sojobo

Newdesign - I agree entirely. The show completely misses the point - and is packed full of erroneous information and bunkum! Sojobo

My guess is that it will return, and Patrick will be prematurely grey. hehe, And I'm guessing with Cayuga-karate's rather verbose posts - it's gonna be a while. Sojobo

I'd say it shows what a complete martial artist he is. In the true sense of the word. Sojobo

Watered down infers a weaker version of something. I don't think they are watered down - I think they are something entirely different. I can’t speak for Shoto folk, but Wado - on a surface level - could be perceived as easy to learn, however it is very hard to master (trust me, I have being trying my best to do so for over a quarter of a century). The devil really is in the detail. I'd also say that out of all of the major styles - Wado is probably the least aesthetically pleasing. It is however very functional. However - all that said, Wado has become a victim of its own success in many ways and the end result is more bad schools than good imo. Sojobo

I'm going by the Budo way as I understand it. The dojo is the place to hone your martial skills. Competition is a great way to "realise" those skills. Full contact - no holds barred fighting for a purse? Well that’s where we take a step back on the anthropological ladder imo. Don't get me wrong - I really appreciate the ability to be able to fight - and I flatter myself to say that I can - I'd just choose not to if I could - no matter what the end goal was. Sojobo

It means "Wa" (as in Wado) Peace, harmony, to mitigate, completeness, the sum of etc., etc. There are lots of translations - but mostly it's a way, not a word. Sojobo

I think comparing Wado to UFC/MMA would have Otsuka Meijin turning in his grave. UFC is the antithesis of "和" Sojobo

Sometimes you shouldn't question - you should just do. Many "traditional" things in the dojo are nonsense tbh, but there are somthings that make a lot of sense. The problem is you have a few years under your belt before this bocomes apparent. Importantly - you have to look outside of your dojo to gauge what is tradition and what is rubish. That said - even the Koryu of ancient Japan aren't constant - not by a long chalk - so if they dont have tradition as such, who does and what is tradition. Sojobo

Wado Ryu or Wado Kai is a Japanese Style of Karate as opposed to a Okinawan style! It wasn't until Otsuka Sensei trained under Funakoshi Sensei, in Japan, did it become Karate as Otsuka Sensei was a Jujitsuka before this! Many believe that Wado is neither Karate nor Jujitsu but something in between! I am sure Sojobo-san will be able to elaborate on Wado and in fact correct any discrepancies I have written, OSU IMO Wado is definately Karate, however you are right in that it takes many of it's internal workings from Otuska's jujutsu knowledge. The Wadokai practice Wado-ryu btw, it is not a separate style. sojobo

I wouldn't get too hung up on it. Not only are you just starting out, but actually, people wrongly assume that if you practice a Kata based karate, you should utilise the process of Bunkai. However it tends to be something that is utilised more by Okinawan Karate styles like Goju ryu. In the most part, Japanese Karate styles do not (or at least did not) utilise the method in quite the same way, and in fact the word “Bunkai” has been adopted relatively recently by Japanese Karate groups. If your dojo is part of the Shindo Jinen Ryu, it’s interesting to note that prior to learning Karate with the likes of Funakoshi and Mabuni, its founder was schooled in traditional Japanese budo like Aikido, Kendo and even Takenouchi ryu (Koryu Jujustu). It therefore surprises me even less that Bunkai isn't a common word in your Dojo. Sojobo

Here's one version: Matsubayashi Ryu And here is another: Wado Ryu http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cbs-nJklcHo Sojobo

Ueshirokarate Ohgami details the Wado version as "Itosu" Rohai Shodan. I dont think that the Shito version is Shodan. Sojobo

Actually, when I was referring to the order that Kata was taught within Wado - it was up to and including Chinto (for which - as previously explained is not arbitrary). I see nothing wrong with your logic re Bassai and beyond as it were, but here is a little more info from the horse’s mouth: According to Ohgami sensei, when the “Technical System of Wado Ryu” was first registered at the Butukokai (Kyoto) in 1939 it listed the Pinan Kata, Kushanku, Naihanchi, Seishan and Chinto (1 to 9 in that order). The registration was revised at the Tojo Butukukai (between 1942 and 1945) to include; Wanshu, Bassai, Jitte, Jion, Niseishi, Rohai and Suparinpei. On Ohgami’s Website he actually shows them in this order, but I would need to confirm with him whether there was any significance attached to this, or whether it was simply the order in which he wrote it on his web site. http://www.wadokai.se/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=10&Itemid=10 So, why are they still taught in most Wado groups today – despite the fact that toward the end of his career Otsuka preferred not to teach them? As I understand it, there are two main reasons – the first was that because he had taught some of his earlier students (like Suzuki sensei) who travelled overseas – these guys continued to teach them, whereas Otsuka had stopped back in Japan. The second reason came about (I believe) as a result university Wado Karate teams in Japan who, under pressure when competing with their Shotokan rivals, decided to resurrect the erstwhile “discarded” kata. My sensei always says of Kata like Wanshu, that are good to learn, but they only really serve to re-enforce the "principles" found in the first 9. Sojobo

Except of course if the master of the style was already Menkyo Kaiden in a Japanese Koryu Bujutsu - who had a pretty good idea as to where he wanted to take "his" style of karate... That would be very "objective" I would have thought.? Sojobo

That one's easy - eventually - he didn't teach them! Wado was a continuous work in progress for Otsuka sensei and whilst Kata like Wanshu, Jion and Jitte etc., were recorded (at the budokukan) as part of the School's syllabus - truth is - he actually pared down the amount of kata he taught as his style developed. In what most westerners know as Otuska Wado time - he didn't teach anything beyond Chinto - insisting it was not necessary Sojobo

Cayuga, Schools and groups are free to teach kata in any order they want. I'm in my 4th decade of training Wado and I can assure you that there is a logic behind the sequence. You have to dig deeper than Google to find good info on Wado. The best place to start is a good instructor. Imo, there are too many "researchers" of karate these days and too few that have actually accumulated good dojo knowledge to have realised these things themselves- the ones that have, don't usually hang around these sort of places. On the subject of Kata order (from a Wado perspective) - you can have this on me Otsuka writes in his book "Wado Ryu Karate" (which demonstrates kata in the order; Pinan (x5), Kushanku, Naihanchi, Seishan and Chinto): - " Kushanku...This kata rotates the body forward, back, left and right, with both hands and feet. It is similar to Pin-an in that sense. Once one masters Pin-an, it would make sense to study this kata next." The next Kata featured in his book is Naihanchi of which he writes:- "From Naihanchi, one may progress to Seishan, and furthermore, to Chinto." Hope that gives you a little more actual detail (rather than google based stuff). Sojobo

I think any order of kata is, to some extent, arbitrary. The history appears pretty clear, that 100 years ago and earlier, a person might only 3, or at most 5 kata. The way in which we practice kata today, with so many, is a relatively recent innovation. In Wado - the order that Kata is learnt is far from arbitrary. For example... there is no harm learning Chinto before Seishan, and Seishan before Naihanchi - but... they are best "realised" by learning them in the correct order (from a Wado perspective) - Naihanchi then Seishan then Chinto. This is how it is/was in the Samurai Koryu Bujutsu schools also. Kata is an integral part of that pedagogy. @ Cayuka - there is no doubt that both Okinawan and mainland Japanese MA were hugely influenced by Chinese MA. However - perhaps the way that the Japanese (particularly the mainland Japanese) approach Kata is different to the Chinese. Sojobo

Wado Naihanchi, is mostly influenced by Motobu Choki. Motobu's karate didn't have a label so to speak - but the closest you are going to get to it is Shorin ryu. Shito-ryu - although based in Shorin-ryu is a style in itself. However... Wado is NOT an Okinawan Karate and doesn’t work the same way. It is closer to Japanese Kobujutsu - so trying to draw a parallel is a waste of time imo. [edit] Outside of research value. In Wado-ryu Naihanchi is practiced differently and for entirely different reasons. Sojobo

Interesting to note you study Wado-ryu. I have been training in Wado for over 25 years - and think I can count on the fingers of one hand, the number of folk who have cracked it. I certainly haven't Sojobo

Sensei8, This is a great essay on the subject of Shu Ha Ri. It's a bit lengthy but I think chiimes a chord here: http://classicbudoka.wordpress.com/2012/02/17/50-shu-ha-ri-the-markers-along-the-path/ Sojobo

What was it with the clothing you struggled with? sojobo

Nothing other than the Japanese grammar police being picky about the romanization of the Japanese language. When talking about a 'kick' the word 'keri' is used. When talking about a particular kind of kick (front/side etc), the word 'geri' is used. Same meaning different spelling and I believe is a result of the way words in Japanese can be pronounced differently dependent on the word that precedes them edit: and geri can be used in Japanese for diarrhea Barry, you can never pass up an opportunity to get a poo gag in - no matter how subtle. I am no grammar policeman - if I was I’d have picked you up on the use of "z" in Romanisation. And I'd never do that sojobo

To fortify you. To get your head and breathing in the right place. You breath out 30% of your breath as you Kiai. Difficult to explain - but it seems to work. On another level, it sets Uke and Tori up, on another level scares the crap out of your opponent. A bit like the the bag pipes of the Scots Guard I guess. My instructor has demonstrated the Kiai of some of the rarer Koryu and well... they are odd. They would certainly un-settle you. sojobo

Depends - in many Koryu (mine included) there is often kiai before engagement, as seen here after the intro: sojobo

Even better, if the end result is giving your opponent "geri". sojobo