bushido_man96

The "traditional" tag is, I think, a relatively recent descriptor attached to any MA style that originates in the far east. Another descriptor I've seen is "classical." I think it basically came into being in order for the "traditionalists" to differentiate what they taught from things like Boxing, MMA, and even new eclectic styles that started to come into being, like Kajukenbo and other styles of Kenpo that were modified in the U.S. I also believe the main idea behind this "traditionalism" is the ability to trace the lineage back to a certain founder, and that this had to have happened before 1900 (for Karate, at least). These are just thoughts on my end, not hard and fast rules. Just how I think these tags have been used for labeling the styles.

This is how I would prefer it be done, and how it was approached with me in the past. My current organization does things a little differently, though, granting instructor rank upon reaching third dan (and meeting age requirements).

2/17/2021 Strength Training Deadlifts: 135x5, 165x5, 205x5. Press: 45x5x2, 65x5, 85x3, 100x5, 100x5, 100x5. Squats: 45x5, 135x5, 185x3. I was planning on hitting all three; squats, press, deadlift, but someone was in the squat rack. Ah, the trials of working out in a commercial gym. MA Training TKD Class: 6:30 - 7:30 pm. T-shirt class. I spent about a half hour working Chon Ji hyung and some applications. I also spent a little time on Dan Gun, and also Choong Jang. Finished class working on three-step sparring, and generally grumbling about them and their practicality.

Agreed. The old adage, "a black belt is a white belt that never quit" rings true. Without the beginning, there is no journey.

I think this is spot on, and is a good hypothesis on why things change in styles. What and how you learn is all dependent on where you fall on the instructor's timeline. I think styles like TKD, especially the larger organizations, have actively worked to remove this phenomenon from training, in an attempt to standardize everything. I'm not so sure it is the way to go, but I do understand why.

Those are good points. I think it's incumbent upon the instructor to make sure students understand that it is a learning process, and to not worry about what others in the world may think. It's also incumbent upon the instructor to make sure that the white belts feel comfortable in the classes, impressing upon the intermediate and higher ranks the importance of treating the white belts in such a way.

2/12/2021 Strength Training Deadlifts: 135x5, 165x5, 195x5. Press: 45x5x2, 65x5, 85x3, 100x5, 100x5, 100x5.

These are interesting. In paragraph 6, I'm not sure what to make of it. I understand the idea of being like a cork on the waves, riding through the crests and the troughs. I find it interesting he chooses to address good and evil here. It seems, to me, he means to have an attitude of neutrality to it, but I'm not for sure. All I can think about is the saying, "evil thrives when good men do nothing." Paragraph 7 is also interesting. Embracing the disease to be rid of it. More confusing Zen stuff, to me.

2/10/2020 Strength Training Squats: 45x5, 135x5, 155x1, 185x5, 185x5, 185x5. Press: 45x5x2, 65x5, 85x3, 95x5, 95x5, 95x5. I felt very fatigued while squatting. I think I'm going to need to wake up a little sooner so I can eat something before going to the gym. MA Training TKD Class: 6:30 - 7:30 pm. T-shirt class. I did lots of round kick reps on the standing bag; front leg, back leg, stepping, turning, hopping, etc, single and repeat kicking. Then we spent about half an hour starting off with the Ho Sin Sul "sparring" and eventually working to scenario drills. We worked defenses from a collar grab, and then a collar grab and straight punch, and then a collar grab and hook or roundhouse punch. We found a series of defenses that start very much the same and finish very much the same, so good for retention. We also worked on some front choke defenses.

2/8/2020 Strength Training Finally back to lifting! Squats: 45x5, 135x5, 155x3, 155x3, 155x3. Press: 45x5x2, 65x5, 85x5, 85x5, 85x5. First lifting session post-covid. My legs felt very fatigued. Working night shift isn't helping either. MA Training TKD Class: 6:30 - 7:30 pm. Black Belt Class. Spent the entire class working on three-step sparring, spending a lot of time breaking things down and analyzing the various techniques, the set-ups, etc.

Geez, Bob, quite the day! I'm glad you came through it ok. I've had an MRI, and it was not fun. I'm claustrophobic, too, and they had to reschedule me for a bigger machine in order to get it done. Still, not fun. I hope and pray all your results come out well!

TKD, Hapkido, and even TSD's "origin stories" go back to the Japanese occupation of Korea, and afterwards, their desire to establish a national identity. A good book, titled A Killing Art by Alex Gillis does a good job of telling the story of Korean Martial Arts history.

I hope and pray everything goes well, Bob!

This may be the case, but timing is still an important factor in point sparring, along with rhythm, reaction time, etc. It is difficult to learn these things without someone or something to react to.

Thanks for the explanation. I like to see history time-lined out like that. For what it's worth, I tend to agree with you as far as Karate's development of high kicks.

Finally, back to class, post-covid. 2/3/2021 TKD Class: 6:30 - 7:30 pm. T-shirt class. Did some bag work, comprising mostly of basic kicks (front and back leg), spin kicks, and hand techniques. Toward the end of the class, the CI wanted to work on something he referred to as Ho Sin Sul sparring, which was a very controlled, randomized flow drill, I guess, working to locks or finishes. It's something we are going to work on and try to refine moving forward, to work into our black belt classes. 2/4/2021 TKD Testing: 6:00 - 7:30. We had 5 testing, one for recommended black belt rank, and one testing for 1st degree rank. Overall, there were some things that I was a little disappointed with this testing. I don't want to use Covid and the like as an excuse, but it has affected some of the student's attendance, which was apparent.

Welcome back to KF, advfhorn! Great post with great points!

I'm curious here as to when this exposure would have taken place?

Another great post, Wado Heretic!

I had not heard about spider style.

I had heard this as well. Wado Heretic: that was a fantastic post. If I could nominate a post of the year, that would be it. Very knowledgeable response with great information. I think to say that "Karate comes from Kung Fu" is a very blanket statement, and altogether untrue. Karate has been influenced by different styles over the years, like Kung Fu, to be sure. It is well known that those practitioners on Okinawa had contact with Chinese stylists, learned from them, and adapted to what they did. But to say that Karate comes from Kung Fu is to do a disservice as to what the Okinawan stylists also applied to the arts they studied and perpetuated.

Congrats, Himokiri Karate!

I think these two thoughts run together pretty well, and so am addressing both here. In paragraph 4, I think Lee is talking more about just seeing things as they are, without our personal biases jumping in. In paragraph 5, more of the same; not liking nor disliking. By not applying bias and jumping to conclusions, we can see things for what they truly are, and not what our judgement clouds them to be. Now, bearing all of Lee's thoughts in mind, I think it is well and good to "philosophy" about these things. But I don't believe it is entirely possible to approach every and all aspects of life in such a way, nor would it be practical to. I do think they are interesting ways to approach things, and are well worth putting into practice.

Agreed! It's cool to see your training update! Hopefully, things will be back to normal soon and training can resume!

I absolutely agree with your assessment of cross training. The time I've spent in my DT sessions, and even with my sons at Wrestling practice and tournaments have helped me to immensely understand groundfighting better.