bushido_man96

Thanks for the photos, Tony. They help me understand a lot better. First off, after seeing your pics of the piercing kick, I'll admit that I have never done it before. To bring the knee up from the outside like that just seems very foreign to me, for a side kick. I would do that with an inside crescent kick, but not with a side kick. At least not yet. It does seem like a very odd motion. For the thrusting kick, the way I practice that now is much the same as you show, only I take the chambered leg up to that angle, which I feel keeps it tighter to my body, giving me more of a thrust, and a less big, swinging movement. We do get that initial hip twist in prior to chamber by virtue of a reverse punch in a front stance done prior to the kick. Now, I would be interested in the front leg versions of these kicks. With the thrusting kick off the front leg, would you still pick it up like a front kick chamber, and then use the pivoting motion? What about the piercing kick?

Tony, have you read Alex Gillis' book A Killing Art? It is a very informative read on the politics that made TKD what it is today.

I agree here, and this is a major component of Combat Hapkido. Seperate the mind from the body, etc. And if you get in a good strike first, they just might let go.

I've wondered the same thing myself, especially in my training time in Combat Hapkido, and now Aikido. What I have found is that it is a starting point, a training tool. The wrist grab allows the defender to see how to get to the points needed to manipulate the hand or arm into a lock, or for a takedown. The rank that I am currently at in Combat Hapkido, there are no "wrist grab attacks" in the curriculum; it is all lapel grabsl, shoulder grabs, etc. However, the mechanics and such that I have learned from the wrist grabs early on keep popping up in the techniques I do in the higher ranks. Early on, one attacked with a wrist grab, the defender will often do a re-grab, in which the defender gains control of the attacker's wrist. This re-grab leads into the techniques that are done later on, which may start out as just seizing the attackers wrist when he grabs your shoulder, lapel, etc. I also agree with tallgeese on the weapon control bit. Very important there. Another important aspect of such techniques is not to dally when you get them going. Get it done, and fast, before they get too much time to resist. The crash points during conflict is also a good point. Hockheim talks about them, calling them "sticking points" in a fight; at times, you may get hold of a wrist. Then, you know what to do.

I'm not trying to pick on Bob here, but his post brings up a good point, and I'd like to expand on it a bit. I think a lot of people get to feeling this way; all the MMA fights are the same. Well, when you get into any venue, don't they all start to "look the same?" Doesn't one Karate point fight begin to look like the other? Or TKD matches? Boxing? Muay Thai? Wrestling? Sure, every fighter has his own "style" that he brings to the table, but in the end, things begin to shake out and look very similar. So, why this beef with MMA? The others don't get by with it either, not in my book. Edit: I just now read Alex's post. Good thoughts, too, Alex. I had not read your post prior to this. Looks like we were thinking along some of the same lines, at least.

Thanks for clarifying. I figured you meant something more along those lines, and I wouldn't describe it as "mean." I think that would just be good training.

Pretty cool on the unicycle, JusticeZero. I'll bet that's a bit of work. 7-2-09 Weights Seated row: 115x15x2 Seated chest: 150x15x2 Lat pull-down: 102x15x2 Shoulder press: 84x15 Barbell curls: 55x15 Triceps press: 139x15 Gripper: 25x15x3 MA session Combat Hapkido: 8:45 - 9:45. Today, we did our red belt material, but worked on finishing with takedowns and pins, holds, locks, etc. We learned a little, and this was definitely missing from our previous sessions. We shall do more of this. Prior to the session, we watched about 30 minutes of video on MA stuff.

Hehe, thanks Bob. Sometimes, I think I get too tongue tied, as well.

I agree with you here, Patrick. These are actually two very common sayings that float around the MAs: "rank doesn't matter," and "kids shouldn't be black belts." And often these two sentiments come from the same mouths. I think that by saying you are a "mean" teacher, you likely are saying that you are a strict teacher. But if you say "mean," I conjure up lots of different possibilites that a teacher could be, ranging from cruel activities to outright illegal ones. I don't think this is the case with you, but the word "mean" does lend itself to various connotations. With that said, does one have to be "mean" or, for perhaps a term more conducive to the subject at hand, "old school" to be a good teacher? I don't think so. I do think that adherence to a nostalgia (percieved or otherwise) in the passing on of Martial knowledge is a major thing in MA learning and instruction. But, I don't think it is one that is necessary. Everyone has different approaches. New methods of training can be just as effective as older training methods, as can new attitudes and approaches.

That was pretty cool to watch. I wish home improvement went like that around my house.

I agree. But instead of one person pushing the MMA movement, it is coming from many different sources.

Lifting the leg like a front kick would prevent the full hip rotation for a piercing kick, so if it's not a thrusting kick either, then I guess it slips in between the two. My belief is that that means it's probably not maximising power... I may not have been clear here on my motions. I start the motion like a front kick, bringing the chamber up in front of my body, but then, I pivot on my base leg, and shift my body into the sideways position, and try to then point the heel into the direction of the kick. So, instead of doing a large circling motion with a chambered leg, it goes straight forward, and then I turn my hips to the side. If you could imagine doing a knee strike with the back (right) leg, I would be doing this knee strike at almost a 45 degree angle to my left; from there I turn over the hips to get into side kick position. Does that make sense?

This is true, and I have noticed differences like this in my TKD practice. In reading the encyclopedia and books by Cho, I notice differences between the forms they did, and the ones that I do now, even though they are the "same" forms.

I think that this is the big miss here. No one on the street is going to pull a punch, and when your classmate gets attacked, and doesn't realize what it takes to stop a committed blow, thats when MAists start wondering "why it didn't work right."

I don't know if you'll see very many careers in MMA that last 15 years. I don't think you can compare the longevity of MMAers to Boxers. Guys like Couture are going to be the exception rather than the rule, and as the competition keeps getting better and better, the ability to stay on top for prolonged periods of time will lessen more and more. I don't think that this is alltogether fair to assume. Not every movie guy MAist is a nice guy, and you can't know if sportsmen MAist have any personal philosophies without asking them. You might be surprised.

I disagree. MMA is a style all its own. The way training is conducted in an MMA gym isn't too much different than it is done in a Boxing gym, and Boxing is its own style. I do think that learning a style or styles is a good supplement to MMA training, but in the end, it is its own animal. I agree with you here. I do think that with the seeing MMA rise in popularity, we are witnessing the evolution of a style in our own time.

My feelings on child black belts has changed over time. It will depend a lot on what the curriculum of the school is. In our school, kids and adults follow the same curriculum, so if both are doing the same, then why should there be a difference in how they are promoted or ranked? At this point in this discussion, I like to introduce the arts that don't use a ranking system: Wrestling, Jeet Kune Do, Muay Thai, Boxing. The practitioners of these styles don't have to worry about this. They show up, they practice, and their skill level is recognized by everyone in the gym, whatever it may be. Limits aren't put on what is taught, just on what they might be able to retain, depending on their skill level. As far as schools being "crap," that is going to depend on what you expect out of an MA school. Some schools may be curriculum based, and others may be sport focused, and some may be self-defense based. So, each one will likely have different results. And not all students are created equal, either. So, do you base levels off of independent improvement, or compare to other students? Lots of questions to answer, and none of the answers seem simple.

Not too strange, really. Some magazine did a pole one time, asking what people's number one fear was. #1 was public speaking. #2 was dying. People would rather die than get up and speak in public! So, it isn't really all that odd to be a bit jittery about something like that. Most of us MAists will step inbetween some big dudes fighting to break it up, or stare down someone trying to intimidate us, or stand and face a drunk wanting to attack us or our family.... .....but if a wasp comes flying by, I do that slapping-the-air-and-skipping-away jig....

Welcome to the Forums, Dave.

RIP

I agree as well. I think it is important that respect recipricates. There is a difference between earning and demanding respect, and earning it is far better, in the long run.

6-30-09 Helped a student with some hip rotation issues today, and also got to do the first orientation for 2 new students. Its always kind of fun to get some fresh minds in there. I worked with them on a few stances, walking in stance, and then adding in some techniques.

7-1-09 Combat Hapkido: 8:00 - 9:00. Worked on more trapping drills today. While we were warming up, we were moving from one trapping drill into another, and we stayed really smooth. The pracitice is paying off.

Ah, well, that adds to the confusion for me a bit. I think I'll just call it side kick. Its easier that way.

Thanks for sharing, Bob.