mal103

I'm at the stage with my Karate that I am looking over the fence at other styles. I have started to see examples of merging of styles and applications. I am investigation Kata applications and have seen several applications of Aikido, Judo, JJ, etc Has anyone else experienced the same cross over?

After many years of being too busy I finally got into Karate, I first trained in Wado Ryu but had to have a break after an accident with a finger tendon. During that time I moved areas so looked for another Dojo, I found Mushin Shotokan Karate club in Wiltshire Uk, but found a great club! I trained to brown belt with my kids, then reached Shodan and helped one of my kids do the same (my other kid got into County swimming!) Since then I have been training towards Nidan and have found a really good place with my training, partly due to really good role models and mentors in the DO.

You should study your flavour of MA for as long as you need, if you wake up one day and can say that you "know" that style then you should maybe look harder in the mirror. I favour Karate but am happy at my level to grab and dismiss bits from ANY other style or Art. The more I learn the more I realise I don't know. There is a saying that is something like whatever path you choose to get to the top of the mountain - the view is all the same. Chopping and changing between styles is okay if you are not being fed enough but think about doing too many aprenticeships!

Apologies for not reading all five pages but just wanted to add my support for evaluating new students, we've just had a guy return to training after a 20 year gap, he got near Black belt as a teenager but then stopped due to "life" We allowed him to train for several weeks then started him off as a 7th Kyu and he will grade next month to 6th Kyu. I fully expect him to settle into training and will then look to accelerate him up with a couple of double grades (so long as he trains hard!) If all goes to plan he will spend enough time at each level to get back up to speed and will make a good Shodan. The org we work with has a minimum of 3 years training for Black belt and takes into consideration any previous training, at our discretion, we can double grade twice on Kyu grade but not 1st Kyu. I certainly don't agree with skipping ranks above 1st Kyu, my journey to Nidan is only 2-thirds practical, I expect my journey to Sandan to be less (but more) To think about standards then think about getting a few students in a Dojo in civilian clothes and ask them to do the first Heian/Pinan Kata - or first Kata in your style - you should be able to guess their level by their performance. The 9th Kyu should perform the Kata correctly, the mid Kyu levels should be fast execution and very sharp. The Black Belt should be the one who is trying to knock a hole in the floor with their foot and sends a shiver down your spine when they "KIAI", they should also be out of breath on completion but be willing to do the Kata over and over...

I did Wado ryu briefly, mostly Shotokan but I like to take anything from anywhere if it works for me. Happy with 26 Kata in Shotokan but also interested in the differences between styles are and what application would fit better. I think after a while there is a lot of cross over in styles and other MA.

Research and rest, I train and teach a total of 5 sessions a week, sometimes 6, so normally need the rest, not as i'm unfit, more to ease any bruises or aches/pains. If I feel okay then a few weights or visit the Gym but not often enough! I will often be found with a laptop playing a Kata, replaying it bit by bit until I get it - or make it better! I try to go early to lessons and use the hall if available to practice Kata.

There seems to be a few themes going on here, if you are looking at the basic applications of Kata out of interest to pass your next grade then that's fine, if you are delving a lot deeper into the many applications within Kata then you may find the following statement true: "there are no blocks in Kata" Think about Bassai Dai, why would you turn and perform 2 blocks and then turn again? Surely you would be better twisting their arm or striking the side of their head or throwing them. A lot of them start with holding a fist or hand/fist at your hip - this means to a lot of people that you have already grabbed someone and got them in an arm/wrist lock, the following movement(s) are to respond or punish the attacker. I think all 5 Heian/Pinan Kata start with attacks or arm twists, some applications are blocks though. I prefer "Respond" translation rather than block. Think about Soto - outside to inner block, there is a potential jab to the throat with the Hikite hand, also blocking a punch with the "blocking" hand as it goes up and out to the side before sweeping across. If the Hikite (pulling) hand has got hold of something then your Soto is going to contact the upper arm or face. Also the Hikite hand of Age uke is often seen as the blocking/grabbing/pulling hand, the responce is then an upper fore-arm smash to the upper arm, armpit or neck/face. By all means they should be drilled as blocks but shown as more. On the point of first attack, a verbal attack, threats or intent should all be considered the start of the attack, so unless you can flee you are right in striking first. Different responces to different situations and also in proportion to the threat/attack. If someone has grabbed you then why wait to be hit? The same man that coined the principle of not attacking first also said that he who strikes first will probably win the battle. All my opinions by the way from my experience and research. It depends on what you want out of Karate to how hard you search inside it.

I've got soo many Kata on the go and soo little time I just try to practice whatever I can. I find it more important to ensure you don't leave any out and that you are doing the techniques as correct as possible. Also concentrate on the correct speed and power, all Kata have set times and should not be rushed. It might be ealy days but also start thinking about the applications of some of the moves... Not all blocks are blocks and sometimes the kick/punch is the end of the movement so the application happens earlier.

Is the other guy a Black belt? No offence but people/parents kind of expect to see a Black belt out front, also someone older, maybe late 30's, 40's. You should ideally look approachable, friendly smile and relatively fit. Some parents like to see things like associations, child protection policies, instructor insurance and a CRB (or whatever they are called now). Maybe even a 1st Aid cert. These aren't essential but some people will look for them and we use them as advertising points to help sell us. Most won't give a damn if you have won competitions or have trained with a Japanese Sensei, or can kick over your head, some will be put off when they see a huge fierce Black Belt pictured clenching fists. Don't think i'm against your idea as I started my own clubs soon after passing my Shodan, it has taken me a while to feel comfortable but I really like it and have seen great results, my longest student is going for Purple belt soon. My Sensei passed on what he could but a lot of it has to be thought about, sometimes you will have a plan but it will need changing half way through the lesson or you may hesitate or your students will get bored - all things to think about as not everyone is suited to it, however good your Karate is. You will also need to maintain your own training and research. I have expanded our website to cover existing and new clubs, ensure you put locations and training times, plenty of key words to the location so you show up in searches, also google maps is a must. Online will only work for people looking for Karate in your area, for everyone else you need to tell them where/when you are and invite them in. I have found leaflets work the best but you only get a handful turn up for hundreds of leaflets... Posters, ads, displays do help to get your name known but don't draw in the crowds. Having existing students train with you for a big discount is good, especially if you are in a visual area then people will see your students. Keep your prices reasonable and offer family discounts, most people will also fall for marketing tricks, free lessons, £2 off with this leaflet, introduce a friend to earn free lessons.... Make lots of designs and see which ones work, you have about 5 seconds to tell the homeowner that they can do Karate, they can try it for free with no obligation, you are the real deal, where it is, when it is, your website, email and number for more info. A snappy picture/logo helps to visually tell them what it is. You may have some lessons with only 2 or 3 people but you must not be down hearted, teach them well and keep up the marketing. For lots of kids you may need to sacrifice a few minutes of the 3K's to have some fun, normally near the end of the lesson, as a trade off then help any adults with Kata before or after the lesson to ensure they feel valued. Try to add something new each lesson, add in a cresent kick, spinning kicks, different strikes - something not in your syllabus. Grab bits from the advanced Kata that you are learning. Research self defence techniques, especially if they are from a Kata. Too many people give up because they get bored or can't be asked so it's your job to ensure they stick with it. Realise that you will need to teach people who are trying it for a few months/years but don't love it like you do, amongst them will hopefully be a core that are in it for life and will give you the most satisfaction. Most of all good luck, don't give up too soon but don't keep doing the same thing if it's not working.

I was going to say sweat and dirt but got beat to it.... Mine is blank, not even a label as I had to shorten it slightly and chopped the label off. Nothing fancy just like our Gi. We are going to get club named belts for all the instructors soon so will have a spare. I'm more interested in what the belt is wrapped around and how I train.

I voted that it doesn't matter but changing around is good so you get a variety, you may also get someone who will add another application in to the drills. I was once partnered with a much more experienced chap who almost broke my arm so not always a good idea, I may be a Black belt but i've not got arms like Popeye. We also have a green belt who puts his full effort and power into everything so that works both ways. So long as you learn something from the experience.

I always like to think that you "become" a black belt, hopefully around the same time your club/org will grade you. I did mine in 3 years but had a year in Wado previously. BB should be a benchmark of speed, power, effort and knowledge. It also means you should have a very good grasp of the basics and can now continue your training. I see Brown belt as coming around the last bend on the race course and into the home stretch towards the finish line, some Browns don't meet this challenge and don't ever grade again, it should never be on time done.

I was trying to mean "not smashing their head on the ground", I was thinking that if the student was skilled then they could grab/twist/control but then using the control to not inflict serious damage. The last fight that I was caught up in was before I started Karate, it ended up 3 on 3, one of my mates got knocked to the ground, another met his match so they just exchanged punches until giving up, the chap that squared up to me was twisted around onto his knees before he knew what happened, but not hurt.

Reasonable force should be the key thing here, a bit of messing about should not be met with a knockout. There are plenty of people that have been killed by falling after a knockout punch. On the other hand I know what it's like to be bullied, even though most of it is verbal it can be viewed as a type of attack so a self defence response should be justified - so long as it was proportionate to the attack. Depending on the level of the student then maybe an arm lock and "gentle" take down would have been more appropriate. All that needed to happen was a message to the bully to not mess with him anymore - hopefully they may have seen it as a message to stop bullying.

I can only imagine that if I had trained someone for years and they had gone on to open a Dojo and train for themselves then in the true spirit of Karate I would be most proud and not looking to profit from it. Good luck with your choices but most of all good luck with your Dojo.

Do what you want to do in life, if its training in Karate then go for it. It may take a while but with regular grading you can acheive Black Belt in your 3rd year - this may seem like ages but is a journey that does take time for a reason and is more than worth it! I'm nearly 42 and train with my kids (12/13) - we are all Brown belts and loving it.

If you can do everything yourself and your old instructor takes little interest or doesn't help you then its obvious you don't need to pay him anything. Out of courtessy you may want to talk with the instructor to explain that as a business paying him for something you can do is not viable. He may understand, he may offer to get more involved to help your business, he may get annoyed. Either way, you may be doing this for love but it has to produce some money as well. I mentioned to my Sensei that I was interested in training and hinted to the possibility of doing it as a full time job if possible, he was full of support and offered to help me in any way he could - I don't think he meant that he would be expecting 50% of my earnings! He was genuinely enthusiastic of promoting Karate in our area.

I got into running to help complement my Karate as I often found myself out of breath during training, I used to set a goal of entering a race (10/13 mile run) to act as a goal to aim for. This ensured that I would get out there and train - it did my karate the world of good! Just recently I have been slacking on the running and have noticed a decline in general fitness which has meant me being absolutely knackered at the end of an hours training! I went out today and ran again, I will also get at least 3 running sessions in next week but it may take a few weeks to notice any difference. Do you use any other fitness regime or do you rely on Karate alone?

I'm hoping to train in the future and cases like this will strenthen the position of protecting yourself even more. If you are placed in the situation where its just you and a young female then you would have to insist that the parents remain or the lesson be scrapped. Someone that is a very senior grade has proven that you just can't trust anyone based on what they are or what they've done. The media will have a few headlines out of this but I doubt very much that it will have a big impact on the sport or art, it may have more of an effect locally for a while as people will know some or all of those concerned. Apart from the victim I should imagine that the people most effected are his current and past students who may be feeling gutted that someone they held in very high esteem/honour/respect has done such a thing.

Similar, I train with my 12 & 13 year old kids, I have to be more careful as sometimes even blocking can hurt younger arms. Its great to have my boy 1 belt behind us as we can help him with the next Kata, the main problem we face is the amount of enthusiasm we all put in is slightly different - I am 100% full on learning + effort whereas they still treat it like a couple of lessons per week only like swimming or trampolines etc. I'm hoping they will adjust but will have to wait and see. Its great when we all pass a grading together though!

While I am glad that he will not be in a position to cause more harm, I cannot find that thought pleasant in any way. Does this sort of thing rehabilitate? No. Does it prevent? Apparently not. The only thing it does is to spread misery. There is plenty of misery in the world already. I really would prefer if they found a way to have such people be a safe and productive member of society who just happens to be in a situation where they cannot or will not be able to harm anyone again. We all like to think that perverts will be treated very harshly inside but if there was any danger to him he will be kept seperate from the general population. I have just read on another forum a statement from someone who knows him well (or thought they did). As it was over a length of time and he has pleaded guilty then it can't be called a "one off mistake", they also state that he has thrown away the lot. This may have a wider effect on everyone, its bad enough my Sensei asking my permission to move my daughters wrist. There are guidelines in place for when working with children - I haven't read them yet but I suspect they are over the top already. This is a massive abuse of trust.

Nothing to worry about unless you are the one eaten by the shark..... Sorry JusticeZero I couldn't resist! Another thing to think of is to go to the local club/dojo and ask if any of them live nearby and could pick you up, maybe you could alternate it with your mom driving every other week or something. Maybe attend a few lessons first before asking so you can see if you get along with the club etc. Only you and your mom can decide if they think its safe to walk, we have lots of narrow lanes without footpaths that would make it risky here. At least if you have a car accident/crash then you will still know where your kids are, not knowing is a bigger fear.

Thanks again for all your input, in this case they have a very demanding school life which will always take first place over everything. They also swim regularly so all of this needs to be balanced with a healthy mix including a few hours on the sofa! They have a friend that is a very good swimmer, unfortunately the parents have pushed her which I think they may one day regret. They get her up before the crack of dawn to train before school and then again most evenings, then every competition around is entered into at the weekends. They even have a room dedicated to her trophies and medals...... When I think of the amount of time of her teen years will be spent in the pool then I believe she will rebel eventually.

This is the dilema..... Sometimes I push a little but there is a fine line with pushing too much. Now and again one or both has the attitude of not wanting to train, a few times I have said skip a lesson, other times I have urged them to go and at the end of the lesson they have said they really enjoyed it. At the recent grading they were proud to both pass and were really pleased with themselves. It seems just recently that they probably wouldn't be fussed if they went or not - especially my daughter - which promted this post. I will have a chat with them in the week and offer them a break, there needs to be a chat about training more if going for higher grades but fear that will not work at the moment.

Excellent statement! That describes me, hopefully they will stick with it but it will have to be their decision.