Ancient Martial Arts resurrected?

[Himokiri Karate]

I have noticed that combat sports seems to be evolving from hard training/sparring to a more systematic approach that takes safety in to consideration.

Example 1:

Boxer/kickboxers/MMA fighters are now sparring less and are more focused on safer approach to sparring.

Old school karatekas figured it out and they focus on lighter sparring or hard to the body only.

Example 2:

Less strength training and more focused on movement. Most fighters are doing more shadow boxing or doing drills.

In old school martial arts like Shaolin Kung Fu or Kalaripayatu they mimic animal movements for sake of plasticity and so the body doesn't become bound to limited movement which would be a persons particular style.

If you look at combat sports, it seems like the modern training is similar to Ancient Martial Arts. Shaolin students, wake up and do a cardio workout by running stairs. They also move around in animal postures as well as train with stones and odd objects. In Karate its called Hojo Undo.

Am I looking at this correctly?

[Nidan Melbourne]

In Modern Times people do need to take safety into consideration. As these days there are more issues in relation to health and injuries!

Then there is also the view that the "old-school" Training will mean that they can't keep their schools open to those wanting to train as the physical repercussions can be long term and very costly.

In Relation to your 2nd Example many schools have found that they just don't have the time to focus on the strength training because of the expense of operating a school. So instead they focus on Technical Training instead, and have students do their own Strength + cardio outside of class.

[Kyonovice]

I don't find this to be totally true. Having studied at many dojo's, my current Shihan focuses on all things combat. We study the grappling arts, kata, kihon and kumite. The kumite is hard and strong with full contact to the body, it's very much like documentaries I have seen of training in Okinawa.

We also focus on body conditioning and fitness as, lets face it, these 2 do go hand in hand.

[bassaiguy]

I do think that in many dojo the sparring is lighter and contact is more limited today than in the "old days". No one needs to get hurt to enjoy a hobby so this is probably a good thing, but I don't think this is a development or evolution as much as it is a reaction to commercial pressure and potential litigation. In other words, it's a reaction to the market rather than a well-thought out change to the curriculum. I think if you go to some backyard dojo or advanced classes you might find that traditional karate is as hard as it has always been.

Also, this isn't the first time martial arts have evolved for commercial purposes. For example, in the late Tokugawa era (1700s to mid-1800s, e.g.) many bugei were modified to attract commercial clients from outside the samurai class who could pay impoverished samurai instructors in Japan's cities. The training while probably heavy by today's standards was certainly less intense than had been the norm during the early Tokugawa when martial arts were restricted to the professional warriors class. This sort of safety consciousness was a direct influence on the creation of judo, for example.

When my grandfather trained in karate in the early 60s he trained four hours at a time because they conditioned so much. When I began training in the 80s cracked ribs and other injuries were commonplace. Today, it's hard to get a decent set of push-ups out of some of my classes. That's certainly training lighter, but I'm not sure it's training smarter or better.

[sensei8]

Here's my 2 cents...

Safety, nowadays, is paramount because insurance companies have some strict regulations whenever the MA is the product/brand!! Things done on the floor are carefully watched over by the CI to ensure that unnecessary injuries occur; however, accidents should be expected from time to time.

A school of the MA can be closed whenever safety isn't more important than money!!

Many schools of the MA are so afraid of teaching and training and challenging their students, as they ought to be. Why? A school of the MA ceases to be a school of the MA whenever there's no more students, and in that, a school of MA without students is a very long and lonely walk for the CI. Therefore, when students no longer darken the doors of said MA school, there's no need for instructors, alas, no need for a school.

What was, is no longer!! That saddens me because that which was has been replaced, and that with what it was replaced by, is the unfortunate tone of ineffectiveness. So much so, that students are taught a dire false sense of security.

Has the foregone conclusions of yesterdays been all but forgotten?? The answer might never be told with any certainties. That which was taught by the masters of old, are slowly being swept under the tattered rug as though it never existed.

For those of us who have been lucky enough to find themselves under the forever watchful eye of a CI that kept the fire burning brightly on the floor, as they were once taught, and having the fortitude to pass that same torch, as well as accepting that same torch for generations to follow. That which was once treasured, can still be so.

All it takes is heart and desire to breath that air back into its once dead future. So, stop being afraid, and teach your style of MA as your art once wasl with that unquenchable vigor.

Imho!!

[Alan Armstrong]

Let's face it. Conditioning in the past was abusive. It needed to be because life and death situations were common. Due to wars and political upheavals, training needed to fit the times.

Depending where you live in the world your training should be adapted to your ultimate survival.

Karate can be toned down in to a sport or vamped up in to becoming a killing machine.

Humans and martial arts are both highly adaptable, this is why they both continue to thrive.

Martial arts mma brutalities in peace time are nothing in comparison to war time atrocitys.

Training for war is not the same as training for a sport or hobby. There is the psychological aspects to take in to consideration also, as in having the not only the skill to take another persons life but to also to do it.

Mohamed Ali (the boxer) was not willing to kill and was jailed for it. In the same note, which boxer trained harder than him to become a great fighter? Better still, who stood up for their beliefs more than him with his unpopular stand not to kill those that are not his enemies.

As Bruce Lee would say "The art of fighting without fighting" Could also be asked, who trained harder than Bruce Lee?

If there is any resurrection here it should be about Muhammad Ali and Bruce Lee.

[bushido_man96]

I think training has changed over time based on what kind of research and equipment is available. Over time, many stylists have figured out that if you take too many hard shots to the head, you don't really end up extending your training time. After all, the best ability is availability.

Contrary to popular belief, a focus on strength training can be quite beneficial to Martial Arts training.

[Himokiri Karate]

I may have gotten this wrong. It seems the general consent in this forum is that, Ancient Martial Arts was brutal in nature which is true.

I guess afterwards martial arts became toned down for safety reasons and that's why Kata and forms exists.

That being said, in combat sports, the trend is to not spar as hard and as often as they did 10 years ago and now the focus is more on movement and physical/technical training.

I guess in a way, the combat sports is following the same example is ancient martial arts. (start off aggressive and tone it down for safety)

That's what I feel like I am seeing.

[Alan Armstrong]

I agree with you Himokiri.

Technical martial art abilities have replaced the aggressive approach to fighting.

Rushing into the opponent screaming just isn't the way of modern combat.

As a warrior type activity, I do notice the lack of physical conditioning giving way to the technical abilities.

As a balanced fighter these two physical and technical qualities need to be given equal importance.

Personally, I put a high value on agility and flexibility. As these two qualities are essential for maintaining martial art skills.

[gunner]

When I was in my 20s, our dojo sparred full contact. If you survived the night uninjured, that was a good night.

The biggest fear was you'd get an injury that would stop your training for 6 weeks while the bone heals. Not worth it.

Light to medium contact is sufficient to measure your ability. Save the hard contact for the bag. Wear appropriate safety gear.