TangSooGuy

true. I often have difficulty remembering which of the Japanese forms equate to the names we use in TSD..

I guess the real problem I have with this is how it was billed as being a documentary on the physics and science of the martial arts. There was about 10-15 minutes of that, and the rest was: Look here's Matt and his quest to become more "XTREME" so he can make a comeback and win the world championship again... and here's a few ads about the Last Samurai where Tom Cruise pretends he knoes all about the martial arts now because he trained for 8 months. Maybe I'm being overly critical. There were some good points made, and some of the weapons stuff was interesting and well done (aside from the spinning spikes - that was just bad...) I also would have been far more interested in following almost any of the martial artists they showed OTHER than Matt... they seemed to be more talented and have a better grasp of the fundamentals... There were a few things that did impress me, but they were few and far between. I maintain that there was about 15 minutes of useful footage, and the rest was flash...which is often trash with or without the fundamentals....

Just got promoted to 4th Dan in Tang Soo Do this year. Going on 19 years of training.

Yes, I think we are in agreement, and I can see now you would get that impression from what I wrote in the first post. What I was trying to get across is that if I was the one attacking, one of my instructors is enough better than me, personally, to still make the blocks work, even though I've been doing this almost 20 years. So, I guess what I'm trying to say is that even though I guess I have "veteran" status in my martial art at this point, I still don't want to have to deal with a fighter as good or better than me using tradiional blocks, because they do work,and they do hurt.

I agree with what a lot of others have said. There isn't anything wrong with the concept of honorary black belts, but this is a case of it being abused. I'm sorry but no one deserves an honorary 3rd Dan just for throwing money at the school (forgive me if I inferred wrong) Honorary black belts should be given to someone who either made an outstanding contribution to the arts (not talking about money), or has dedicated their lives to the art, but for some reason, physical impairment, mental impairment, outstanding outside circumstances, etc, they cannot test for black belt or pass the standard black belt test. I don't feel that honorary black belt should come with any authority, personally. It is an honor in the sense of: "A token of esteem paid to worth; a mark of respect; a ceremonial sign of consideration; as, he wore an honor on his breast; military honors; civil honors" Thus it is the person receiving the honorary black belt that is honored by receiving it, not the person themself who is honored by the giver.

I actually happen to disagree with this mentality, to a degree. Can I teach someone quickly to be able to defend themeself against the average schmoe? yes. Can teach them to be reaally proficient against a good fighter in a short time? No. A lot of the development has to do with timing, speed, etc. I could have the earliest beginner hurt someone with a block, but against a good fighter, they probably wouldn't have the chance to block. You need time to be able to learn the correct timing, and ability to add counters to your techniques. I won't guarantee anyone I'm going to make them into a great fighter within 6 months, and frankly, I don't want students who have that attitude. We're probably just misunderstanding one another, which is pretty common on message boards. If I attacked one of my 6-month students, they probably wouldn'tr hurt me with a block because most of them don't have the correct timing or accuracy yet. I'm not trying to sound egotistical, I'm just faster than they are, since I have close to 20 years of experience on them. Take two fighters of an equal skill level, and yes, the blocks will work as described, causing the pain which was mentioned. I hope I clarified my point a little, but I might just be talking in circles. Most students in the early phases of their development just don't get the idea that you nedd to be moving simultaneously with the attacker, that your block intercepts their attack at the point at which they are committed to, but not finished with, the attack, and that you are hitting them with at least one counter before their initial attack would ever have been finished. If you have 6 month students who are able to grasp that concept and execute it, I salute you. I seem to find guys who are too stiff to move quickly without hurting themselves. It's hard enough to get them to just loosen up in order to move fluidly, let alone get them thinking two or three moves ahead of where they are now (maybe I need to see if any of them play chess ). Some of them at 6 months have trouble just stringing two or three techniques together, let alone dealing with applying them. I guess overall my goal is to make my students proficient in dealing with anyone. The techiques they learn early on will help the defend themselves, no doubt about it, but a good fighter will still pick them apart until they learn more advanced concepts. I don't happen to think there is anything wrong with that. I'd rather end up with good black belts than just good fighters, and the last thing I want to is to develop someone's skills too quickly. All that does is makes them dangerous to themselves and others. I absolutely welcome opposing views. This is just mine.

Well, I'll hop on the bandwagon. I hate to sound like one of those bogus masters who says "our techniques are too dangerous..." However, using traditional martial arts blocks in the sense that i think most peope are talking about here really would be dangerous. many of them are designed to be limb destruction techniques, where the block actually is an attack. Now there is "soft" blocking, or defelction, or passing as well, and many of the same principals of traditional blocking can be applied to this idea, but i don't think that's what most people are saying. I guarantee that if I tried to attack some of the instructors I've had, and they blocked the technique "for real" using a traditional block, i wouldn't be continuing to attack them, because I'd be in too much pain.... Now chain a block together with a counter, or a series of counterattacks, and you can get particularly brutal. The problem does not lie within blocking, but in how most people practice blocking. I've seen blocks by black belts that are far too slow and lacking in power to stop any technique, let alone cause any pain/damage to the attacker. Another problem is that people tend to expect blocks to be useful immediately upon learning how to position their arms, and it just doesn't work that way.

Fair enough- I seem to have the same issue myself ....I hope I didn't come off as being too harsh. And I agree that color belts shouldn't be running independent programs on their own.

truthfully, it sounds like you're already prepared. the only advice i would give you is to goin with theidea thet you are ready to do whatever they ask of you. Often it is my experience that some testing panels will try to throw you a curve ball of sorts bu doing something different/ unexpected, so try not to have any expectations at all. Don't let anything surprise you. If they ask you to try to do something you've never done before, don't panic, just go in with the ok, I'll do it attitude. Any good testing panel won't ask you to do anything you're not capable of doing, even if you've never done it before. Just do the best that you can. After all, taht's really all they'll be able to ask of you. Give 100% mentally through the entire test, and always demonstrate the correct attitude. That's what you have the most control over. If the physical skills aren't there now, nothing you do in the next 3 weeks is really going to change anything. I'm not telling you no to practice hard. I'm just sayingyour mental outlook on this test may be more important than your physical condition. I my experience, and based onwhat you have said, your biggest challenge is going o be calming yourself down. I suggest doing some meditation and relaxation excercises for as long as it takes to get into a calm state. Some people need to get themselves psyched up for a test, but from your post,i'd say that isn't your problem. You need to make sure that you don't get so keyed up for this test that you burn yourself out early. I hope I'm making sense..I was kind of writing as things popped into my head, so I'm not sure how coherent this will be when reading it.

I'm not going to touch some of your post, but I kind of take offense to that. there are plenty of superb YMCA programs out there (plenty of bad ones, too, but plenty of really good ones). I started through what became a YMCA program. My instructor is now moving towards 6th Dan and has a commercial location, but he never would have been able to do that without starting at a Y first. I run a YMCA program, and was just recently promoted to 4th Dan. You can't judge any program based solely on where it is. That said, you have some valid points about color belt teaching classes, at least unsupervised, but I think that in some cases there may also be other extenuating circumstances, so I wouldn't say it is automatically a bad thing in every case. Example: I have known color belt adults that were extraordinary students and grasped meaning and application more quicly than some black belts I know. One of these in particular was a teacher as her occupation, so grasped some of the teaching fundamentals that other people don't understand until they've done it. i would have trusted her to teach things she knew to beginners.I think making broad generalizations can only get you into trouble, although I do understand where you are coming from.

Well, when I trained in college, it was only $40 a semester, but most instructors can't afford to take that kind of hit for their time. I would do it, but I would have to charge a minimum of $20 a month, just so it would pay for itself, an hopefully gnerate some interest and a student base. On an aside, my mother is a professor at Rowan... sorry, I don't know any BJJ instructors though.

well, to a degree i think that's true, but how she said it is what I found to be annoying. Also i fond a lot on there that I think is out and out wrong, but I'm not going to get into that. To be honest, we're being just as bad by pretending that: A. We've never had some of the same thoughts (even if we never voiced them or wrote them down) B. that we're not doing exactly the same thing she is by criticizing her in the same manner that she criticizes others. That said, I still disagre with a ton of what she said, and the way in which she said it just made me not want to read it any more. Really, it's akin to walking uo to someone and saying: Hi, I'm better than you are, I know I'm better than you are, so I'll discount whatever you say as ignorant drivel. It's possible to deconstruct her writings in such a way that she contradicts herself, too...which makes for some head scratching. Example: she says she doesn't care about rank, but makes every effort in pretty much every article to let us know that she has 4 black belts in 3 different systems, and did it in 12 years.... ahh forget it...I have too many other things going on to make a coherent post, so sorry if I end up contradicting myself in the same manner that i indicate she does....

Well, a lot of my problems here can be summed up by: "I don't believe in loyalty. The word implies that I owe something to someone. I believe in business transactions, in which I know what I'm buying beforehand. I fork over my money, and the businessman provides the product. When I cease to get product, I cease to pay for it." The "I don't owe anyone anything, but if I give them money, they owe me" mentality has no place in tghe martial arts. I'll admit that many instructors go too far and demand too much of students, but the fact of the matter is that I DO owe my instructor more than I'd ever be able to repay. And honestly, she seems to validate the idea that if you pay enough money, you deserve to get rank, or some secret teachings, or something. I've often told my students i can't teach them anything until they are first willing to empty their cups and be willing to learn. This woman's cup is so full i can't believe she can't feel the contents spilling out all over her....

Actually, i really can't believe no one has said it: Neo vs Morpheus in "The Matrix" Sure it was unrealistic, it was supposed to be. Sure neither one of them is a "real" martial artist: who cares? It was a truly awsome scene, and was absolutely loaded with great martial arts fighting philosophy, like: "Stop trying to hit me and hit me!" I actually have been asked by my own instructor, well before this movie was ever out: "How did I beat you? You are both much younger than me, and much faster." right after he thoroughly thrashed me. i never was convinced I was actually any faster than him, though. ..and i've heard "Again!" more times than I can count... I also thoroughly enjoyed Neo vs. Seraph in "The Matrix Reloaded" "You cannot truly know a man until you fight him", or something like that.

Well, I tend to agree with that statement, but I'll field it anyway, just hoping I don't write myself into too much trouble Not that it's really a secret or anything.... In The World tang Soo Do association, it works something like this: Master: To receive master status, you must be 4th dan or above, at must fulfill the following criteria: 1. You must own and operate your own studio. In order to have received studio status, you must have registered at least 25 students, and must keep both instructor and studio certification up to date. The ONLY exception to this would be for people who have made extraordinary contributions to the art and association, but for some reason cannot run their own studio. 2. You must be recommended by a current master, and be approved by the grandmaster. 3. You must submit a reseach paper/ thesis on a topic approved by the grandmaster consisting of at least 20,000 words. 4. You must have an exemplary record of attending various local, regional, and international events. 5. You must be a lifetime member of the Association (dedication, loyalty) 6. You must have actively trained for a minimum of about 12 years, and must be at least 22 years old. Note: This is EXTREMELY rare. I trained 17-18 years straight before being asked to test the first time, and the youngest promoted master I believe was 25. 6. You must pass a written test that encompasses knowledge of history, philosophy, teaching ability, technical knowledge, terminology, and first aid. 7. You must undergo (for 4th dan master) a MINIMUM three-year physical testing cycle: 1st Year: Initial evaluation, given areas to work on for following year 2nd Year: Test for 4th stripe on belt, must have shown substantial change from previous year. Not everyone will pass the 4th stripe test in 2 years. (This is far as non-studio owners can go) 3rd year: (or whenever you pass 4th stripe test): Studio owners may test for Master's belt Grandmaster status: "Grandmaster" is reserved fr the head of the association. Grandmaster Jae C. Shin trained directly under Grandmaster Hwang Kee, and has been an 8th Dan for well over 20 years. Although other Korean grandmasters have asked him to take 9th Dan, I don't personally think he will do it until there comes a point where someone else in our association is ready to test for 8th Dan. Right now, we only have a couple of people who have gotten as far as 7th or testing for 7th Dan. I don't write this in order to say my association is any better than anyone else's. I do it because all too often these days it seems like people are ready to dismiss the master title before even looking at what is required to get it. I will test for my master's belt in 2004, and yes, I have done everything listed above to get as far as I have. (I may even have missed smething). I'm certainly not saying that I am better than anyone else, nor that I have learned all there is to learn. Not by a long shot. But I will gratefully accept the title of master when it is bestowed upon me, and I know I will get there, because I'll keep going back to test as long as they want me to. Now, there are a ton of self-promoted and undeserving "masters" out there. But that doesn't mean there aren't genuine ones, too. They say that when you get your first degree black belt, you have only just gotten to the point where you are ready to start learning. In essence you have only just begun to learn how to learn. To me, when you get your master's belt, that means you have only truly just begun to learn how to teach.

The answer to both your questions depends entirely upon the instructor, the class itself, and whether it is right for you. that said, I know a lot of great martial artists who got started in college programs Heck, i met my wife at our college's Tang Soo Do classes....

Style: Tang Soo Do Forms i know: Ki Cho Hyung Il Bu Ki Cho Hyung E Bu Ki Cho Hyung Sam Bu Sae Kye Hyung Il Bu Sae Kye Hyung E Bu Sae Kye Hyung Sam Bu Pyung Ahn Cho Dan Pyung Ahn E Dan Pyung Ahn Sam Dan Pyung Ahn Sah Dan Pyung Ahn Oh Dan Bassai (Dai) Sip Soo Naihanchi Cho Dan Naihanchi E Dan Naihanchi Sam Dan Jin Do Rohai Kong Sang Koon Sei Shan Jion Weapons forms: Bong Hyung Il Bu (Staff) Bong Hyung E Bu (Staff) Bong Hyung Sam Bu (Staff) Dan Gum Hyung (Knife) Kicho Jang Gum Hyung (Basic Sword Form) Jang Gum Hyung (Advanced Sword Form) Jipangi Hyung (Cane Form)

Some tips, from watching my students: most beginners try to muscle the techniques too much, and they try to perform the locks from too far away from their partner. Keep the locks closer to your body, and as close to your center as possible. Move from your center, not your arms/ shoulders. Also pay close attention to yoir footwork. use the triangle concept- draw two lines in your mind from their bases points (feet) to create a triangle. the point of that triangle is where you want to point your hand andyourself to make the lock most effective. This is hard to explain without being able to demonstrate- hope it makes some sense. It really shouldn't take much pressure at all if you do everything correctly.

i sue a lot of different stance changes a shifts when i fight, but it depends on who i'm sparring, really. Most of the time I fight from a back stance, most of my weight on the back leg, and relatively low. I'll sometimes shift to a higher stance for mobility. Sometimes i even fight from a horse stance, even lower than my ususal stance. i find i can burst forward quickly from this stance, and also that i can spin faster into a spinning kick. Front stance is only generally used as a transitional stance- i shift into it sometimes when punching or using other hand techniques, but shift right back into a more guarded stance again after executing the technique.

You sweep the yard with a broom and end up practising Bo katas. -I've done that. You greet someone and say "Oss" and bow. -I have bowed to non-martial artists by mistake. You remove your shoes and bow before entering a building/room. -I've never taken my shoes off out of habit, but I have bowed entering and leaving rooms People ask you a simple question and you answer with a Zen-like riddle. -done that Someone shakes your hand and you can't resist putting them in a wristlock. -thought about it You don't walk in your sleep...you practise kata. -dreamt about it- does that count? You look at everything in your house and think how it could be used as a weapon. - I do that constantly

Generally, it's just practice, and practice with different partners. To start, apply a small amount of pressure, and increase it until they say "Ow" or tap out. That's usually a pretty good indicator. If your partner is hurting, and they don't tap out or sat anything, then part of it is their fault, really. At the same time, I advocate starting with less and building to more pressure. Eventually you just develop a feel for how much to apply based on how they respond. If they don't move, you're not applying enough. If they go crashing to the floor, too much. Talk with your partners. Ask them what they are feeling, and gauge it off of that. Eventually it becomes somewhat instinctual, but you have to be prepared to modify technique and pressure, since it varies from person to person how the lock affects them.

depends what TKD association you were with, but with 29 years straight of active training, I'd guess you could be as high as 6th or maybe 7th dan (7th would really be pushing it though) I was a 3rd dan myself for 9 years and just got promoted to 4th, so I have some idea of what it means to wait for the chance to be promoted, but you've been at the same rank for 13 years? It's good to see that you have the right attitude about it. I know a lot of people would get extremely frustrated by that.

if it is the same kick i'm think of, sometimes called a tornado kick or cyclone kick as well, it can be made to work as an effective technique, but i doubt that i personally would ever use it in a "real" situation. It adds to the artistic side of things, though. I've been looking into this kick for awhile know, and for me, i have found that it works best when bouncing off an attacker's roundhouse kick. the timing has to be just right, but i can now land the kick on target about 80-90% of the time now. Is it practical, though? probably not. There are a ton of techniquues i would choose to employ before this one, but it's fun to figure out the best application for you for all your techniques. it's also fun to make it work in a sparring situation. Just be prepared to be hit/ knocked down halfway through the kick the first few times you try it...

I test my students at my own studio, but generally bring in outside guest instructors to run the examination and sit on the panel. At black belt level in our association, everyone from a region comes together for a regional testing in a large group, currently held twice a year. testing for 4th dan and above is done once a year at a master's clinic and is not open to th epublic, while testings for ranks below 4th dan are all open to the public to watch.

A lot of the stuff you say is important to you is pretty common to all martial arts once you get to a certain level, so i agree that your best bet is to vist as many schools in your area as possible and ask questions, seeing which school you think fits you best. If you want to avoid tournaments, that may be one of the first things you need to ask about. Some schools (and even some organizations) base most of their training around competition, and some even require students to compete in tournaments. this is usually not indicative of whether or not a style on the whole isn't good for you, just that a particular school or organization might not be. If you really want sound advice on a direction to persue, ask yourself: Are you interested in a primarily striking/ kicking art, or a primarily grappling art? Are you interested in full contact, light contact, or no contact sparring? Are you more interested in a primarily external art, or a primarily internal art, or one that attempts to balance the two? How much are you willing to spend? -may limit your choices somewhat Are you intersted in formal training with set hierarchies, disciplines, etc, or a looser, more informal way of training? Do you want to train alongside kids, or have the opion to tran exclusively with adults? - again may limit youroptions, although most schools will have different class structures to choose from Do you want to do jumping/ flying techniques, or would you rather stay rooted to the ground? Are you interested in forms/hyungs/kata practice, or would you rather avoid this aspect? (Avoiding them is a mistake, in my opinion, but there are cases for the other side as well) Is who teaches the class important to you? In some larger schools, it will be more junior black belts teaching many of the classes, rather than the studio owner. Always meet the instructor you will be training with and watch them teach before signing up. When are you available to train? -another limiting factor on your choices in some cases. Answering some of these more specific questions may help you narrow which styles you want to choose from. If you are indifferent to these aspects, and just want an "effective" style, go visit every single school you can, until you find the one that suits you best.