JohnnyS

I'm not saying they won't work at all. What I am saying is that pressure points won't work on someone who knows what they are doing e.g. an experienced BJJer or world champion in anything. Oh, you forgot to mention these world champions that you have fought that will back up your claims of pressure points working. Pressure points *might* work when you're playing around with someone and they don't want to get hurt - but in a fight I don't believe so. Most of the times I've been hit in fights I've hardly felt anything - this includes being sucker-punched, elbowed in the face, headbutted etc. So I don't see how someone "touching" me is going to make me "fly right off" my opponent from the mount.

Regarding credentials, I've been training for 17 years, worked as a bouncer for 7 years and was in a whole bunch of fights myself. You say you'e fought world champions and BJJer's - Who have you fought and in what events ? Sorry, I still don't believe you regarding pressure points. I have no respect at all for Erle Montague, and little more for George Dillman - I can knock out people standing still too. As far as pain compliance - again it shouldn't be something someone should rely on. A friend of mine that I used to train with in Okinawan Goju-ryu had very high endorphin levels and wouldn't feel pain (he'd break a finger and not realise it for a couple of days), and so pressure points just didn't work on him. Again, I've had people try and dig their fingers into me to work pressure points and all it did was make it easier to finish them because they were concentrating on pressure points and not on escaping. So, what and where is the pressure point that I can activate from under the mount - I mean, why learn BJJ at all if I can do pressure points right ?

Davison wrote, "i disagree Johnnys,if i were on my back and a person were in the mount position on top of me,all it would take is for me touch a person in one spot(even if the attack was a front lapel choke or a series of strikes)and they would fly right off me,i know this from fighting a varity of different fighters,from stand up to ground fighting.pressure points are extremely effective but should not be used unless in combat situations." And I say rubbish ! Have you tried this on anyone (not from your school) ? Have you tried this on a BJJ fighter ? Better yet, since you are so confident, why don't you ask them to start punching you while you're mounted and see how effective your "touch" is. Oh, and how convenient that you can only use your deadly powers in a "combat situation". Saves you the trouble of actually proving it eh ? I've had a lot of different people try their pressure points on me while grappling, and as I said they are little more than a slight annoyance. Certainly not enough to make me stop punching someone in the head or finishing them. Let me put this in a nice way. Certain techniques will work in a class environment. For example, the instructor applies a technique to the student and the student, thinking his instructor infallible, thinks "ow" and taps. This technique will not work on the street against someone who is motivated, full of adrenaline and wants to hurt you. Nor will this work on someone who has high levels of endorphins and doesn't feel pain, or people used to being squashed and pinched i.e. a bjj or judoka.

Treebranch, Where do you get the idea that weaker, slower people can beat stronger, faster opponents who are as skilled as they are ? I think it must be an asian thing. There's this mythology that weak old men can defeat stronger, faster young men in their prime. Sorry, but this just doesn't happen. An old boxer is still going to be a formable opponent to the man on the street, but he's not going to be a match for a younger boxer in his prime. The same goes for "Combat" martial arts, and to believe otherwise is just wishful thinking.

Pressure points don't do anything - at least in a grappling situation. Techniques that rely on pain should not be relied on. You'd be better off spending your time learning proper escapes than thinking that grabbing my leg and squeezing will save you from my armbar.

I'm highly sceptical of this. I've had people try and do pressure points on me and it's little more than annoying. My instructor wrestled with Vince Morris, the British Shotokan karateka who is into pressure points in a big way and does seminars. He couldn't do anything against my instructor. Do not think you're going to defeat BJJ with pressure points.

How about Royce Gracie ? The Gracie's - thru Royce - have changed the way a lot of martial artists train. Martial arts schools wouldn't be offering grappling classes were it not for the Gracies.

TJS is correct. Technique and leverage are more important in BJJ than strength and speed.

Helio Gracie is 90 years old and still trains in BJJ and wrestles with younger students (I guess they're all going to be younger )

Find out who this guy's instructor is. You can usually check most instructors on bjj.org

MSPav wrote "The moves that were shown to me involved trapping your opponent's arm/hand/etc and often used both of your hands to grab one of his, which is not necessarily a big deal. " Are you talking about standing or on the ground ? Please specify what exactly you're trying to achieve and from what position. Using two hands on one is smart - especially on the ground. MSPav also wrote" There are a lot of moves that you might be shown in class that only work in class, because your designated assailant isn't doing everything they can to hit you, unlike they guy you fight when you really need the techniques to work. ... BJJ has a few takedowns that just seem to take too long to set up for my liking. " I find this statement to be totally untrue. All of the takedowns are based on what works - not what we'd like to think work. The takedowns are all based on getting in to the clinch and getting your opponent down without being hit.

Plus, most fights don't last long enough for fitness to come into play. If you're body is using adrenaline, then fitness won't come into play until 15-30 seconds into the fight, and in my experience most fights don't last that long.

The problem is that there is no definition of chi. So even if one group calls it body mechanics, they're being tainted by some hippies calling it "lifeforce" and other rot.

I don't believe in the tooth fairy and I don't believe in chi either. Even the people who do believe in chi have different definitions for it: correct breathing, correct use of posture, a life-force. No matter what you want to call it - it still cannot be proven to exist. If it could be proven in scientific tests, I'm sure that the Masters who possess it could earn themselves $100,000 from the Skeptics Society, as well as putting to rest the controversy over it. Yet they don't, which makes me highly dubious of it's existence.

Sorry, but I don't get the whole war veteran thing. What does fighting in a war with weapons, either in vietnam or in feudal Japan, have to do with unarmed combat ?

Karatefox, Are you saying that if Bruce Lee fought a larger opponent with the same skill he would have won ? Please give reasons why. Even he said he couldn't compete with someone like Muhammad Ali because of the size difference.

MSPav, I'm not sure what techniques you are referring to when you talk about both hands being required. As for reactionary moves, their is the foot-stomp to make him bring his front foot back and then the double leg which is an attacking move. There are also many other moves which are attacking and not just reactionary. Also, what do you mean the techniques require the opponent to hold still so we can complete our set-up ? Please give specific examples about these things.

There are a lot of moves you can do from here, but your best bet is to stay on top. The first thing you need to do is keep compact - don't stretch your arms out to grab him as he'll have more leverage than you if he's bigger and stronger. With your right hand push his head sideways to his right and get your head against the left side of his neck (this should be done as a quick move). Keep your spine straight and your arms in (like a T-Rex). By keeping his head sideways you severely limit his forward drive. Your right hand grabs his left pants near the knee, your left hand grabs his right elbow. Angle your body slightly so it's facing 45 degrees to his right. Drive forward keeping your head against his neck and pull slightly with your arms to take away his base and you should end up on top near side-control.

WC-Strayder, I've never talked trash about the other arts. I've said they have flaws (as all arts do)., but I also get sick of people saying "BJJ is no good because you don't want to be on the ground in the street" or "BJJ doesn't work against multiple opponents". Just an aside, Rick Spain, a William Cheung student, and former world full-contact kung-fu champion, now trains BJJ under my instructor John Will. Rick has John come and do seminars at his school, and also does privates every week with one of my long-term training partners, Anthony Lange. Rick says BJJ goes great with Wing Chun because of the sensitivity training you learn in WC helps in BJJ. Rick also intends on going to Brazil later this year for training and now has his WC class do BJJ twice a week. Rick has shown that smart people can see how BJJ can compliment their stand-up style and embrace it rather than dismiss it. I have nothing but the highest respect for Rick as a martial artist and as a person.

WC-Strayder, I'm not suggesting you stop training in WC and start doing BJJ. I couldn't care less. As far as what traditional arts offer I think you'll find that I've posted about how effective an art I though Okinawan Goju-Ryu was for the street. With regard to the Joe Sayah, I've read his biography on the internet where he claims to have fought in Cage events but can't find any other details. I still really doubt that he tried to enter and was knocked back because the Gracies thought he'd be too dangerous to them. Besides, the Gracies had nothing to do with managing after UFC 4 I believe. So it wouldn't have been their call. I have heard that the UFC get a lot of people offering to enter but refuse them - not because they believe they are too dangerous but because they don't believe these people could back it up in the ring. If this guy really wants to fight a Gracie, go to their Torrance Academy with a video camera and challenge them. I don't know why you're being so defensive. No-one here is saying that WC is not good for the street.

wcnavstar is correct. Royce won, case closed.

Treebranch wrote: "Historically Combat Martial Arts have proven themselves in the Battlefield and the streets, MMA hasn't. " Where's your proof of the effectiveness of Combat Martial Arts ? Oh, you mean anecdotes and legends ? 1ONEfighting is correct. MMA has a long tradition in Brazil of street effectiveness.

WC-Strayder, I don't think anyone is saying WC or any traditional art is ineffective. That would be silly. They do have flaws though, as do all arts. As to this guy not being allowed to fight in UFC, please give us a name to work with so we can try to verify or disprove his claims.

shotokanwarrior, the floor is the same as a boxing ring. It's just sprung wood covered by canvas. There is NO padding.

What arts were you doing for NHB ? Training for a fight can be very exhausting, and is harder than the fight itself. It can also sap your morale and make you wonder why you're doing what you do. I don't train to win medals, although I went through a stage like that. I also don't train anymore for the street. Now I just train BJJ because I enjoy the mental challenge. I love BJJ but I do know how you feel. Several times I've thought quite seriously about retiring from BJJ (and training in something like Kali) because of injuries. So I had some time off and thought there was no way I could not train BJJ. It's all I ever think about and all my friends train in Bjj also. The main thing is to have fun, because if you don't enjoy what you're doing then you won't continue to do it. Good luck with whatever your choice is.