Would this be going over the top at grading?

[sensei8]

Asking to be double graded, imho, is an insult to the CI!!

How do you know if the CI had already decided to, you've deflated their balloon, so to speak, and that's just not cool. If a student is bestowed upon with a double grade, and they should be the rarest of things, that should be the choice of the CI. When you ask to be double graded by your CI, then you're taking things away from the CI that you've no right to do so...intently or not.

[Nidan Melbourne]

Asking to be double graded, imho, is an insult to the CI!!

How do you know if the CI had already decided to, you've deflated their balloon, so to speak, and that's just not cool. If a student is bestowed upon with a double grade, and they should be the rarest of things, that should be the choice of the CI. When you ask to be double graded by your CI, then you're taking things away from the CI that you've no right to do so...intently or not.

Solid Post.

I should add to my last response to this thread. Everything that you have just said I agree with.

When I said that you should wait till your a little bit more advanced, i don't mean that you should go and ask to be double graded. You should let your skill, attitude and determination talk for itself and not your words.

I have been double graded and I had no idea.

[sensei8]

Asking to be double graded, imho, is an insult to the CI!!

How do you know if the CI had already decided to, you've deflated their balloon, so to speak, and that's just not cool. If a student is bestowed upon with a double grade, and they should be the rarest of things, that should be the choice of the CI. When you ask to be double graded by your CI, then you're taking things away from the CI that you've no right to do so...intently or not.

Solid Post.

I should add to my last response to this thread. Everything that you have just said I agree with.

When I said that you should wait till your a little bit more advanced, i don't mean that you should go and ask to be double graded. You should let your skill, attitude and determination talk for itself and not your words.

I have been double graded and I had no idea.

To the bold type above...That's the way it should always be, and the rarest!!

No one knows, not even the Hombu, whenever I've decided to double grade someone. I usually will have made that decision behind closed doors after the testing cycle has concluded, and at the very last second. Whomever I've double graded, won't know, no one will know, until I make the announcement at the award ceremony. It's the decision of the CI, and the CI alone. In my many years of teaching, I can count on one hand just how many students I've double graded.

Hombu makes the double grade official once the CI has made the decision. The Hombu is out of the equation on double grades for most of it. There's that trust between the CI and the Hombu; integrity is crucial at all times. Hombu will only question a CI if the CI is starting a pattern of awarding many double grades. Remember, its the rarest of thing, the emphasis is on rarest!! There's no student and no sensei and no dojo that's that exceptional!! Want to have someone question your integrity? Award double grades often, that'll do it.

[Wado Heretic]

I would argue it depends on the CI; I have always preferred to be asked, and to have the opportunity to have that conversation with a student. Then again; I have never opted to double grade a student on my own initiative, and I usually end up saying no and explaining why.

I see no harm in having the conversation; just so long as you do not enter into it with a demand. Just, if you are going to, remember the belt is a teaching aid telling the instructor where you are; you should not be having the conversation if your thoughts are ones of seeking a platitude for your ego. Just; I have had students give up because they did not understand the grading syllabus, and I wish they had asked and had the conversation instead.

[sensei8]

I would argue it depends on the CI; I have always preferred to be asked, and to have the opportunity to have that conversation with a student. Then again; I have never opted to double grade a student on my own initiative, and I usually end up saying no and explaining why.

I see no harm in having the conversation; just so long as you do not enter into it with a demand. Just, if you are going to, remember the belt is a teaching aid telling the instructor where you are; you should not be having the conversation if your thoughts are ones of seeking a platitude for your ego. Just; I have had students give up because they did not understand the grading syllabus, and I wish they had asked and had the conversation instead.

Solid post indeed!!

Conversations are exactly what's needed, and often times, they're not taken serious, when they should be, imho. I don't think I've been directly asked by a student of mine, and if I had, I pray that I was of the sensible mind to have that conversation.

[mal103]

Forget double grading, you are on a journey not a race....

I've been a part of double grading students during a period with my old club and wish that I had not. Some of them are luckily still my students and I have held them back to even out their rank and they have been happy with the reasons. Some of the others are still with my old club and have shown they make bad students later on as they have skipped crucial parts of their training. They are also seen as belt chasers as some had worked out the earliest they could get their black belt based on when the gradings were and not where they were. They also have a black belt instructor who has raced to it after just 2 years, the last grading I sat on I witnessed a whole load of white belts all doing the same basic mistake!

There is no short cuts in Karate or MA. Don't ever ask but if it happens bow deeply and show respect, unless you're in a McDojo, then give it back and go find a better club.

[Wado Heretic]

To go back to an earlier post; if a CI is known for giving double grading, then I believe it would be rude or impolite to ask. However, I am known for being hardheaded, and giving no lee way with grading. So I do prefer people to communicate with me directly with their concerns if they have any. Just how I am, I try to be fair, and I know that sometimes that leads to me not noticing somethings I probably should.

I suppose I would have to argue for double grading and asking for them, if we view the belts as a simple teaching tool. If we use the belt to help us keep track of a students progress, then those are neccessary evils as it were.

If we treat them as platitudes and recognition of achievement; we should not allow people to ask for them, nor should we reward them.

I guess it depends on where one sits on the line between those two extremes.

[Karateboy]

I know of 2 double gradings that's happened in the club, and have only seen one.

The first was a guy who was doing 18 classes a week, Karate is like oxygen to him, he needs it to live. He has achieved Shodan since then and has been hired full time by the dojo as an apprentice.

The second was a girl, I'm not sure how many classes she attends but every time I'm at a class she is there as well so I assume she does many. She is always travelling to tournaments and at the last grading she performed all her techniques very well. When she was awarded a double rank the CI announced they weren't going to double grade anyone however they made an exception for her because the entire panel agreed she was ready.

I'm not expecting to get the double grade, but it never hurts to have a bit of hope right? I understand it's not a race, I will treat the grading like all my classes. I'll go in with focus and try my best.

If I don't double grade, oh well, if I do that's nice too, regardless I'll be back on the mat training hard on Monday.

Two classes today, some personal training at home tomorrow and grading on Sunday.

I'll post how I went after grading.

Again thank you for all the posts, I was overwhelmed by the wealth of knowledge available at this forum. Many thanks for the information.

[Nidan Melbourne]

I know of 2 double gradings that's happened in the club, and have only seen one.

The first was a guy who was doing 18 classes a week, Karate is like oxygen to him, he needs it to live. He has achieved Shodan since then and has been hired full time by the dojo as an apprentice.

The second was a girl, I'm not sure how many classes she attends but every time I'm at a class she is there as well so I assume she does many. She is always travelling to tournaments and at the last grading she performed all her techniques very well. When she was awarded a double rank the CI announced they weren't going to double grade anyone however they made an exception for her because the entire panel agreed she was ready.

I'm not expecting to get the double grade, but it never hurts to have a bit of hope right? I understand it's not a race, I will treat the grading like all my classes. I'll go in with focus and try my best.

If I don't double grade, oh well, if I do that's nice too, regardless I'll be back on the mat training hard on Monday.

Two classes today, some personal training at home tomorrow and grading on Sunday.

I'll post how I went after grading.

Again thank you for all the posts, I was overwhelmed by the wealth of knowledge available at this forum. Many thanks for the information.

Don't forget if you want to double grade you have to be able to demonstrate above and beyond the next belt level.

So at my dojo we have white, yellow, orange, red, green, purple, blue, brown, 1st brown, Shodan-ho then the dan grades. If one is a red belt and wants to double grade to purple, then they have to demonstrate that they are at the purple belt standard and even to the point that they should be good enough to go for their blue belt. But we grade them even harder than anything else.

I got double graded because I trained in 5 classes a week and taught 4 days a week also.

I get why you want to hope to get double graded, but that is showing your ego (ego should be left at the door and not in the dojo), although if you are an amazing student and is far ahead of others of the same rank or that of the one above then let your skill talk

[Karateboy]

Just got back from grading and I was awarded a double grade. Very happy!