Kiai Differences

[Zaine]

I've recently been watching a lot of kata video from various competitions. Something that I have noticed is the difference of length of the kiai in Okinawan/Japanese martial arts (Shotokan, Goju Ryu, etc.) and Korean martial arts (TKD, Tang Soo Do, etc.). Okinawan/Japanese styles tend to draw out their kiai, whereas Korean styles keep it short. For the Okinawan/Japanese styles, I can attest to being taught to draw it out a little. My sensei preferred deep, guttural kiai that came from the diaphragm. The Korean poomsae I have seen seem to prefer short kiai from the throat. Can anyone help fill in my lack of knowledge?

[Montana]

What I've seen over the last 45 years is a longer, more aggressive "tournament kiai"..one aimed at intimidating, impressing or "SEE ME" type of kiai.

There are 3 purposed of a kiai:

1. Startle your opponent.

2. Tighten your body to absorb impact.

3. Add strength to your technique.

IMO, these long Kiai, especially at the beginning of a kata, are ridiculous!

[bushido_man96]

I agree with Montana. I try to bring my kihaps from the gut, and tend to keep them short.

Watching Olympic TKD sparring is a burden for me. Too much yelling, and none of it is from the gut. It's just a kihap per technique, which is not the point.

In our classes, we kihap often in basics. I find that the more frequent we kihap, the less likely I am to find it from the gut each time. For our black belt three-steps, the GM wanted us to kihap on each frickin' technique, including the blocks. And I hate it. It's just too much.

[sensei8]

We kiai only during Kata. Yes, we understand the importance of the kiai and all that. We'd kiai away from the kiai as the time was called from whomever felt it necessary from time to time, which usually was whenever a student wanted to express themselves during kumite.

Many tournaments' open kata divisions with the long drawn out kiai makes me cringe no matter its reason(s).

[Spartacus Maximus]

There isn’t anything complicated about the concept of kiai in Japanese/Okinawan martial arts. This is one of those things where knowing/understanding the Japanese terminology. Ki=breath, ai=to gather or to bring together.

So a kiai is not ever one of those ridiculous over drawn out screams. It’s a short sound that comes from the diaphragm. It isn’t even a thing specific to martial arts. In Japanese people refer to it all the time when describing the sound one makes when exerting a burst of physical effort such as when pushing or lifting a heavy object.

Try and observe people doing this kind of action and it is everywhere. Batters in baseball do it, tennis players or any job where one needs to put maximum effort and power. Imagine lifting a heavy box off the floor or better still hammering in a large fencepost with a sledgehammer.

All those often are done with some sort of sound with the effort. That is kiai and people do this without even thinking about it. The Japanese just have a name for it, but it doesn’t mean that it doesn’t exist across all human cultures.

One of the primary functions seldom mentioned is that it trains the body to breathe through properly while exerting effort. It teaches the karate adept to synchronize their breathing with their movements and avoiding gassing out.

Compare as an experiment doing a series of movements without breathing out as you move to the same with maximum effort, coordinated breathing AND kiai. There is a clear difference as to which is more energy efficient and naturally comfortable.

[Nidan Melbourne]

To me a Kiai has different purposes; from 'Drawing Attention your way' to 'I'm going to rip your face off' 

At the same time it doesn't necessarily have to be a "shout" but more talking louder. So if I was to draw attention a situation or make something clearly known i'd be saying "Stop" with an increased volume but also being firm. Which draws attention your way. 

Then that initial strike where you hit them like your life depended on it; you'd do a kiai basically saying "i'm going to rip your face off if you keep going". 

[bushido_man96]

On 9/4/2024 at 7:07 AM, Spartacus Maximus said:

There isn’t anything complicated about the concept of kiai in Japanese/Okinawan martial arts. This is one of those things where knowing/understanding the Japanese terminology. Ki=breath, ai=to gather or to bring together.

So a kiai is not ever one of those ridiculous over drawn out screams. It’s a short sound that comes from the diaphragm. It isn’t even a thing specific to martial arts. In Japanese people refer to it all the time when describing the sound one makes when exerting a burst of physical effort such as when pushing or lifting a heavy object.

Try and observe people doing this kind of action and it is everywhere. Batters in baseball do it, tennis players or any job where one needs to put maximum effort and power. Imagine lifting a heavy box off the floor or better still hammering in a large fencepost with a sledgehammer.

All those often are done with some sort of sound with the effort. That is kiai and people do this without even thinking about it. The Japanese just have a name for it, but it doesn’t mean that it doesn’t exist across all human cultures.

One of the primary functions seldom mentioned is that it trains the body to breathe through properly while exerting effort. It teaches the karate adept to synchronize their breathing with their movements and avoiding gassing out.

Compare as an experiment doing a series of movements without breathing out as you move to the same with maximum effort, coordinated breathing AND kiai. There is a clear difference as to which is more energy efficient and naturally comfortable.

This is so true, thanks for pointing it out and expressing it so well.

[sensei8]

Perhaps, even though a CI might train their students in one particular way, kiai's are as different as the practitioner, no matter how the kiai is taught. Short or mid-range or drawn out, they've, their purposes; real life or competition. 

[aurik]

In both of the arts we teach, Uechi-Ryu and Matayoshi Kobudo, kiais are usually short and from the gut.  Each of our katas usually has a couple moves in which you are expected to do a kiai, usually 2-3 per kata.  Additionally, when performing hojo undo techniques in Matayoshi Kobudo, we are expected to kiai on the last technique of a set. For example, if you are doing a set of 3 techniques forwards and backwards you would kiai on the third and sixth technique.  Every so often our CI will discuss the different philosophies/reasonings behind the kiai -- it can be used to focus your energy at the kime point of the technique, or it can be used before delivering the technique to distract your opponent.  I don't think he's ever really corrected students on which way he prefers.

 

What's really funny is the kids and beginners when told to kiai will often shout "KIAI!".  Our CI sometimes tells them that what they're doing is essentially yelling "YELL!".

 

Edited Friday at 02:46 PM by aurik

[sensei8]

Quote

What's really funny is the kids and beginners when told to kiai will often shout "KIAI!".

Matter of fact, we teach the ALL beginners to say KIAI when teaching them the Kiai. We do that because we want them to utter something, and uttering "KIAI" is far better than having them say absolutely nothing. A lot of times uttering "KIAI" lessens the shyness of many beginners. I get a chuckle from whenever a beginner is moving their mouth to the word "KIAI" but nothings coming out, as I'm walking behind them.