MatsuShinshii

Absolute fraudulent nonsense! No such thing as a no touch knock out. It's been debunked many, many times. Dillman and the like are charlatans. Whether it works on their students due to power of suggestion or hypnotism or just because they play along doesn't matter. You can't use it on those that are not your students so it's baseless in fact. I went to one of these seminars years back. The funny thing was they wouldn't demonstrate on anyone from the crowd, only their own students. One of my counterparts even challenged them and would give them a $100.00 if they could do this to him. They declined. Why? because its make believe smoke and mirrors nonsense. No touch KO's are baseless nonsense pure and simple. Not real and never will be. If they are I have a $1,000.00 for anyone that can KO me with their Ki without touching me. I'll have that grand till the day I die, because its fake! Sad thing is they take money from naive students with the promise that one day they too can knock out a person three times their size with nothing more than a wave of their hand. These people are the worst kind of instructors. I have absolutely zero respect and nothing but disdain for these frauds. If any of them think they are not frauds, the challenge stands.

After decades of training I can say I have pretty good control over my toes. However it wasn't always that way as I have had my fair share of broken toes over the years due to control/positioning issues. Pain is a good teacher.

However many arts/organizations have a requirements in place to teach. In our art you are not permitted to teach until Sandan. In others you can start teaching at Ikkyu. It's really based on your organizations/styles/arts requirements and what they will and will not allow when it comes to grades and teaching.

I've been doing some reaserch on this point, as my club is about to fold (see post in Karate forum), and I get the feeling from the input of others and post which relate to transferring belts from club to club, that in the real world, even in clubs ilaffiliated to the same governing body, that your belt is only really good in your own club and it's most likely that anyone starting another club is highly unlikely to take their belt with them. Seems almost to be considered an arrogance to assume you are any rank, even if it is officially graded and signed off, which makes me wonder what the point of having any official certification of grades in the martial arts if they are not going to be recognised outside of your own club. Of course I could be wrong on that, but that's the impression I get. That is not entirely true across the board. In my organization our grades are honored because our organization is relatively small (500+) and standards are exactly the same across the board. However in other instances what is taught and the requirements and standards under which it is taught can differ from school to school in some organizations and in that there are no guarantees of cross over. Some arts/styles have many organizations representing them and in that have different requirements, standards and curriculum. In this example there should be no expectation of cross over even though in the same art/style. When moving from one art to another there should never be any expectation of maintaining grade. New art = start from scratch.

Actually to answer the subject title of the post - Yes. Seisan would be just one example. Shuri-te, Tomari-Te and Naha-te all have versions and those have versions dependent upon the art. Example; Goju-Ryu and Uechi-Ryu are performed differently but are both called Seisan. Conversely these versions are different from their counterparts in Shuri-Te and Tomari-Te. So yes... a Kata can be of the same name but be completely different. I know this was not the context of the post but the title made me click on the post so I thought I'd answer the title as well.

Just a point or order, so to speak... Funakoshi did not study Goju Ryu. Goju Ryu and Shotokan as we know them were being at pretty much the same time. Chōjun Miyagi and Gichen Funakoshi were contemporaries and didn’t have any teachers in common that I’m aware of. Funakoshi developed Shotokan from Shorei Ryu and Shorin Ryu. Miyagi developed Goju Ryu from Naha-Te and furthered it from what he learned in China. I'm definitely not an expert on Shotokan but I seem to remember that I read his teachers were Itosu and Azato. Both were students of Matsumura and thus would fall into the Shorin Ryu classification. PS - Shorei Ryu is the classification that Goju Ryu is in along with other Nafaadi (Naha-Te) arts. I have no idea if Funakoshi studied Goju-Ryu but if I had to guess at a class of Ti (Te) outside of Suidi (Shuri-Te) I would guess Tumaadi (Tomari-Te) over Nafaadi (Naha-Te). I just don't see the connection to Nafaadi.

It may not seem fair after years of study but you must realize that your new Sensei doesn't know you and it takes time to assess ability, skill and knowledge and thus, if the Sensei is worth his/her salt will place you at White belt. This is true within the same organization moving from one school to another. In the case of changing arts, your old grade means absolutely nothing. You start at the beginning like any other new student. Tell your new Sensei about your experience. If your skill, ability and knowledge is on par with a specific grade it is possible that they will elevate you based on this. Having said this there are no guarantees.

The first half of it sounds like Pinan 2 from what you describe, but the “double lateral ridge hand” and on isn’t anything I’ve come across. Is it possibly a Korean form? Not to sound the wrong way, but I’ve seen videos of several Korean forms that seem like a mashup of Pinan katas of sorts. And is it possible that you were/are doing “Korean karate” rather than Japanese or Okinawan karate? TKD and TSD have often been referred to as Korean karate. Again, it’s not a knock on Korean arts at all, it just gets confusing to people sometimes. Look up Korean forms online. You might come across it. I don’t remember the names of them, but I’ve seen Korea forms videos that look quite a bit like re-worked Pinan and other Japanese/Okinawan kata. Sounds like a culmination of Kata or as you say mashup. Definitely not the way we perform either Kata.

If you train in a style like Shotokan Pinan Shodan is Pinan Nidan and vice versa. If you train in an Okinawan style Pinan Shodan is Pinan Shodan and Pinan Nidan is Pinan Nidan. The reason... Pinan Shodan is viewed as more difficult than Nidan and thus they swapped the order.

Well put and I, as a teacher do. However as previously stated, this is not an easy task nor do I wish my students to set this as their goal nor do I set this as my goal. Yes my mantra is to train and teach all that I know so that the next generation can carry the torch and continue the art. I personally believe that we as teachers owe this to our teachers and their teachers as a way to pay them back for the knowledge they taught us. So yes I do wish for my students to be better than me. However is this realistic? If my teacher started training at the age of, lets say 15, and I started training with him when he was, lets say 30. This is 15 years more time on the floor than me. How do you make that experience up? Most that aspire to teach and own their own Dojo don't just train twice a week. The arts are their life and thus train everyday. If, in the example above, I were 15 years behind my teacher and he trained faithfully everyday over the course of that 15 years, how do I then advance beyond him? How do I have the same experiences. He trained with/under three of our top teachers and as such has been exposed to knowledge and little nuances that his students have not. He studied other arts that I have not. His teachers were different than he was and taught differently. We would assume that you are learning the best of what he/she was taught but in all reality you have no way of gauging this. To say that we want our students to be better than us is a goal that we all should have as teachers. However no two people have the same experiences and thus, unless taught, we will never over come their knowledge of the art because as they are teaching us they are still learning. Kinda of hard to catch up unless they stop so we can advance. It's a never ending journey and one is always a student of the art and thus constantly learning. I could be 90 and my Shinshii will be long gone and I will not have learned all that he knew because I can never have the same experiences and lets face it we are human and some information is not taught for whatever reasons. To me the goal of a student is to be better tomorrow than they were today. This is the only realistic gauge we can aspire to. Then again this question is also subjective. Maybe we are speaking purely in terms of ability and not necessarily knowledge and skill. Since we are all different and some have more natural ability than others then it is possible to be better in ability than your teacher in time. However you must first define the word "better". If "better" defines all aspects then I say again, "this is a fools errand". My Shinshii is now 91 years young. In terms of fighting I could probably better him due to the fact that as we age our bodies can not take the same amount of damage. However in terms of skill and knowledge of the art he puts me to shame. If the gauge of "better" means being able to beat your teacher at some point in time, father time will make that goal come true and you can say you're better. For me I do not see "better" in these terms. To me better means learning all that they know, developing the same skills and the same abilities and going beyond them. This might be possible in time but not an easy quest. Even then, as stated above, you will never have the same experiences so how do you gauge when you are "better"? In my case, my teacher had decades on me and still trains. If he died tomorrow (God forbid) would I have enough life left to accomplish this goal? Would I even want to? What would this gain me? Or maybe we are talking in terms of humanity. Being better human beings than our teachers. This is definitely possible. Maybe your teacher has some questionable morals. You could definitely be better than they were. But this is all semantics. Better means better in terms of the arts and that is defined by being better in all things. If not can you really say you are better? And in this, I do not personally think this is possible in every instance. At least for me in terms of being better than my teacher this would truely be a fools errand in every sense. I prefer to concentrate on things I can control like improving beyond yesterday or last week or last month or last year. My gauge of success is not hinged on whether I meet some mythical goal but whether I have improved each and every day. In terms of teaching the same apply's. I do not gauge my students based on me but whether they are better than they were in the past and whether they are where they should be in their training.

Favorite Kata Naifanchin (Naihanchi) Pinan Shodan Seisan Rohai Passai Useishi Chinto Kusanku Hakutsuru Wanduan If I could only have 5 Naifanchin Seisan Useishi Rohai Kusanku

Welcome back.

Much respect! Great definition and explanation Sensei8.

Welcome to KF Fat Cobra.

DauntlessDruid, welcome to KF.

First off it's great to have another brother in arms here. As far as your assessment goes... I could not agree more. All the fluff goes out the window when your life is at stake and your adrenaline is 190 miles an hour. All the fancy stuff is forgotten and what works and is easiest to employ is used.

If I was the instructor teaching Karate/Eskrima and I had a student tell me they were leaving to train in BJJ I wouldn't take it personally, I would just figure that BJJ is more their thing and so that's what they should pursue. I would know that Karate and Eskrima aren't for everybody and if BJJ works better for a particular student than they should do that instead, just as BJJ isn't for everybody and there might be students who quit BJJ in favor of Karate and Escrima. That's just me though, I can't speak for your instructor as everybody reacts differently. Yeah, that's it!! The student should be able to explore the many facets of the MA quite freely without facing any type of discouragement whatsoever from anybody. If a CI take offense to a student wanting to learn another MA, then that CI is lacking from one thing or more. Imho!! Both are solid posts and solid points. Those that discourage their students from trying other things are either worried that the student will find out they weren't being taught ineffective techniques or are worried about loosing tuition. Art "X" is never going to be for everyone. If art "Z" works better for them then it was just a matter of time before they lost interest and quit anyway. To be a teacher is to think of your students and what is best for them. If that means letting them go then so be it. Wish them luck and shake their hand as they walk out of the door. You'd be surprised how many students will return when they realize that you not only had their best interests at heart but also it gives them a different perspective to realize that what you were teaching was effective. But then again some will not return and that is for the best as well.

Dave B. As to not post our earlier (very long) posts and take up a great deal of space I will answer you in a new post. I understand what you are saying and understand the thinking behind what you are saying. When I was younger I studied an art emphasized blocks. The thought behind a block was to damage or break the opponents weapon. We practiced conditioning (arm to arm blocks/strikes) and the concept was every block is a strike and every strike is a block. In fact the phase "Karate Ni Sente Nashi" was enforced. Thus the emphasis on blocking was tantamount in training. This is what I refer to when talking about modern blocking (in some respects). Don't get me wrong I love all of the arts I have trained in and find them to be effective in many ways. However I do not agree with the premise of blocking. To me it robs momentum thus slowing your reaction time down and giving your opponent an advantage. Conditioning the arms to damage/break the opponents is great unless of course your opponent is more conditioned than you 9an example would be a Thai fight I saw years ago were a guy broke his leg kicking his opponents leg). To me it's not a great idea to block a full on strike when I can just as easily move, brush, redirect then seize and control or throw and maintain the advantage versus giving it to my opponent. As far as evidence goes... you're right in some respects as many of what we call old teachers are third or more generation away from the founders and teach the modern sense of blocking and thus I would draw the same opinion. However as it was passed down to me, we do not block in the modern sense. We do not block in any sense. In researching my art and the old arts that influenced my art I have seen examples of both blocks and what we understand as Uke(Uki). Proof... well like most things in Okinawan arts documentation is scarce at best. I can only offer you my opinion and that of my teachers and their teachers. Beyond that it is very hard to point to anything so concrete. So I will say that besides my journey and the understanding of my arts I have no documentation to prove or disprove that I can point to where you can see that proof for yourself. I have nothing against the block in modern terms in training. I quite enjoyed my time studying arts that utilize this, for conditioning purposes. I just do not feel that it is effective in actual combat. However if it works for you, use it. For me it has never worked and those that I have seen trying to implement it in real combat paid for the attempt. And just to clarify we do train and teach as we will fight. Realism is tantamount to being prepared. I myself learned hard lessons in terms of blocking which is why I prefer our arts methodology. For me it is all about maintaining the advantage and for reasons that I have explained along with others. I find no real value in blocking. Call it a personal preference. I'm am definitely not saying you are wrong for your beliefs. I am merely saying that IMHO it's not for me or the way I/we teach the art.

I could not agree more. Solid points Sensei8.

July makes 40 years of training. What do I know? I know I do not know enough. I know there is so much more to learn than what I have learned. I know that I am not as knowledgeable as my teacher or his teachers or their teachers. I know that no matter how much I learn I will never know as much as I think I know. I know some with little time in the arts think they know much and others that have vast amounts of time realize they know very little.

Ibuprofen, ice and heat. I guess if it's bad enough you could add muscle relaxers but this requires a doctor and is not a home remedy. Tiger balm is more of a mask rather than a remedy as it tricks the brain into thinking it's cooling and heating but in reality this does nothing for the actual muscle. You can't beat good old ice and heat.

Just about the norm. Bought one a few years back (largest version the company carried) that incorporates everything from a head ache to bandages to sting relief to pressure bandages to slings, etc, etc, etc. I also have a field kit that blows away the aforementioned kit and includes everything up to surgical equipment. Pretty much anything you would need to perform surgery if needed in the field.

This is a two part question. For the instructors here; What does this word mean to you? (No I am not asking for Wiki or the dictionary definition) I'm asking you what it means to be a Sensei. For the students here; What does this word mean to you? What do you think it represents as a student and some day for you as an instructor. What responsibilities does this word (title) carry with it? What are you responsibilities to your students, to the art, to your instructor and to yourself?

Matsumura Sokon Sun Tzu Miyomoto Musashi Jigoro Kano Shigeru Nakamura Matayoshi Shinko Shoshin Nagamine John Wayne Chesty Puller My father My Shinshii

Solid post! I couldn’t say it better if I tried.