bushido_man96

I hear you about the governing bodies. Any more, they seem like they've become a necessary evil, and so many of them are out there now.

Sounds like things are moving along quite nicely! It's great that you are able to get back into class, too. So good to hear.

I saw this mentioned on a Facebook group I'm in, and thought, what the hell? It's formatted to look like Choi's Encyclopedia of Taekwon-Do (accept it's paperback), and is titled as such, and named Volume 16, Supplemental. I've just gotten started reading it, so will pop back in later with some thoughts. It covers two forms that are "lost" to TKD; one is Ko-Dang, which was political casualty for the most part, and the other is called U-Nam, which is not one I'd heard of, and I don't recall that it was in the Encyclopedia volumes put out by Stuart Anslow (if I'm wrong here, I apologize, but I just don't recall it). Supposedly, the only version of it in print is text-only in one of Choi's original books, many of which I guess were destroyed. Anywho, I'm looking forward to reading it, and am interested in anyone else's thoughts on the book, if they have read it themselves.

3/8/2021 Strength Training Squats: 45x5, 135x5, 165x3, 190x1, 240x5, 240x5, 240x5. Press: 45x5x2, 65x5, 85x3, 120x5, 120x5, 120x5. Deadlifts: 135x5, 165x3, 190x1, 245x5. The squats didn't feel good today, but I didn't feel like I was shifting onto my toes, either, so I'll take that. MA Training TKD Class: 6:30 - 7:30 pm. Black Belt Class. Do-Kangs for warmup; 1 three times, and walked a student through 2 a couple of times, at count, so it wasn't overly stressing. After that, we went right into Ho Sin Sul, adding to our drills from last week. It is really getting fun, because the students are having to adjust on the fly at times, which is good for dealing with the chaos of a fight.

Welcome to KF, hunter!

We don't do any private lessons at our school. I've done private lessons in the past, upon request, but haven't in a long time.

I think there is much truth in this. Sometimes, things are similar in nature because it is most practical to be so. Thus, whether we are talking about Wrestling, Sambo, or Pankration, we end up seeing many similarities between styles born in different eras and different areas of the world. Don't you just hate dictionary definitions sometimes? I feel that, in the case of talking about the "legitimacy" of a style of MA, the dictionary definition falls short, and indeed, out of context with what many of us MAists refer to as "legitimacy" within the MA world. We don't really care what the law says; we care about different things like lineage, practicality, etc. I found similar problems with the actual dictionary definition of "Martial Art" when I was writing one of my articles. It was frustrating to me, but the definition basically only defined "Eastern" styles as "Martial Art." So, I think Oxford falls short from time to time.

I'm not sure which "style" that is, but even though it says it's a TKD association, I'd be willing to bet it's more rooted in Tang Soo Do. My style of TKD uses the Chang On forms, which don't match any Karate kata verbatim, but do have sections of the forms that are quite obviously taken from some Karate katas. But, that is just a guess on my part. Or they could have picked from here and there for their syllabus.

3/5/2021 Strength Training Squats: 45x5, 135x5, 165x3, 190x1, 235x5, 235x5, 235x5. Press: 45x5x2, 65x5, 85x3, 117.5x5, 117.5x5, 117.5x5. Deadlifts: 135x5, 165x3, 190x1, 240x5. Consistency is key! It is also time I reread Starting Strength, Basic Barbell Training, and then Practical Programming for Strength Training. I'm sure I've got quite a bit more time left in the novice linear progression here, but brushing up on lift technique and programming won't hurt.

Those are two books I've thought about picking up, but just haven't yet. I believe Nyumon has gone up in price, but will have to check. Rentan Goshin Toudi-Jutsu I am not familiar with; are you speaking of an art, or a book about it? Yes, you are correct in that many of the senior founders of TKD were Shotokan stylists initially, and have looked in that direction, as well. Well...there aren't many "TKD original" sources that contain much. However, many of the hand/arm techniques in TKD have similarities to those in many styles of Karate, so I start by sourcing things from there. Based on what you suggested in the first quote I listed above, I believe this is what I am doing. I have yet to find much that is reliable or helpful in regards to what Taekkyeon actually was. I have a copy of the Muye Dobo Tonji that contains drawings of what was called Su Bak, and have looked those over. The problem with Taekkyeon is that it got suppressed during the occupation, and I think it pretty much died out, and I'm not sure there are any good sources that exist. If you know of some in print form that are affordable, please let me know. What I also know about it is that it was primarily referred to as a game, but I imagine it could have been something similar to the way Capoeira is done. Yes, this is what it has been; considerable amounts of trial and error. I've come to the accept the idea that some of the sequences in the forms I do just might not have much to offer in the way of applications. But, a single technique, like a knife hand strike or a double knife hand block, has applications in itself. These are the sections of form that I focus on the most for working applications. As for the Chinese styles you mention, I don't have much exposure to them, nor do I have any literature on them. Agreed here, and I've long since taken this into consideration. There are still some instructors that I know that cling to the idea that TKD is solely an "ancient Korean art that is 5000 years old." The cat is out of the bag on this, and it's time to let it be. Thanks again for your time in responding. I am truly enjoying the conversation.

Everything happens in it's own time. It's easy to want to be great "right now," but how much better will be years from now? It's an interesting concept. Train hard, train often, and let what comes, come. However, I don't think this means to train without focus. Instead, I think it has more to do with letting the training bring you what it will, as you focus and work hard.

3/3/2021 Strength Training Squats: 45x5, 135x5, 165x3, 190x1, 230x5, 230x5, 230x5. Press: 45x5x2, 65x5, 85x3, 115x5, 115x5, 115x5. Deadlifts: 135x5, 165x4, 190x1, 235x5. Squats keep grinding. It felt like my right leg was doing most of the work on the first set. Second set wasn't bad, and third set was ok until the last two reps. Deadlifts went well. Grindy, but the bar stayed on my shins, which I was happy with. MA Training TKD Class: 6:30 - 7:30 pm. T-shirt class. Opened with some stretching, and did some work on the bag. Mostly kicking, working some different combinations. Last 15 minutes or so of class was spent sparring. It felt good. I wanted to try to spin more, but I'm not sure if I did so. However, taking that approach, I do think I moved my feet more, which helped out in it's own way.

I understand your angst in regards to the radiation treatment, Bob. Hopefully, as you mention, it isn't terribly frequent and doesn't interfere with things much. I'll be keeping you in my prayers.

I appreciate your thoughts, Wado Heretic. I've been searching for the pragmatic self-defense in our TKD forms, as well. It's a bit more difficult to flesh out at times, mainly because the forms I do are, in many instances, rearranged versions of some Karate kata. We have "sections," so to speak, of the forms that are reminiscent of Karate kata, and I look to some Karate sources in order to flesh things out.

Here is another one (it popped up today on the end of another vid ) with applications like I was suggesting I rather liked his applications. I liked the use of the "heaven hand" position, and will be keeping it in mind moving forward in classes.Hehe, I had to come back for an edit....Just running through the ready positions and first few moves of Kwang Gae hyung have brought out a way to drill those as applications! Good stuff!

Thank you, both of you! I'm really looking forward to this. It'll be something new and fun, and something we can do at our own pace.

SLK59, that is the trend I've seen at my school, as well (although not over as long a timespan). If we didn't run a kids program, I'm not sure where we'd be. We are fortunate in that we also have a gym with a solid membership, and that can help the TKD school, if need be. Bob, I understand what you are saying in regards to it being the CI's choice as to whether kids or adults are the focus. However, demographics aren't the same everywhere, and we just don't have a large adult population looking to study Martial Arts. Therefore, in order to do what's best for the school, we need to provide opportunities for kids, as well. Perhaps if I was in a more populated area, I'd notice a difference, but where I'm at now, kids are a big, important part of keeping our school open and alive.

3/1/2021 Strength Training Squats: 45x5, 135x5, 155x3, 185x1, 225x5, 225x5, 225x5. Press: 45x5x2, 65x5, 85x3, 112.5x5, 112.5x5, 112.5x5. Deadlifts: 135x5, 165x4, 185x1, 230x5. So, squats. First set, 2nd rep, I felt the weight shift forward onto my toes. This is not a good feeling, and is detrimental at heavier weights. That's how one ends up missing a rep. I also felt the weight push up my back; too much holding the bar in the hands, and not on the back. So, I shifted my hand position slightly, and when I got into the hole, I thought "on the heels." That shifted things back just enough stay balanced out of the hole and finish the drive up. I will be doing this going forward! MA Training TKD Class: 6:30 - 7:30 pm. Black Belt Class. Do-Kangs 1-3 (doing 3 twice); forms (watched students do Choong Moo, Kwang Gae, Poe Eun (did this one alongside him), and Gae Baek, and then performed Choong Jang once). While me and the CI did Choong Jang together, the others started on three-steps. After completing Choong Jang, we brought the class together and went into Ho Sin Sul again. We worked on the collar grab defenses. The first one is bringing the elbow over high and securing the arm, and then turning it into an arm lock, takedown, and hold. Then we switched it up; in this case, the elbow actually connects, and we then move to strike the grabbing arm and drive them down, following them going backwards from the strike, then finishing with straight arm locks after various manipulations. I also want to add a finish with a Juijitsu straight arm bar, but will need to work on getting this one in.

I'm glad you got that shot situation figured out! Sounds like you had a good nurse there.

Those are some great points, once again, Wado Heretic. In your experience, are you seeing more Karate instructors leaning into this "modern meaning" of "legitimacy," or are they staying more focused on "the three Ks" style of training that many were likely brought up with? Another question: how do you feel about the types of training that people like Iain Abernethy for Karate and Stuart Anslow for TKD are doing? When it comes to the approaches of these two individuals, and others that are taking on their approaches, seem to be focusing in on the self-defense aspect of the arts, and not as much on sport fighting like MMA.

I've always loved reading and researching the Filipino Arts, and learning to use the sticks has been a desire of mine for some time. So, even though I've got no school around, I've decided that I'm just going to try to learn from a YouTube channel, and see how I can do. I've even got a training partner lined up; my youngest son! I showed him a few videos of some single stick drills, and he's into it. I had the CI order a pair of sticks, and I anticipate being able to start this week. We are going to start off with single stick drills, and maybe drill for a half hour at a time when we can during the week. We'll spend some time in the Dojang when it's free, and with the weather getting nice, we'll probably spend some time training in the driveway, too. I'm really looking forward to this, and will keep everyone posted on how this experiment goes!

2/26/2021 Strength Training Squats: 45x5, 135x5, 165x3, 185x1, 220x5, 220x5, 220x5. Press: 45x5x2, 65x5, 85x3, 110x5, 110x5, 110x5. Deadlifts: 135x5, 165x3, 185x1, 225x5.

Believe me, I wish it wasn't so; I'd love to be in a class full of adult students, but I haven't seen one of those in ages. I think, generally, most adults just believe they don't have the time and can't make the time for a hobby like this of their own, especially if they have kids of their own that they run around all over hell's half-acre to their own events. I know that's what I do right now, and finding the time to squeeze in two classes per week is tough.

Interesting. Say joe next door decided to open a TKD school tomorrow. He teaches stuff he learned from playing as kim kaphwan from the SNK videogames and from watching youtube videos. He mostly teaches young kids and plays games and makes them break boards. Can he register with the kukkiwon and be officially recognized as a TKD school? that would be really bad, LOL No, it's not quite that simple. I think you still have to test to the equivalent of their black belts, and meet their requirements. It wouldn't be overly difficult for an ITF black belt to test and meet the requirements to get a black belt through the Kukkiwon. High ranks (black belt at least) in other Kwans (I'm guessing Kwans they recognize; Ji Do Kwan, Moo Duk Kwan, Chung Do Kwan) can apply to transfer their Kwan certification over to Kukkiwon. Someone from an independent organization, like me, would probably have to apply to test and learn the appropriate forms requirements, and then test (and pay the fees, of course).

This is very contradictory to me, as a Westerner, where we learn early on the value of hard work to move forward and upward in life. I don't think Lee himself could have believed in this verbatim, as it was well documented how much and how hard he worked at things. Eh, again, more I have some issues with. I know of plenty who gain and don't lose, and it is not always beneficial to follow other all the time.