Zaine

I am of the opinion that a lot of bunkai begins from someone grabbing you. Certainly not all, but for me, a lot of bunkai makes more sense if you are in a bind, whether wrist, neck, or otherwise. I am also of the opinion that a lot of the nukite techniques, such as the spear hand in Pinan Shodan, are grabs instead of strikes. It doesn't make a lot of sense to teach a beginner to do a nukite strike, but it does make sense for them to grab someone and throw them. Does it compare to traditional Shorin Ryu? I think so. I also think that the better question is: "Does the bunkai make sense?" And if the answer to that question is yes, then I think that the application is valid regardless of whether the move was interpreted that way by "traditional" karate.

They do. I have considered signing up for it, as it's only about 5 hours from my house if I ever wanted to train in person on a whim.

I ended up learning the Shobayashi versions of those 2 kata to fill it. Learning Yondan is definitely recommended, as it has a sequence that is from Kusanku in it. Godan is fun to do, though doesn't really feed into other katas as well as the others.

Your telling me. The closest one to me is a little under 5 hours away. I wish my old teacher would start teaching again, but we'll see. I've done a lot of research about MS and I am not aware of any specific reason that Soken did not include Pinan 3 - 5 within the curriculum. He certainly knew them from his time training with Shorinji, in which he held a high dan rank. My guess is that he only included the first 2 as training kata, and felt that the remaining 3 did not add enough to his system to warrant doing them over other choices.

If it were me, I would just explain that the version of Matsumura-Seito that I learned did not have the missing Pinans. It's likely that they are aware that their training is a little different. If not, then they do now. If nothing else, I would be excited to learn new kata. If you're worried that the school might dispute your rank based on not knowing a couple of kata, then that school isn't worth your time.

This is true, though some versions teach a version of Pinan Sandan now. This addition seems to have come from either Combat Shorinji, the other style that Hohan Soken taught, or was an addition from Kise or Arakaki. Since my lineage is through Kise, I am given to believe that it was his addition. In regards to the Kusanku kata, the version that I have seen performed, and that I myself perform, is a version of Kusanku Dai. Another note, there are some additions to the kata list given by Alexander here that aren't mentioned on his website. For instance, the Naihanchi kata that we do are done with a Hachiji Dachi stance, instead of a traditional horse. The Kise lineage does not do 3 versions of Rohai anymore. Finally, the Passai kata that are done are the Toyama Passai versions of the kata, and appear quite different from the Matsumura and Itosu lineage Passais.

This is the one that I got, though it's more than $11 from this seller. https://www.ebay.com/itm/266102510353?hash=item3df4f21311:g:CIEAAOSw4wZeKkK0&amdata=enc%3AAQAHAAAAsG2JjPQeP7l7JwlzkXTavXMpaxWEB8htYaukoUkSR0WwkhjIWmJX2epkRbJ7AqrVRldI0K%2BABnVV4O4nzpbbNgcqW1%2FaPKExG0h3WGqa75rdispMTXWpEB%2F7Kii3CJgh4vUFj15tdvhkMknCmEgfefpDbcrcns3e5BKb9yp12eG4zHCPOap3ONs4NnTuJ%2BCqewKnwFpVk%2Bo%2FUoxUsRGCGDASec6xvh%2F78Kdmap6OATfK%7Ctkp%3ABk9SR87t0fnGYQ

As a counter question to this, if you are worried about your own rank in correlation to your ability to promote a student above Brown Belt, do you feel that you will be unable to achieve Nidan or even Sandan in the time that it will take for you to get a student on the precipice of Shodan?

This is a good question, and will likely have multiple correct answers. I'll give what I think should be done, and then what I did. For me, if there is still material to learn (as there often is after Shodan), the black belts should be largely training at their dojos. I have found that it is common for material to exist up to San or Yondan, and afterwards the promotions are based on what the student brings to the school (i.e. their teaching, new techniques, new ways of using old techniques, etc.). In this, black belts are certainly left largely to their own devices in that they need less attention (or should need less attention). Holding a black belt class once a week to continue their training should be enough. Shodans will need a little more guidance as they transition to less attention paid towards them going forward, but after a month or 2 I would expect them to be largely practicing in the same way as a Sandan. After you learn the material left, it is my opinion that you should be going to other schools and learning new styles to both enhance your own understanding and contribute to whatever base style you wish to practice. Learning a Korean or Chinese style after a Japanese or Okinawan one is extremely beneficial. For me, my teacher stopped teaching shortly after I got my Shodan, so I was on my own. There was more to learn (like... a lot more) that I no longer had, or have, for that matter, access to. I dived into other styles. I did kung fu for awhile, then moved on to HEMA, and most recently a different style of Shorin Ryu. I made my journey post-black belt my own. It was tough without a guide, and I'm still just a Shodan, but I have enjoyed it nonetheless.

Congrats!

It would be interesting to see some modern modifications, and maybe I can look into that as I meditate more on the daga plays. Half-swording, I feel, is the secret to Fiore's sauce, in a lot of ways. It has obvious benefits when it comes to armored combat, but it also allows the combatant to have more more strength in the bind. Whenever I spar, I find that I have a tendency (sometimes good, sometimes bad), to focus on the plays that go to half-sword over the long distance (Zogho Largo) plays.

I remember my first sparring session that was daga vs daga. It was against my mother, who has done martial arts with me since I started in 2002. We suited up in our gambesons, but on our gorgets, helmets, and gloves, and had 3 minutes of the most fun we have ever had sparring one another. I also wasn't much like the plays within the manuscript, but it was a lot of fun. We circled each other carefully before attacking, calling a point for whomever scored, and then the same thing over again. We had the benefit of over a decade of karate practice at the time, and this allowed us to augment the movements with the muscle memory we already had in a way that sword play did not allow. Needless to say, daga is one of my favorite tools to use in Fiore's arsenal. Before I get too much further, I should clarify what a daga is. Unlike the the modern ideas of a dagger, this is a Rondel Dagger. The rondel is a small cylinder of steel that comes to a point at the end. The hilts were just big enough to fit into a hand, with two circles larger in circumference than the knife itself. It had no edge, and was used exclusively for stabbing. Fiore, and other Medieval fighting masters, were concerned largely with the rondel because that was the type of dagger carried by knights. A modern dagger would be no use against full plate, and so the rondel came about due to it's ability to punch through the gaps in a plate or, if your were unbelievably strong, straight through the plate itself. Because these manuscripts were made for the upper classes, they were concerned with the type of weaponry that an upperclassman would carry. I have found that when I talk about daga plays to other Eastern Martial Artists, it tends to translate fairly easily into what we already understand. The plays start with the master unarmed against an attack from a daga. It is mostly concerned with getting either your body, or the daga, off-line from the attack and then disarming. Since the daga is a purely stabbing instrument, there is no worry about slashing and meeting it is a little safer (though it's still a dangerous instrument). A lot of the techniques are very familiar to those with even the barest grappling training. A Judoka would be right at home reading a lot of this. It isn't until the 6th master that we get daga vs daga plays. This section is shorter, and is only a few plays long before the master begins talking about unarmed vs daga plays again. These largely deal with, again, disarming the opponent and then striking afterwards. Oddly, many of the plays have the master gripping the hilt and top of the daga itself in the beginning. This is to create a greater stability when knocking the attacking daga aside. These caused me the most problems, I found, because it is not my instinct to shorten the blade in this way. However, since there is no edge, these techniques are logical in their construction. The final plays are daga vs. sword. This section emphasizes the importance of quickly closing the gap. Fiore notes that "you'll have a significant advantage if you know how to do these [plays]." I tend to disagree, as the require very precise timing. In the past, I have been whacked practicing these more than I have been successful. However, success with closing the distance is the correct way to go, and when I was successful with the play, it took away all options with the sword.

When you're a school teacher, you have to attend something called in-service every year. It's a set of meetings designed to refresh you on things like proper pedagogy and new techniques to use in the classroom. You are also encouraged to spend some time during the Summer going to conferences or attending online courses to further your education on teaching. The idea here is that teaching is difficult and a good teacher is always seeking ways to improve upon themselves. I think instructors should be doing the same. Seeking out those classes, provided that they are quality (obviously, teaching conferences fall under some regulations that require data backed research and Martial Arts has no such thing), should be something that instructors do. I am sure that there are plenty of online courses. If you're worried about quality, and I think that's a more-than-fair concern to have, then I suggest checking out some regular teaching online courses. I apply a lot of what I learned as a teacher to my dojo and it works really well, especially for children. The research for classroom teaching is out there and we have access to it. Just because we aren't teaching math or English doesn't mean that we can't use the techniques therein.

It is! It's $10 for the ebook on Amazon, or currently $25 for the paperback. Honestly, you could easily fill a small bookshelf with all of supplementary, quality writing on just Fiore alone. https://www.amazon.com/Medieval-Manuscript-Modern-Practice-Techniques/dp/9527157552/ref=sr_1_2?crid=1FDGAMS1IT269&keywords=guy+windsor&qid=1675695092&sprefix=guy+windso%2Caps%2C114&sr=8-2

He is the go-to guy for Fiore stuff. He's huge in the HEMA world in general and has several books out. I am reading From Medieval Manuscript to Modern Practice as a companion to Il Flor di Battaglia and it has given me some helpful insights into Fiore's approach, and how to approach manuscripts like this in general.

I've recently been reading Zen in the Martial Arts which covers a lot of Bruce's teachings. The concept of an Artless Art seems to go along with his ideas about Zen in general. Being present in the moment, changing shape to match the current, letting go of labels and just existing, these are all things that Bruce taught to his students. Hyams, the author of the book, speaks a lot about achieving understanding of life via his lessons in dojos/dojangs/kwoons. A number of these lessons come from when Hyams was training with Bruce and I'd be willing to bet that Bruce wanted to apply his understanding of Zen to this system he created as well.

Welcome back! I'm glad to see that life has been going well for you!

Most people use them to put murals in. You can put anything you want and it's just a subtle bit of flair for a gi jacket. I'm just weird so I immediately wondered about putting a face in.

Sounds like a clear lack of pedagogical standards. Something that I have noticed is that a lot of Martial Arts gyms lack pedagogy. The teacher is good at karate, and even good at teaching, but they lack the pedagogical foundation that helps students learn. There is a reason we don't start teaching kids algebra in Kindergarten. They have to learn the foundational skills first. The same is true for karate. It doesn't help a kid to start with a reap if there is an easier technique that will build up to it. You have to scaffold skills.

Agreed, this is hard to parse out. As humans, we love to categorize things. In the end, I liken it to the Buddhist idea of desiring to have no desire. Bruce Lee wanted the Martial Art to simply be. He wanted it to exist only in the moments of itself. He likely knew that we would categorize it, and he himself categorized it. However, having the opportunity to let it just exist was a dream of his nonetheless.

Guy Windsor has a video (I think) for every play within the book. If something ever seems to abstract, he's a great resource. The video series is a part of his "Fiore Translation Project" and I have found that it to be incredibly helpful for when I get to the remedy and counter-remedy sections. The pictures are helpful, but there are some errors within them in some part. Having the video representation is super helpful.

That's still awesome, Brian! Any amount of karate practice is a great amount of karate practice!

It would certainly be a good distraction tool during sparring. I can just imagine people asking after a fight "Is that... your face in your gi?"

I disagree. There is a right answer. You see, you can now get gis with a print on the inside of the jacket. Which means that you can get your face printed on the inside of your gi jacket. This is the correct option.

It has been my experience that the biggest proponents for your dojo are women who feel safe within the walls of said dojo. To echo Scohen here, creating a safe space for your students, running Women's Self Defense classes, making people feel welcome... these things are the biggest pluses to get others to advertise for you.