Cost and Contract commitment for Karate 2nd degree

[Lupin1]

Thanks again for all the input everyone! I plan to follow your advise and look for a new place which I have started to. Since we did sign a contract to stay/pay till red belt we will stay till then. I just really hope my daughter will continue to stick with MA. This is the longest she has stuck with something like this, she enjoys it, gets exercise and is pretty good at it. But she hates change. Good thing is many places offer a free class to try them out so maybe that will help.

Since you have a little while before the change, I'd start talking to her about it now. Get her involved in the search for a new school, get her opinions on websites, and have her go with you to visit new places or take some trial classes. The more she's involved with making the decision, the more likely she'll be comfortable with it in the end and stick with it. Plus, it's a good chance to learn about keeping a budget and balancing price and value.

[Archimoto]

Wow, thanks again to all your input and from people who know so much more about MA (not a sport) than I do!

Some clarity, its been around $1200 from white to advanced purple (plus $40 per graduation). This is not the cost of each belt cycle but for the whole time so far. (they charged us $300 down then so much a month with financing/interest). I signed a contract for instruction from white to red belt, payed $300 and have been making monthly payments (with interest) since last Feb. Adding up class and graduation costs (which they did not tell me about when I signed up) and interest charges the total cost from white to red belt will be about $1900.....that does seem very high.

I would agree with all of you. Their prices are high if not very high. It's very concerning that they only offer one very expensive long contract with no other options. When I questioned them on this they said that they are trying to teach commitment and that is why the contract is so long. That if your child losses interest they would talk with/ work with them to encourage them to stay....or stay with it. When I asked if my child did lose interest....it was obvious that my monthly bill would stay the same.

Thanks again for all the input everyone! I plan to follow your advise and look for a new place which I have started to. Since we did sign a contract to stay/pay till red belt we will stay till then. I just really hope my daughter will continue to stick with MA. This is the longest she has stuck with something like this, she enjoys it, gets exercise and is pretty good at it. But she hates change. Good thing is many places offer a free class to try them out so maybe that will help.

Just a thought: as you search for a new school you might explain your daughter's fear of change to the new would-be instructors. The right instructor might be very interested interested in helping her transition.

[sensei8]

Interest charges don't surprise me at all because that's how contract are written...contracts are a binding agreement between individuals. Buy a car; there's interest. Borrow money; there's interest. That's how finances work, and it's legal to do so. Only way to avoid interest is to pay in full! Not many can do that!! How did that school come up with the interest rate to charge? Did they run a credit report? After all, interest rates vary per an individual's credit scores.

Glad to hear that the search for a new dojo is happening! Good luck in your search!!

One more thing, that dojo telling you that they teach "commitment" through the contract just frosts me. Why? IMHO, they're there to teach their style of karate in an unmitigated way so that their students aren't given a false since of securities!!

[chiliphil1]

Interest charges don't surprise me at all because that's how contract are written...contracts are a binding agreement between individuals. Buy a car; there's interest. Borrow money; there's interest. That's how finances work, and it's legal to do so. Only way to avoid interest is to pay in full! Not many can do that!! How did that school come up with the interest rate to charge? Did they run a credit report? After all, interest rates vary per an individual's credit scores.

Glad to hear that the search for a new dojo is happening! Good luck in your search!!

One more thing, that dojo telling you that they teach "commitment" through the contract just frosts me. Why? IMHO, they're there to teach their style of karate in an unmitigated way so that their students aren't given a false since of securities!!

I do understand that there is interest on any loan that you take out, however that is for third party transactions in most cases. If you buy a car the finance company pays the dealer, you pay them back not the dealer, the interest is there for the finance company to profit as the dealer already made their profit, if one pays cash then they would avoid the finance company and thus the interest charges. To my mind if you are making all the payments to the school there should be no reason for interest as the school is taking all of the money as profit, that is unless they are using some third party company but that wasn't mentioned.. I think the whole thing stinks!

[Lupin1]

I don't understand interest on karate lessons because you're getting the lessons over a period of time. When taking out a loan for a car or a home, it makes sense to charge interest because you're getting the item right away and using it before you've paid for it. The karate lessons are happening over a 5 year period, so it makes sense to allow payment over that 5 year period without charging interest.

[cathal]

ldretzka, I'm unsure where you are in the world but here is some perspective I hope that you gain some insight.

- My dojo charges $35/mo for individuals. You can pay for 3 months for $84. Families pay $85/mo or $200 for 3 months.

- We have a 2nd and 4th degree black belt teaching us. Once every three months we are visited by a 7th degree black belt or higher.

- Periodically throughout that 90 day period we will also have a 5th or 6th degree black belt that will randomly visit us as well.

- The visits are to ensure the instruction is up to par as well as to maintain our relationship with higher-ranked instructors and the association we are affiliated with.

- We have an annual membership fee to that association of $30/year.

- To grade, we pay a $35 testing fee for non-black belt levels.

- Black belts pay $150 for their test, and an additional $100 up to $350 maximum for additional levels.

- There are no other fees. No interest. No surprises.

- Each test mandates each karateka maintains the standard so we do not allow anyone a rank they haven't earned.

For one year of training that included 2 belt tests, I paid $428.00. If I elected to attend the clinics that visiting Shihans put on I paid an addition $35 per clinic. Max $70 optional fee per year. I did pay this which brought me up to $498.00 per year.

It took me seven years to get to Shodan. So I paid $3,496.00

[hammer]

I like belt promotions as much as anyone else, but I pay the dojo to be able to train, not to earn a belt. If any dojo asked for payment for a belt rank (not for a belt test, that's different!), that would be the last day I trained there...

[Nidan Melbourne]

My club does contracts of varying amounts of time but never more than 18 months. But that is with an option to pay up front in full or pay over x months if it is more affordable that way.

But only 1/5th of our club has that type of membership. But everyone else either has a monthly direct debit, or 30 lessons.

We do offer similar memberships to the black belt one but to different ranks/time based not classes based.

All our students who are direct debit are charged $85 per month which includes; training costs, gradings, belt (if promoted), insurance, and a small part for hiring of the hall.

BUT the best thing is with our memberships/contracts is that if you decide to cancel that membership there is no payment required to cancel. If you payed upfront for say 18 months and you stop completely after 12, you get 6 months of that sum back.

- As you are not going to use it, so why should we keep it?

But this school your talking about is very expensive and very dodgy.