DLopez

I knew it!! I called it!! I just knew that you're so closed minded, you would never believe any proof handed to you, and I was right. You asked for a 3rd party source corroborating what I've been saying, and when it's given to you, you call it * out of hand! I had you pegged from the beginning. I guess some people react that way when their little closed-minded world gets shook like that. Whatever. You are believing everything told to you. Someone told you that all Korean martial arts descended directly from Japan, and for some ignorant reason, you believed it without any proof other than it must have sounded good at the time. Now, you believe every wrong opinion of Kuk Sool Won told to you. Sheesh, next you'll tell us that you were "there" to witness the effects of the Japanese occupation of Korea. Go ahead, prove me right again.

It is sharpening my mind and strengthening my body, and through discipline, avoiding those things that would prevent me from accomplishing that. That and learning how to kick butt! (just kidding!)

Not trying to toot horns here, but Kuk Sool Won doesn't need government regulation because the only way to teach it is with permission from the Grandmaster, and each school must adhere to a syllubus, and teach nothing else but what's on the syllubus, or else the license can be revoked. Does that prevent someone from teaching what they learned in Kuk Sool Won? No, but they cannot legally call what they teach Kuk Sool Won thanks to Copyright and Trademark laws. Plus, it does give prospective students the confidence in knowing that if they want to learn Kuk Sool Won and go to a licensed Kuk Sool do jang, they will learn the same exact thing at the same rank, whether they are in Houston or in Great Britain. I was surprised to find out that most all other martial arts are not like that themselves. Besides, less government in your lives is only a good thing.

I almost spit coffee through my nose when I read that!

Aefibird, to my knowledge, Tommarker is pretty much correct. The term Jo Kyo Nim, for example, doesn't literally mean "1st degree blackbelt", rather it refers to a "title" of instructor bestowed upon someone that has achieved that rank. "Nim" roughly means "instructor" or "teacher" in Korean. But it's also pretty synonymous with the ranking since each black belt level gets a new title, at least until the Master level. These are the titles bestowed upon the particular black belt level in KSW: Black-Brown belt = Dahn Boh Nim (Black belt candidate) 1st degree = Jo Kyo Nim (Instructor-in-Training) 2nd degree = Kyo Sa Nim (Assistant Instructor) 3rd degree = Pu Sa Bum Nim (Deputy Instructor) 4th degree = Sa Bum Nim (Instructor) 5th, 6th, 7th, 8th degree = Kwahn Jahng Nim (Master) 9th = Chohng Kwahn Jahng Nim (Chiefmaster) and ultimately 10th = Kuk Sa Nim, or National Martial Arts Teacher (our Grandmaster).

I practice a Korean martial art, so sorry if this sounds too simple to be asked, but I just want to make sure I understand what I read on here. Does 'Dan' equate to level of black belt? So say a 1st Dan would be a 1st degree black belt, 2nd Dan is a 2nd degree black belt? Or does it mean something else? In my Korean martial art, we have specific names we give each degree of black belt - 1st degree = Jo Kyo Nim, 2nd degree = Kyo Sa Nim, 3rd degree = Pu Sa Bum Nim, 4th degree = Sa Bum Nim,... and so forth. Just trying to understand the grading system in Japanese MA's. TIA!

On the other hand, being in real fights doesn't automatically equate to making you invincible. I've seen enough to realilze it's quite possible to suck at "real" fighting, no matter how often you get into them.

Joe Dirt!

Britain still makes autos? Does the mini-Cooper really count as an auto? Just kidding!! When I visited Ireland for 3 months, it appeared to me that the driving factor behind the choice of most Europeans of which auto to purchase, had more to do with gas economy, and not so much quality of build. Of course, you still have those that can afford luxury autos like here in the States, but the "expensive" cars I saw in Ireland were not of British make... is that not the way it is on your side of the Irish Sea?

That may be true for some vehicles, but I owned two Toyotas before I had it with the expensive parts repairs when things did break, and went back to a domestic vehicle. Lessee, less frequent but more expensive repairs (Toyota) vs. more frequent but less expensive repairs (GM). Does it really matter how good quality is, if in the end, repairs cost practically the same? I've since eliminated 80% of the repair costs by performing them myself now!

I get a kick out of this discussion every time it pops up - specifically, that weight training with heavy weights will make you muscle bound, not as quick, slow, inflexible, etc. If that were the case, then pro athletes whose livelihoods depends on lightning quick reactions, speed, flexibility, and endurance would never power lift as part of their training regimen. If it's good enough for them, it's good enough for me.

If you want to "feel exhausted", or feel like you really worked out, you might have to either increase the time you jog in place, or include other types of exercise into your routine, like pushups and situps, or even try some aerobic exercises as seen on TV. Those are probably designed to be performed in your living room. There's lots of alternatives if you want to bump up the level of effort in your workouts.

It's not nearly as strenuous as actual jogging, but it is more activity than walking over the same amount of time. Do your feet begin to hurt after a certain amount of time, or from the start? I don't think that simply jogging in place should be causing your feet to hurt, no more than walking should cause your feet to hurt. 30 minutes is not that long, but it really depends on your level of fitness. Your jogging in place may simply be aggravating a pre-existing condition with your feet. Your doctor can tell you for sure about that.

What workout is best if we want "party ball" abs instead of a dinky little six-pack? Hehe! I think I still have a six pack underneath all the insulation! Fortunately, the "ice" is melting and my six pack is becoming visible again.

Bump TTT. So far, the tiny bit of evidence I've provided suggests that: 1) Traditional Korean martial arts indeed were taught after WWII. 2) Kuk Sa Nim (In Hyuk Suh) was not the only one teaching traditional Korean martial arts after WWII. 3) Evidence shows that the flow of influence in martial arts flowed from Korea to Japan, not from Japan to Korea. Looks like quite a different picture of Korean Martial Arts is emerging than the one painted by Akima.

I've noticed that the common prevailing notion is that all Korean martial arts are a direct descendant of Japanese martial arts. From what I've been reading from various sources, that notion is a one-sided idea, originating from the Japanese side and hence, propagated by proponents of Japanese martial arts. In fact, some sources I've read indicate that ancient Korean martial arts were more influenced by China (Koreans adopted techniques to combat Chinese invaders), and that the flow of martial arts influence may actually have gone from Korea to Japan, not the other way around. Here is an online source that echoes this: completemartialarts.com Navigate to: "Home: Information: Styles: Korean Martial Arts", Click on titles: History of Korean Martial Arts by In Sun Seo History of Korean Martial Arts by Jane Hallander You have to be more specific when you ask "when did Taekwondo originate?" Are you talking about the style created after the end of WWII, or are you simply using a generic term for indigenous martial arts that existed in ancient times that are Korean in origin? I don't know modern TKD, so I won't try to separate how much is Japanese and how much is Korean, but I think it's safe to say that there is enough difference in TKD and say, Karate, to conclude that TKD is not just a Karate rip-off - it contains some uniquely Korean methods. Beware!! Separating fact from mythology in martial arts is a lot like discussing religion or politics, so be ready for some wack opinions to be proffered and hotly defended!

I take it you figured it out when you were able to observe for yourself that there is no tooth fairy, and didn't just start doubting the tooth fairy just because you read it on a website? Why you don't take the same approach and verify for yourself what KSW is, escapes me. You know, I did a quick google and here's another 3rd party link, you probably have already visited, but must have missed this one... In Hyuk Suh So I gave you a 3rd party source (at long last I guess), so will you choose to believe it or will you come up with some new lame reason to disbelieve? (I already know the answer.) Edit: more info!! Hey, I found this at that same website: Titled, "History of Korean Martial Arts, by In Sun Seo." Essentially, this disputes what Akima says about martial arts going from Japan to Korea, and that it was basically the other way around! I can't wait to hear Akima's reaction to that! Anyhow, more corroboration that the traditional Korean martial arts were taught after the Japanese occupation, and that In Hyuk Suh is not the only one as Akima believes. Hey Akima, what have you dug up to prove that KSW is a fraud? Anything yet?

Put up what? What else do you want besides what I've already provided (way back at the beginning of this thread)? Should I go borrow the letters of introduction from Suh's grandfather that basically opened his doors of study, and let you read them? Should I get GM Suh to personally visit you and answer all of your questions, face to face? How about this? Instead of just going by what you read on the internet, how about you actually visit a KSW school, and identify what is and isn't Japanese. Should be quite an easy assignment for someone like you that obviously knows what is and isn't Korean. What are you talking about? Show me where it's being purported that what Suh claims about KSW isn't true? As far as I can see, the only ones doing that are you and your **cough** "sources". Your "critical skepticism" is merely just a juvenile attempt to make youself appear knowledgeable, like some sort of educated consumer or something. If you cannot prove that KSW is a fraud, then don't declare it as one. You are entitled to your opinion if you choose to doubt KSW's claims, but it is downright idiotic for you to continue your KSW bashing based on your ignorance. Give it up already. Did you or did you not post this as your very first post? Ya, I thought so. Quit backpeddling. You said what you said. I don't think I'll take up your offer for that reading comprehension site, since it obviously doesn't work, either that or you never looked into it yourself the same as you never looked into KSW yourself.

Nice try. I've seen the website you must have visited to get this one sliver of hope to support your argument. The simple fact is, In Hyuk Suh does not acknowledge any teachings from Choi as having gone into Kuk Sool Won. What does that tell you? If it wasn't traditional Korean, then it wasn't going into KSW. In Hyuk Suh studied under many masters, and basically chose to assimilate only the traditional Korean techniques for KSW. Why is that so hard for you to believe? Regardless, let's entertain the notion that Suh studied Hapkido (not the ancient Korean styles upon which it is based). The only way you can say that that makes Suh's claims of being traditional Korean as false, is if Suh included those techniques that were not traditional Korean, but were Japanese, or, if Hapkido was just a re-labled Japanese style, which it is not. You see, it all goes back to the ancient Korean roots that the contemporary Korean styles draw from. Once again, Suh is not claiming to have invented a new style. He has simply put together a system based on the indigenous, ancient traditional Korean martial arts. Those same roots can be found, to varying extents, in TKD, Hapkido, or any other Korean martial arts style. So even if KSW and Hapkido share some similarities, that is to be expected! Your little world of over-simplified generalizations probably has a hard time handling that, huh? You also contend that all Korean martial arts are directly descended from Japanese styles. Early on, you said this: If you would bother to compare KSW to Karate or even TKD, you would clearly see the difference in styles. Even a novice could tell the difference. You obviously have not bothered to compare practical styles. If KSW is directly descended from Karate, shouldn't it at least look similar, despite what name you want to call each technique? How do you explain the differences? (Oh I forget, you never bothered to observe KSW, so you have no real frame of reference. My bad.) Another thing... Why do you keep making up imaginary points for your argument? You keep calling what Suh learned as "secret" techniques. They're not secret techniques, they are the same techniques that most Korean styles are based on to some extent. The only thing secret about them was how they were taught during the Japanese occupation - in secret. An entirely different meaning. However, I can understand how they would seem secret to someone like you that had no idea they existed before. Finally, you will never find the "proof" you are looking for (even if you did, you would find some reason to disbelieve it), so be content in your ignorant conclusion that because I choose not to doubt the research undertaken by others (I have found no reason to doubt it), that KSW is a fraud, and that all Korean martial arts are really Japanese. You will sleep better at night, I'm sure. But in reality, you have proven nothing but your own deliberate ignorace, and KSW will continue to grow in popularity whether or not you believe it is a traditional Korean martial art. Like I said, you aren't the first one to doubt KSW, and you won't be the last. If I am a fool for believing what I do "without proof", well then, I say welcome to the club!

That is exactly what they did with TKD TKD is irrelevent to whether KSW is traditional Korean or not. Anyhow, now your position is clear. If you truly believe the Korean government is trying to pull a fast one, then clearly, no matter who tells you anything more about KSW, you're never going to believe it. You've made up your mind already, despite your claims that you're keeping an open mind... but I knew that from the very beginning. I never said you called me a fraud. You are calling KSW a fraud, without any proof to back it up. Just slanted opinions based on hearsay. Seem to belive his claims!!!! Exactly No one else can say for sure. The only thing that is proven is he studied HKD. No one can say for sure??? By your own admission, yet here you are adamant that KSW is not what In Hyuk Suh claims it is, as if you know! Sometimes I just can't believe what I read on the internet sometimes! As far as In Hyuk Suh studying Hapkido, that's an interesting spin. But it's just that, spin. Most contemporary Korean martial arts are based on the ancient traditional Korean styles to some extent. Hapkido is no different in that regard. So if In Hyuk Suh studies the same roots that Hapkido draws from, you're going to paint it as In Hyuk Suh having studied Hapkido. Okay... Spin spin spin. Hah! There's no burden on me, because you've made it clear you will not be convinced, ever. Plus, I couldn't give a rat's patooty if you believe KSW is traditional Korean or not, as KSW's rate of popularity and growth will continue despite those like you that choose to denigrate it out of sheer ignorance. What you call research is laughable at best. What you are looking for is out there, but it isn't going to be on some website. Still, once you find it, assuming you're really looking for it, I'm sure you'll refuse to believe even then as well. Whatever. I've told you what I've learned, you've just decided to refuse to believe it, without having any real reason to disbelieve. You've at least admitted that much yourself. ("No one else can say for sure." Direct quote from you.)

How about your attitude? Calling something is a fraud until it is proven to your liking? Who the heck are you and who made you judge to determine what is and is not a traditional Korean style? As if you would even know anyhow? (I've been trying to get this point across the entire time, but you're too obtuse to get the hint, so I guess I just have to come out and say it.) No, you're wrong. In Hyuk Suh is not the only person making such claims. The folks that have ripped off his techniques to teach them under different names seem to "believe". The Korean Government, despite your ignorance to the fact, believes what he is teaching, else they wouldn't have honored In Hyuk Suh and his system by making it a governing body of martial arts. You seem to think that that simply means "having a headquarters in Korea". To that I can only suggest, get a clue. Are you suggesting that the Korean government is behind this sham of making up a new style too? Basically, that's what you're saying. Look. You claim to have done research, but you keep saying things that makes me think you're simply asking your buddies' opinions or some sap down the street what he thinks of KSW, whether they even know anything about it or not! Your sources are a sham. In Hyuk Suh's got an entire Korean government backing him up. What do you got? Hearsay and opinions, that's all. Heh! There is a better way for you to decide for yourself whether KSW is really a Japanese derivative... go take some lessons for a month or so, and see for yourself if it is a Japanese rip-off. No wait, you said Chinese rip-off... Oh ya, now I remember, you said Japanese rip-off first, then changed it to Chinese! I'm not sure what you think it is now, other than you're absolutely positive it is not Korean! Really, I don't care if you believe or not, all I've been trying to do is just point out to you how ridiculous your claims that KSW is not a traditional Korean style are, based on all the **cough cough** "research" you've undertaken. You just don't get it though.

Original 240Z's are quite rare to find these days. They weren't made with the best steel and rusted quite easily. You will have a real collectors item if you restore it to it's original glory (although the powerplant you want to put in there sounds pretty nice!).

Eh?? Has anyone told you that your tap dancing is exquisite? Just to refresh your memory, the fact that the Korean Government made KSW a governing body in Korea was to refute your claim that the majority of Koreans hold KSW in low regard, not to prove it's lineage. Anyhow, your argument is a study in contradiction. On the one hand, you claim that In Hyuk Suh's claims that KSW's is traditional Korean are uncorroborated, and dubious at best, and therefore unbelievable. Yet, you have no problem believing equally dubious claims that KSW is not a traditional Korean martial art, all from the wrong, ignorant, uninformed sources. In fact, you have fully accepted those doubters words as completely factual! Now why would you bother to give such dubious claims more plausibility than In Hyuk Suh's, unless you were already predisposed in your opinion to disbelieve. If you want to believe that the Japanese were successful in completely eradicating everything Korean from the face of the earth, go right ahead. Personally, I find that harder to believe than KSW being a traditional Korean martial art. I just think it's hilarious that folks that don't even know what the old traditional Korean martial arts were, are the ones now saying what is and isn't traditional Korean, and you're swallowing it up like a bass swallows up a big juicy worm! I'm not surprised you figured it was school policy. You seem to hate KSW without knowing anything about it. I have heard of no such school policy, and I've studied it for over two years. The only thing I know you cannot do is teach KSW without permission from In Hyuk Suh. The reason for that is to preserve the quality control, but still, some have stolen the techniques they've learned in KSW, and teach them under other names. I wonder if you can see the irony of this all... your latest source of information studied KSW, so he should know, yet because I study KSW, I'm a "cult" member. Hehe!

If you can handle two at a time, do it. Just be careful to not overwork your knees. One thing not mentioned, Diet Coke has a lot of Sodium in it, therefore it really won't quench your thirst, but make you more thirsty - so you'll drink more Diet Coke they hope! Dunno about Red Bull, but vitamins do not give you energy. Food gives you energy. Vitamins are not a food substitute. They aid in your body's ability to digest and break down food at the cellular level. Taking vitamins without any food will yield little benefit, and often makes you sick to your stomach. Try the lesser. If it doesn't feel like a workout, do the more. If those don't feel like a workout, increase reps as well as sets. The difference is minimal really. I drink Gatorade not because it's better than water, but just because I like the taste. The key is to just stay hydrated.

Who knows and who cares? How does a TKD'ers low opinion of KSW reflect on KSW's legitimacy? How would they know anything about it? (You never answered that question, BTW) Fact: Did you know that the Korean government has such low regard for KSW, that it made the World Kuk Sool Won Association a governing body for martial arts in Korea? Ya, I didn't think so. Are you sure Koreans have such low regard for KSW? Me thinks your sources are in the distinct minority. Just for grins, answer me these equally silly (irrelevant) questions: Why do the Red Sox and Yankees have such low regard for each other? Why do Budweiser and Miller drinkers have such low regard for each other? I know, hard questions!