I think waters down or mcdojo's the ground frame work. Stupid stuff like taking the back and then going to your back with the attacker between your legs to try to choke him. But they cross there legs. Leaving the attacker to throw his own legs over to ankle lock him. Or showing wrong direction to turn into arm bars. They lack the detail to show them how to make the moves effective. Which on a lighter note pisses me off. Because for an intlectual competing side of Jiu-JItsu and ground work. I like a good game of chess. and pisses me off some one doesn't know how to play were is the fun of that. -Jeff

My reasons why I think Martial arts from Okinawa got watered down. 1. Itroduction by Itosu to bring in the Shori te system into the public school systems. In which he changed the forums and techinques to more closed fist style. He took out alot of the more brutal techinues that can kill a person. Although what he did show was effective none the less for fighting. This was first big mass deliverence of Karate around okinawa. Before it was practiced more in secret or underground. Oh and to confirm Sevenstars idea for competing. Okinawan masters and practioners did do challlange matches with each other. Read diffrent history on okinawa Karate by diffrent authors and you will see that. 2. US Military coming to Okinawa and Japan around wwII and after that were only stationed there a short ti me. Picked up moves and then came back to the states to teach them. With out grasping alot meaning behind them. Certain moves were done to get across concepts they were used as a trianing tool. You wouldn't find like that. Wants you got the concept you move your postions to were you would fighting better but you have the idea to apply the concept. Such as the punch from the hips. One hand goes out one hand goes back. To get across the simple, basic concept of push and pull in hitting. So both sides of the body were working. 3. Students in America stayign a short time then creating there own system or teaching what they no with out full understanding it to make a buck. So again less martail arts knowledge left there respectvie arts watered down. 4. Finally Joon Rhee the supposed "Father" of American Taekwondo introduced more padded gear and point sparring to the states. Which caused to use teachniques less effective or not really that effective at all. Becaues you don't need body weight behind your stirkes you just need speed and torque or (snap) to deliever the techinques. Which also led later on to Muscial forms and others stuff which is Known as form "Acting" Which basically left the Martial artist not really understanding what the purpose of the forms were for. So with lack of concepts and undesrtanding with in the art. The practioner become a weapon with blanks. Sure iwhen its fired off you heard the loud BANG! and see the flash from the barrel its seems impressive but the was nothing in the intended results in which it was designed. So you see the Acting in forms. The gymnastic cart wheels and flips. Don't get me wrong I still like that stuff its fun to watch. Diffrent gymnastics in forms and seeing Wu shu they have some elgant looking forms that look impressive. So these are my reasons why karate turned into dance and tag. -Jeff

True RB. But...it is nice that she is MA. You both have a passion for. So that is something that is good. Alot of women. Are like "Oh...that stuff is nice." But they don't really get involved. Espcially if she is into your own particular style for which you have a passion for. She becomes a bit more attracitve. I am sure we all seen women before that are average but there personalitys makes them more attractive. Were we see a drop dead bomb shell and her personality ruins it for you. I don't know about you guys but the MA just makes them more attractive. Least the personality part and it radiates to the rest of them. -Jeff

Just curious what peoiple think?

Any one into White Crane what concepts you guys you focus on? Pressure point closing. Which is picking up the arches of your feet, Or cupping your hand like your hoding a stone,egg,coin or what ever you want to call it. Little ideas of placement of the thumb to move around around the muscle aroudn the radial nerve, Ideas of rocking your weight, or diffrent weight transfer, Using your stomach and certain body alignments into your moves, many more. Energy transerence, intent of moves from Kata/forms. ? -Jeff

No I was talking about you mentioning the chopping of the tree. If that was related to some one elses post? thats what I was asking. -Jeff

One of my earlier posts said balance in both. I guess I didn't write enough to stress what I said. But I meaning more boxing type air drills or least boxing type covering. Not the Traditional Karate moves were one hand is punching other retraciting at the hip. Or least not to much emphasis enough for themn to get certain concepts maybe a week or two at the most of work on it. But then to switch. But again that is talking about certain styles of doing things Other systems like Wing chun have difrent hand work as far as it being on the center line. Other styles use other hand postions. I relate to Karate because I see advance practioners doiing techniques like that but sparring maybe a little diffrent. -Jeff

thanks, said it didn't go through I guess it did. Sorry for the double post.

Actually in reality when you think about it. If your not out starting fights, going to bad neighborhoods, in bars all the time. And in general you don't act like jerk. If you aren't into fighting competion. You won't really use your skills that much. Thats both for Grapplers and Strikers. Except for the gym/dojo/dojang/kwoon/school what not. Most won't even use there skills. People do Martial arts for confidence. Thats the biggest reason people do it. They may say to gain self defense, or to get into shape, or number of reason. But it all leads or mostly leads back to confidence. -Jeff

Also for those of you whow know her. Wow She is sexy. two words. "Erica Montoya"

JohnnyS is again correct. You tain With Elvis Sinosic in Austraillia in BJJ? Shorin Ryu Sensei, Not when we spar but when we grapple. Nothing like having a sexy women mounted on top. Actually I only got excited when I grappled with some girls a few times. Mostly when I hit the gym my brain changes to training mode. Usually I don't get to excited to often when I train for them for awhile. When new women comes in that is pretty I get a little excited but after we start training I go back into training mode and work the JJ game. Yeah I agree its the confidence. But I seen non matial artist and confidence is a plus with them. But with female martial artists. Its diffrent. Plus I think its good because if you find some one who has a passion for the martial arts. You can both understand the commitment to trianing. I mean how many people used to go 6 or 7 times a week when they were single. but now married, Wife complains your not around that much. So your lucky to even make 3 times in two weeks. I seen people who are married who are both really passionate about martial arts. They do spend there time together but they also both understand each others passion so it isn't a big deal that they go train 6 or 7 times a week. Because other is training also. -Jeff

Oh okay, Thanks for the explanation Monkeygirl. You on your Junior or Senior year. Maybe if you can see if you can get hired on as a Physical fitness or TKD instructor for them. See if they can get MA part of there PE curriculum. I know schools in Arizona who have done that. If your interestead. How big is the martial arts room going to be? I don't blame you for not going to the TKD club. Would be akward to be with some one you had disgrements with or dont' get along with. -Jeff

Even though there are far more gorgeous women. For some reason women who trains seems really sexy to me. Any one feel the same? -Jeff

Gracie's in general for bringing BJJ to the states. For my own teacher who was willing to share all he knew. For Tony Sandoval and Larry Naranjo for bring exposing me to deeper concepts that is not reallly taught in the Karate world. For Jerry Shaw my shaolin Kempo teacher who helped me in my character and techiqes who over all looked out for me. I consider him a friend and mentor. Also finally for all those cheese martial arts movies that inspired alot of us into the martial arts, as well as the UFC for giving us nice brutal entertainment while were drunk, except for when the lay pray things happen like Royce and Ken 2. That sucked donkey stuff. (again edited for the mods) -JEff

I agree whole hardley with sevenstars points. -Jeff

SevenStar is right it all depends on your trianing methods. I seen an instructor who mentioned how his student was frustertated and wanted to learn better fighting techniques. All the instructor said was practice your kata more. He then told me that Kata contained the techniques for fighting. Well I know kata is used as a refrence with adapitblity in the acutual moves ot make several diffrent techniques off of one move. Also a vehicle to practice concepts or get across concepts. Mainly it is used a as refrence for all of that. Just telling his student to practice Kata was a disvafor with out least exposing some concept or ideas for him to work into his kata. Which I thought was silly to do. Same with training methods in Karate. I don't think most Karate practioners would beat an equal standing kick boxer. Alot of schools train kata, train, techniques on no resiting or very little resitance partner, do some air drills and bag drills, and some mild Kumite. Even if the training methods was more full contact Kumite. Most people go for 3 hours out of a week. were is if your talking about 2 students who one taking Karate for a year the other Mauy thai or some full contact kick boxing. And competes and trains like an athlete he will beat the Karate ka. Why more time in training, more experience, Meaning fighters in Mauy thai that compete usually put in more hours of training time more hours of conditioing there body, more time on the bag and more shadow boxing drills. As well as spart with more contact. That is the general idea. Not all Karate schools do meidum contact, or training methods aren't geared so high. But Kick boxing format type fighers are martial athletes, put more time and repts into there fighting and work out stragies to make it work! Were is regular karate ka put ligher contact and aren't martial athletes they are matial artists. Again this is general statment depends on teh instructor the student. But on average a kick boxing student same time in number of months or years against a karate student. Kick boxer will more likely come out the winner in a street fight. -Jeff