G95champ

Yeah I would love to train in some Aikido however my problem with it is they do NO kicks and very few hand strikes. Most karate styles I have been arround have a lot of redirection throws. Most are based off ot their turns. IMO only a true Aikido master could come out a multi man attack unhurt without relying on strikes. A karate master who can strike and use a hand full of throws and locks IMO would stand much better odds in a multi attacker fight. I guess the question we need to look at now is a stand up grappler vs a striker. This is a hard call because the striker still have the KO ability without fear of going down. However the stand up grapple wants him to strike hard and out of control so he can counter and throw or lock. So logic leads me to think this would be about 50/50.

Yeah I try and play it off and say no we go HHHHHHEEEEEEEEYYYYYYYAAAAAA

We always step forward with out left before starting basics. As long as they are consistant I don't know that it is really a big deal.

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Kensai I love a good debate LOL Im a fan of striking for this reason ONLY. In a street fight if you go to the ground you can be jumped from one of the guys friends. BJJ, Judo, Wrestling, etc is not good for multi attackers. Thats not to say striking arts like Karate, TKD, Thai are but at least you can hit and move instead of being a target. Now I am the first to admit that as soon as a grappler takes a strike down its just a matter of time. Most good grapplers can take down any good striker. In this case the strikes only hope is the lucky punch or the KO. So IMO its like this. ONE on ONE in a controled fight the grappler wins 9 of 10 matches every time if not more. ONE on TWO or more the striker has much better odds of comming out a winner only because he can hit and move. There is an old saying that it is better to be lucky than good. This is what strikers like myself live by when we face a well trained grappler.

Sai I must admit I have never head of SanShou. LOL Where is it from? Give me a little info on it.

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I don't know about that rule. Its not my game just throwing out and idea here. Why should the 5 members of one team get the chance to vote off the best member of another team. I mean thats what I would do. IMO only the team that lost should vote on which member of their team leaves. This is the way it works on TV. I know its not may game but that seems a little unfair to me.

1. Kung Fu - It was the first it has many styles, great history, developes the mind and body, works well for SD and Combat, weapons, kata, and is studies by millions across the world. 2. Karate - Its name alone stands for any sort of MA to any person with no understanding of what MA is. A rich history that comes out in many styles. A well balanced art between puching and kicking. Focus on hard and soft. Works well for SD and conbat. Some styles of karate use weapons some do not but a huge fucus on kata and is also studies by millions in Asia, America, and Eruope. (TSD is basically karate) 3. TKD - The art that has taken karate from the dojo the the olympic games. TKD has direct ties to American Kickboxing which is where guys like Norris, Walllace, Wilson made their fame and made MA famous. Again rich history, use of some weapons, and kata. Better for sport than SD IMO however it is a very popular art and that counts for a lot. 4. Hapikdo - A mix of Karate, Akido, and Judo. I know it was not set out that way but if you think about it thats about what it is. It has stand up fighting like Karate, locks like Akido and throws like Judo. Not as well known as the others ont he list but a very full art full of history. Also has a focus on weapons and kata. 5. Judo - Judo is in front of Akido IMO because like TKD Judo has taken MA to the next leval the olympic games. Judo is also one of the oldest MA and a lot of early Karate founders had deep Judo roots. The abilty of the art to work alone gets it on my list. Unlike BJJ most Judo schools spend time on their stand up fighting as well. I really don't know if they use kata but its history and ability to take MA to the next leval don't matter. 6. Akido - A great art I would love to study. The ability to use the attacker force against them is nothing short of amazing. However Akido has NO kicks and very few strikes. IMO that takes a lot away from it as being a complete art. However its ties to the Samuri and sword play adds a lot not many arts can. The use of kata and great throwing moves and locks along with its history keeps it in my top 10. 7. Muay Thai - Without question you learn to fight in this art. If you don't learn you basically don't last long. Maybe the most effective art if you want to learn to fight in a week to take. However the learing curve after say one year of training gets basically flat. As to where all the arts above the curce stays the same or even gets sharper. Thai has great history and developes the spirt and the mind for the ture Thai fighter. The art is a striking art however and his little to no ground game. In fact I would say it has less grappeling in its trainign that any art outside of boxing. However the power and effectivness of it as a fighting art is unreal and keeps it on my list. 8. Ninjitsu - When we were all little kids we wanted to be a ninja. Heck some of us still do. There is something superhero about it that we all love. A very well rounded art that few have the chance to truely learn. Great focus is put on the mental and spiritual not to mention the physical aspect of the art. Weapons do I need to say more. Ninjitsu although not studied by very many people is a term we all know and has helped seel MA to millions of kids. 9. Wrestling - Im not talking about Stone Cold and Hulk Hogan here. However wrestling was maybe the first MA developed in the West. Wrestling is a sport in almost all High Schools in the USA and is studied by millions arround the world. Although it is not a great art for SD it is very effective in events. Many of the early UFC winners were one time wrestlers. Again it has long been a olympic event. Wrestling is often not thought of as a MA because it was not developed in Asia but none the less it should be on this list. 10. BJJ or Jitsu in general - Maybe the most popular MA today. Everyone has seen the Gracie family and wants to know what they know. My only problem with BJJ that stops it from being a top 5 art or higher. The Gracie family will only fight in events with certin rules. So IMO that makes the art limited to what it can and can not do. Now there is no question it is a super art and had tons and tons of great moves that can end any fight in a matter of seconds. However again I want to point out its use is SD is in question. Going to the ground in a ring is one thing. Going to the ground on the street with your attackers friends standing arround is another. So the lack of a stand up game and rules IMO hurts BJJ from being higher. However it is grwoing very fast thanks to the Gracie clan. Only time will tell if its a fad or the real thing. You will notice my list did not have any mixed arts on it. Styles such as Krav Maga, Sambo, SAVATE, etc. There is a differance in arts that developed as arts made from others and arts that developed alone. Many of the moves you see in those arts are from Judo, Jitsu, Thai, Karate, Kung Fu, etc. So to me that is a horse of a differant color. I hope you like my list I think its pretty good LOL. But thats what I think.

Agreed Lee was no superman but he was the first. Being the first makes you the best in a lot of peoples eyes. EX Babe Ruth the first great Homerun hitter. George Washington the first president. Life was better int he good ole days. Lee done more to make MA what it is today than anyone before or since. That is his importance and that is why he will ALWAYS be considered the greatest reguardless of skill or talent.

We will use a chair and work the kick in 3 stages. One knee up Two kick out Three pull the kick back We hold each step for a few seconds. With time you can hold it longer. Also you just do it over and over and over. Hitting a bag is as good of a way as any to build power and know your hitting something solid.

I did a style called Americna TAO in college that my Sensei made up because he held several differant black belts one of which being TSD. He said TSD was developed from Shotokan by the Koreans.

O BTW Heian means Peaceful Mind

Good stuff Pacific and Sai. I love reading how our art developed.

Don't try and mix arts till you have spent a lot of time in one. You can't learn to skate and ride a bike at the same time. Both are good ways to get you to a place but you can only do one at a time.

No and here is why... Boxers tend to throw bad punches. Meaning the don't learn how to hit with a bare fist. Because they train with 16oz gloves on. These gloves protect the hands. The Ring and Little finger break really eaisy. This is why you see MA only hit with the 2 big knuckles. If you can find a boxing teacher who teaches boxing for SD and shows you hot to protect your hands then ok. However because of the gloves most teach the Hook Punch with the contact being the oustide of the hand which really puts the hand in danger of breaking if you strike something hard without the padding of gloves. This is not to put boxing down just the fact that it builds confidence that is not there because of the use of gloves in training that you won't have in a SD event.

Kickchick I had thought about making a syllabus. However I find myself teaching history between sets. I guess thats me being a history teacher. As soon as we finish a kata or a set of basics while the class is catching their breath I will go on about some aspect of karate. Could be our history, my training history, how certin techinques are taught and are differant. ETC. Then when it comes test time I think of the stuff I talked about the last few weeks. That way I know they are listing and paying attention at all times. However I always ask certin questions that everyone should know.

I have never trained in the Pinan Kata but I have read and been told that they are basically the same. A few differance in Knife Hands, Back Stances, etc. Heian Nidan and Shodan as in Shotokan was taught that way at one tme. However as all us Shotokan people know Nidan is much harder than Shodan. So Funakoshi switched them when he began to develope his own styale. Does the Pinan styles have a Kata like Kanku Dai which is a mix of all the Heian Kata put together?

Thanks everyone. I guess Im going to have to try them out for myself before I make the move on them. I love wood floors. Carpet is ok but I always got rug burns LOL.

Agreed Maestro My only point in any converstaion about art vs art is its not about fighting and winning. I think true MA is about the whole pic as I tried to point out. Fighting and MA are differant. Again I won't say BJJ or Thai turns out better fighters because that depends on the event and the street is differant. BJJ is great for one one one but in the streets you are lucky to get those odds. Again none of us are right but none of us are wrong either. I just like to point out that fighting in NOT MA. MA should be about not fighting by learing how to.

I see some belts changing colors LOL looks like you are taking this one to heart. LOL.

Yeah well I did not want to turn this into a art vs art post. Sorry MonkeyGirl. LOL However the point I was trying to make is just because some styles turn out more fighters than others that doen't mean it is the best style. I personally think the list was very good and here is why. To be a Martial Art. This is what the list was top 10 MA's. You must meet a few things. 1. Sparring 2. Kata 3. Basic Training 4. Self Defense skills 5. Weapons 6. Spirit or Mental Development some sort of Moral Code. 7. History 8. Guidlines for training 9. Use in Tournments 10. Personal Fitness IMO Kung Fu, Karate, and TKD are the only 3 that meet those 10 items. Now there is no question BJJ, Boxers and Thai turns out better fighters sooner however do they meet things like Kata, Guidlelines, and Weapons. So to go on with my point. Its about being complete not the best in one area or another. Take an art like Yoga that developes the spirt. Not many will take a Yoga class to get ready for a NHB event. Judo is not on the list because of its sport nature. Not a very good stand up art, no weapons and it is Same holds true for Sumo, Boxing, Kendo, etc. Again Kung Fu, Karate and TKD meet those 10. 1. You learn ot spar in all 3 2. You do Kata in all 3 3. Basic Training in all 3 4. Self Defense skills in all 3 5. Weapons from dojo to dojo but all have styles of karate, tkd or kung fu that include them 6. Spirit or Mental Development some sort of Moral Code. NO QUESTION 7. They all have a rich history 8. Many books by masters like Funakoshi tell us what and how to do things. 9. Use in Tournments as well as real life 10. Personal Fitness No question so take that for what its worth but that is why those 3 are at the top.

Does anyone have them in your dojo? If so how are they? Are the slick? Do they move alot? Are they hard to fit together? Reason I am asking I spoke to a guy today about opening up a dojo and hte floor of the building he has is concrete. Which as most of you know is murder on the joints. I have done it before but its just not a good mix. So I was looking at these puzzle mats in century and how they fitted together. They look pretty good but you can't tell until you are on them. So if anyone has any info or has trained on them let me know. Thanks.

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