MartialArthur

It really depends on the demographics of the area and the nature of the competitor. If he is pretty full and happy with his business, he is not likely to ad programs he doesn't want just to foil you. If he is very packed, it may be an indicator that the area is under-served by MA schools. It is certainly a risk, though. If he thinks you may affect his business, and he has decent cash flow, he may try to "bury you" with a lot of extra marketing and PR. It's a tough call. Without studying the area and all the competitors, it's tough to offer reliable advice.

Actually, he said "gov body" which could have two very different meanings: Governing body (i.e. an org) - fine, i think there are already some good ones. Government body - No Way! I agree with patusai on this. The government doesn't do very many things well. Like most government agencies, we would be talking burdensome regulations, too much administration, and high fees (or taxes). No thanks!

The most important rank to me is the one I am trying to achieve, not the ones I already earned. Of course it does feel good when you work hard and finally overcome the obstacles and get a new rank, but I don't sit on my laurels too long, instead I become more motivated to push myself. Rank is only a measuring stick. It lets me see what I need to accomplish, and then let's me know when I need to start working on new challenges. Any long difficult journey requires a way to measure your progress and set sights on your goals. A belt is just that. Without a measurable goal, I don't think I would push myself as hard as I do when I know the goal and can focus on it.

Jiffy, I couldn't disagree more. If your studio looks better, the instructors are more professional and the program more appealing than the other guy, you can get more members even if your price is higher. Charging too low of a price is one of the biggest mistakes instructors make. Very few people are looking for the cheapest training they can get. Most people are NOT true price shoppers even if they claim to be. Here's a test: Do you drive the cheapest car you can buy? Are you wearing the cheapest clothes you can buy? Do you feed your family the cheapest food you can buy? Do you live in the cheapest house in your town? There are a few people who can truthfully answer "yes" to these questions, but they are not you target market anyway. Most people don't want cheap, they want VALUE!

Some people ask me: "So you can beat up anyone?" I usually respond: "Not if they train harder and more often than I do."

TaekwondoMike, where are you located?

TaekwondoMike, a bunch of former ITA School owners formed an org about 10 years ago called Taekwondo America. I joined them about three years ago and I really enjoy it.

Defend yourself against who? How do you test for that? Must you be able to defend yourself against a master of your art or even a master of another art? Must you defend against every possible weapon? Even a yellow belt learns how to defend against some people, but they are certainly not ready to be black belts.

Some things that have worked for me in the past year: Market heavily to parents of children in the 6 - 10 range. Children in this age range have free time and their parents are willing to spend the money. Make sure you have separate classes for junior beginners so that they are not intimidated, but have the junior advanced class immediately following the beginner class so they see it as they are leaving. Gives them something to strive for. Best source for adult students: parents of junior students. Charge what you are worth. People are seldom looking for the cheapest training they can get. Annual contracts and automatic payment!! The best decision I ever made was not accepting students without an annual membership and requiring auto-pay. Sure I lost a two or three potential students, but from a business standpoint you need some security. Right now I know exactly how much money will be deposited in my bank account on January 2nd. That makes the January 5th rent payment not as scary.

tangsoodo, you've got a problem. It sounds like your school has no standards for promotion, and understandably you're not very happy there. You need to find a school that you like.

There are already a number of governing bodies. Most styles have organizations and associations that govern ranks and promotions. Since every style and every organization is different and has different standards and requirements, this is the way it should be. Of course their are good orgs and bad ones. It is up to the student to do a little research before joining a program. While many instructors who are not in an organization are excellent, they may be harder to research. If someone who was not qualified as an instructor wants to open up a dojo, I would imagine he would do it as an independent or find some poor organization without high standards.

If you want excellent training by a top Korean master, many of us don't have to journey very far. A number of outstanding taekwondo masters moved to the U.S. where they opened schools and formed associations. I am not Korean, but I do operate a school with daily classes (6x a week). The American schools I trained at when coming up through the ranks also had daily classes.

It took me 3 years. In my association, it is possible to earn a Black Belt in 2.5 years, but most take longer.

KT Samurai, don't worry that you are not "comfortable" in the stances. All new white belts in any art find things that they are not comfortable with. You are learning something new and not expected to be good at it yet. Every martial art will take you out of your comfort zone.

I think a big problem for many instructors is being afraid to charge what the training is worth. Even on this board there are so many people that don't want to see their instructor making a healthy profit. If a school only charges enough to break even or make just a small profit, they will go out of business when they have a bad month or two. This is true of any business. On the other hand, an instructor that makes a tidy profit will be able to weather the inevitable down months. No matter how good the instructor is, there are always ups and downs in both revenue and expenses. One way instructors can stave off the bad months is to require annual contracts. Instructors should also not be shy about charging for their additional services (i.e. testing, private lessons, etc.).

patusai, while I agree that it is a rediculous argument, you are missing an important point. The Bible does not say that you cannot call someone "father", but it does say that "you cannot serve two masters" (Mathew 6:24). This is, of course, a silly argument because I don't know anyone who "serves" his MA master.

Exactly. I'm not a member of the ATA, and I don't know what their rules are. I know that if I choose to open my school in a low population area or a depressed area I will sacrifice some opportunities that I might otherwise have. If I know that it is a requirement for becoming a high dan rank, I will have to make my choices accordingly. On the other hand, if I am in an organization that only considers my physical capabilities I know that I will reach the end of my growth as I get older and my physical abilities degrade with age. When I am old, I know I will be less physically capable, but I will be a better teacher.

At some point high up in the rankings it is not just about your own skill level. That would preclude 60 year old masters from advancing. It also should includes teaching and improving the art. It should not be measured in $$, but measuring it in # of students is a reasonable measure of teaching and business prowess.

Absolutely! We regularly practice using kicking and movement from the ground to avoid getting into a wrestling match with an opponent who puts you down. You are always safer on your feet than you are in a grappling match, for one thing, you can't get away if you're on the ground. We teach our students to defend and then how to get back to their feet where they can either run or deliver a devastating blow. Neither can be easily done if you are wrestling with the attacker.

Mr. Mike, while I'm no fan of the ATA, I am a big fan of success. The ATA is doing what every business should do: set goals and strive to reach them. If they are as bad as some people say (total Mcdojos), they would have never been able to achieve the success they have. A scam can only work for so long. Since the higher dan ranks consider teaching and contributions to the art as requirements to advance, what better objective measure than the number of students you have taught? If you're a lousy teacher, you won't have many students and probably don't deserve the title of "Master". Right now I have 125 students. A year from now, I plan to have 200 students, and I will be both a better instructor and more successful. That does not make my school a "McDojo".

markusan is right, the eyes do not give away anything. In fact they work against you. If I am lucky enough to spar someone who is looking at my eyes, I will intentionally mislead him.

The fundamentalist Christians that I have heard object to the title of "Master" refer to Mathew 6:24 "No one can serve two masters". Of course this is a ridiculous argument.

I charge $80/month and only need around 60 students to break even. I stay afloat by having about 120 students. Discount martial arts schools do not necessarily attract more business. Most people are not looking for the cheapest MA training available. If you have a good program, charge what it's worth.

It's called "manufacture and sell anything that people will buy" and it's part of living in a capitalist and free society. Of course as martial artists we don't like it anymore than a plumber likes the "do-it-yourself" plumbing books at Home Depot. On the flip side, the "do-it-yourself" plumbing book may actually benefit the plumber, because he gets to come out and fix what you screw up. And the "do-it-yourself" karate kit may give a child a teaser but leave him unfulfilled. Obviously it's crap, just like the martial arts self-instruction videos that have been available for years in Black Belt magazine. If it's popular, maybe it will increase interest in martial arts for children overall.

Aodhan, that is an excellent example. I know several petite women who are very skilled and worthy of their black belt, but they may not be able to defend themselves against a 270 lb brute who knows what he's doing. On the other hand, I know a few 13 and 14 year olds who would quickly dispose of an average size man. I first started MA in 1983, so perhaps you are referring to a time before that. Since I have been in martial arts, I have seen an improvement in skills, training programs, techniques, cross training and the introduction of new styles to the mainstream. Today, most MA's introduce elements from other MA's that make them more effective. It seemed to be much more limited 20 years ago. If MMA existed back then, it was sure hard to find. There were good and bad schools back then, and there are good and bad schools today. Today there are more of each.