Learning Kata online

[Judodad_karateson]

As I'm new to karate, I'd like to accelerate my training at home my practicing my Kata. I'm not really that concerned with rank, but at the same time, I'd really like to get out of this white belt ASAP. I've got Fukyugata ichi roughly memorized, but I'm concerned practicing it too much without an instructor present will cause me to develop bad habits for poor form.

Do you guys have any favorite sites or youtube channels for breaking down Kata movement by movement?

My style is Kenshin Kan, if that makes any difference.

I don't know what your full kata curriculum is, but since you mention Fukyugata Ichi, I recommend getting Shoshin Nagamine's book, The Essence of Okinawan Karate-do. It contains all of the kata of Matsubayashi-ryu (Shorin-ryu), including the Fukyugata.

Well, I wasn't look for books, but it's actually funny you should mention that, because I have the book! I bought it years ago as part of a research project for high school, on Okinawa(I was a navy brat born in Okinawa, so it's always intested me). Guess I'm going to spend the weekend at my parent, digging through boxes in the attic! Haha

That's for reminding me, I forgot all about the book! I tried to learn the kata in it, but the dance step set up was too hard for me to understand at the time. Now they I'm in karate, that will be a great supplement to my training!!!

[Kime]

I know where you are coming from Judodad. I've been studying shotokan karate for nearly a year now. Watching the legendary sensei's performing and explaining the techniques and kata's is a great inspiration and help. Atleast it has been to me.

I truely second that you might miss or inherit something that has changed since it was recorded or is just not "appropriate for your respective level".

In my case i primarely watch Sensei Hirokazu Kanazawa and Sensei Masao Kagawa.

I do what you guys say, get inspired and study online, and ask the questions and get the corrections in the dojo. But it makes it possible to be a step ahead in many cases .

OSU!

[wildbourgman]

Once again Judodad I have good news and bad news. I've heard that the Kenshin Kan federation somewhat frowns on official postings of video on the internet although you can find a bit of videos so that as an official resource might be difficult. Now the good news is that other Okinawan styles do have video of Fukyu Kata ichi. Finding Fukyu kata ni and san might be difficult but they are so close to each other that it shouldn't be necessary.

What Kanshin kan calls fukyu kata ni international is called Gekisai-dai-ichi in Goju Ryu so that can be found easily.

Kensin Kan's version of Wansu is going to be difficult to find, I'm not sure about anything from there.

[Kusotare]

Yes the differences between Otsuka, Suzuki and Wado-Kai fuel endless discussions during water breaks...

If I remember correctly, the old video footage (that I believe you are referring to of Otsuka performing Kata in a tennis court) was not made public until about 25 - 30 the years ago, as it was part of a private collection (it was shot in the USA in the late 50's I believe).

So although Otsuka's performance pre-dates Suzuki's - It is doubtful that Suzuki had seen this footage prior to him filming his version of Niseishi.

Regarding the differences - I believe there are two possibilities.

1. It was Suzuki's personal development of the kata - Shu-ha-ri

2. Suzuki had minimum exposure to Otsuka's teaching of Niseishi (prior to his coming to Britain).

Given the fact that it is well documented that Otsuka actually pared down the number of Kata he had in his system and by very virtue that there was little or no reference material at the time (no You tube ,VCR's and scant Wado books in the 60s) - I believe it was the latter.

K.

Edited June 12, 2015 by Kusotare

[Judodad_karateson]

Once again Judodad I have good news and bad news. I've heard that the Kenshin Kan federation somewhat frowns on official postings of video on the internet although you can find a bit of videos so that as an official resource might be difficult. Now the good news is that other Okinawan styles do have video of Fukyu Kata ichi. Finding Fukyu kata ni and san might be difficult but they are so close to each other that it shouldn't be necessary.

What Kanshin kan calls fukyu kata ni international is called Gekisai-dai-ichi in Goju Ryu so that can be found easily.

Kensin Kan's version of Wansu is going to be difficult to find, I'm not sure about anything from there.

Yeah, that's what someone told me in class tonight when I mentioned using YouTube to help me get the full kata down. Not sure why. I respect their decision, but it seems kind of old fashion for the times we are in. You can find almost the whole curriculum for other arts on YouTube (BJJ is a good example). It doesn't replace in class instruction from a master, but to does help the noobs work on their homework a little.

[Zaine]

I respect their decision, but it seems kind of old fashion for the times we are in. You can find almost the whole curriculum for other arts on YouTube (BJJ is a good example). It doesn't replace in class instruction from a master, but to does help the noobs work on their homework a little.

I agree with you here. I don't see the problem in posting kata online. I certainly would never advocate for that being a replacement, and I often don't recommend that people pursue online education for martial arts until they have been practicing for a few years, but looking at a kata for reference, or even a different perspective, is rarely a bad thing. I think you also run in to the problem of people not wanting to post higher level katas because it is "supposed to be secret" or something similar, but in this case setting up a website that gives permissions to certain people to access certain pages with videos higher level techniques is fairly easy. That way you can guard these katas from outside eyes while allowing your students to learn through them.

I've always had trouble finding kata videos for Matsumura Seito that reflect even the way that we learned it. A very legitimate concern your teacher may have is that because there can be so many variations even in the same system that they are worried that the kata you learn won't be the kata that they teach.

[Wastelander]

I fairly regularly tell students to look things up on YouTube--I certainly have! In fact, I have actually learned the pattern of a kata entirely from video, before, so that I could get proper corrections on it when the instructor visited for a few weeks, rather than have him spend a week teaching me the pattern before getting to the good stuff.

The trouble is, as you've discovered, that not all styles want to publicly post videos of their kata. I think this is silly, especially considering the technology age we are living in. My organization doesn't tend to like it, but we post stuff, anyway. Luckily, there are some videos of Chibana Chosin (the founder of our style) that are publicly available, so I can refer people to those, if nothing else.

My recommendation would be to ask your instructor if you can record him/her running the kata you need. You can agree to keep it private, if that's what they want, but you would still have a video to use for reference, and you would know it is exactly what you are supposed to do. Since every dojo and every branch of a style has subtle differences--even if you did find a Kenshin-kan video, somewhere, it might not be exactly the way you're supposed to do it.

[P.A.L]

As I'm new to karate, I'd like to accelerate my training at home my practicing my Kata. I'm not really that concerned with rank, but at the same time, I'd really like to get out of this white belt ASAP. I've got Fukyugata ichi roughly memorized, but I'm concerned practicing it too much without an instructor present will cause me to develop bad habits for poor form.

Do you guys have any favorite sites or youtube channels for breaking down Kata movement by movement?

My style is Kenshin Kan, if that makes any difference.

if by kenshin kan you refering to Musumura Seito , keep in mind that the foot work is the key. Fukyugata is a standard kata but your style is so unique that i advise you not to mimic the foot work of the Fukyugata you see on youtube. the best thing if possible is to ask a higher rank to do the kata and film him/her.

[Bulltahr]

[quote name="Wastelander"

The trouble is' date=' as you've discovered, that not all styles want to publicly post videos of their kata. I think this is silly, especially considering the technology age we are living in. My organization doesn't tend to like it, but we post stuff, anyway. Luckily, there are some videos of Chibana Chosin (the founder of our style) that are publicly available, so I can refer people to those, if nothing else.

[/quote]

I agree, seems a moot point, basic kata on you tube is nothing that isn't found in all manner of books out there. Certainly easier to watch (pause, slo-mo etc) on a monitor or TV than to visualize based off a description in a book surely.......

[Melau]

Learning from video's can be both good and bad, depending on how it is used. For beginners I would say, learn / train your kata in the Dojo. If you want to practise at home, practise what you have learned in the Dojo and don't try to learn new techniques. Rehearse what you've learned. It is far easier to correctly learn something that way. Also, have to 'un-learn' something you've trained on your own that wasn't entirely correct is time consuming .

I notice that I'm at a point where the old video's are necessery. In Wado, there are different excecutions of techniques and kata's depending on the lineage. So there are differences between Hironori Ōtsuka, Tatsuo Suzuki sensei, Jiro Otsuka sensei, Fukazawa sensei to name but a few. Knowing what the differences are and why they are done in such a way gives greater insight in your own karate. But this is too deep in details for a beginning martial artists IMHO!