Not very happy

[devil dog]

Everyone trains and teaches differently. What you feel is extreme, some may feel isn't enough.

Personally I do not feel you have a dog in the hunt. Your student went to him for direction making him this other instructors student as well as yours.

I have trained in old school (hard lessons learned) dojo's and in modern (no contact or light contact) and have got something out of all of them but much prefer the old school training to the modern. Personally I think it's up to your student to decide if he has issues with this other instructor. I do not fell this is your place to go and talk to him.

Who knows the teacher could have demonstrated this several times and your student may not have been paying attention or too slow to react. Things happen in training which is why we use liability waivers. I don't know one student or instructor that can say that they haven't been hit hard or been injured during their training. Accidents happen. It's nothing to get upset about. If he doesn't want to be hit he should be looking for another activity. Even in modern dojo's accidents happen.

[GojuRyu Bahrain]

I can't stand "Senseis" who mistake their static students for a Makiwara... I feel that any form of hard contact with a compliant partner (during critiquing of a technique as in this case, or during any other demonstration for that matter) shows either poor control or a badly twisted character of the person doing the contact.

Conditioning drills (KoteKiTai) are something else, of course. Also, sparring or "live" drills are a totally different matter as well; there, some (or even a lot) contact is necessary.

[Nidan Melbourne]

I can't stand "Senseis" who mistake their static students for a Makiwara... I feel that any form of hard contact with a compliant partner (during critiquing of a technique as in this case, or during any other demonstration for that matter) shows either poor control or a badly twisted character of the person doing the contact.

Conditioning drills (KoteKiTai) are something else, of course. Also, sparring or "live" drills are a totally different matter as well; there, some (or even a lot) contact is necessary.

True that. My sensei will only do hard contact for kumite and if his partner is old enough and high enough to understand he isn't doing it maliciously. He will aim to hit hard to spots that won't damage vital organs.

With me he will hit hard to the legs (upper leg) and to the ribs. Obviously more force to my legs over my ribs.

For demonstrations he will still hit fairly hard but ensuring that he doesn't injure his partner.

[Spartacus Maximus]

Hard lessons are lessons never forgotten. Accidents and injury happen when one side is distracted. Martial arts training should never be done lightly. If mistakes do not sting, the lesson will not stick.

Partner practise is meant to help each other learn and internalize correct technically sound details which make a the techniques work. It is not supposed to be a contest of macho ego or a game of tap tag. Injuring a partner is counterproductive and the only defeat is that of learning effective defense and counter

Nevertheless, students must learn to take this type of training very seriously and never lose their focus and concentration. This is why feeling the sting of mistakes is the best and only teacher. Making it sting without more than a bruise is the mark of a senior or teacher who has true control.

Many in my dojo get bruises each time we practise. Getting winded from a kick or punch that was improperly blocked or miscalculated is also common. Broken bones are rarer but not unusual for the dan grades. Nobody ever hurt anyone on purpose, but if we make a mistake we know we will feel it. After all, we might depend on what we learn to save ourselves if ever assaulted. Going soft does exactly the opposite of that. Once the moves are learned, it is time to test and train to make it work.

[Hawkmoon]

Hard lessons are lessons never forgotten. Accidents and injury happen when one side is distracted. Martial arts training should never be done lightly. If mistakes do not sting, the lesson will not stick.

Partner practise is meant to help each other learn and internalize correct technically sound details which make a the techniques work. It is not supposed to be a contest of macho ego or a game of tap tag. Injuring a partner is counterproductive and the only defeat is that of learning effective defense and counter

Nevertheless, students must learn to take this type of training very seriously and never lose their focus and concentration. This is why feeling the sting of mistakes is the best and only teacher. Making it sting without more than a bruise is the mark of a senior or teacher who has true control.

Many in my dojo get bruises each time we practise. Getting winded from a kick or punch that was improperly blocked or miscalculated is also common. Broken bones are rarer but not unusual for the dan grades. Nobody ever hurt anyone on purpose, but if we make a mistake we know we will feel it. After all, we might depend on what we learn to save ourselves if ever assaulted. Going soft does exactly the opposite of that. Once the moves are learned, it is time to test and train to make it work.

100% !

Name a contact sport, there is a need to use power, so MA here is no different here, in fact its implied you are training to fight after all!

Its the sport side that drives the light contact we see and watch on YouTube as karate fails etc etc.The two are very different, and both sides of that coin need to keep that in mind.

Not all sport fighters can walk in to a full contact bout and expect to win, sadly some do, and likewise for the full contact fighter!

I'm not saying its wrong, far from it, it can be exciting to watch sport fighters fighting, coiled snakes or cats ready to pounce, a flurry of action an explosion ending in a punch or kick....and with all that control!

Some people take up MA as a sport, and why not its works and is fun to boot! there is a smaller group that take up MA and think they are the next Bruce Lee.....

This smaller group and that sort appear in both camps that need more guidance, I'm not so sure that they get the 'help' they need to be honest.

[mal103]

I totally agree that it should be hard if that's what the student has joined for, for the average hobbyist MA then you need to build them up gradually though.

Lets not forget that the topic here is a mid Kyu student went to try another Dojo to suppliment his training and ended up getting a hard kick in the ribs. The Sensei that did it had no idea of the students abilities or any previous injuries, had no idea if they were just training for fun or if they wanted to fight like Bruce Lee.

I think it should involve contact but introduced gradually and only then to students that you know well, I have been in 2 new Dojo's this year and have been treated well, nobody has tried to stamp their authority on me or to get me to spar full contact to see what I was made of. If anyone joined my Dojo as an existing student then I would spend plenty of time assessing them before I allowed them to spar freely.

[Nidan Melbourne]

Hard lessons are lessons never forgotten. Accidents and injury happen when one side is distracted. Martial arts training should never be done lightly. If mistakes do not sting, the lesson will not stick.

Partner practise is meant to help each other learn and internalize correct technically sound details which make a the techniques work. It is not supposed to be a contest of macho ego or a game of tap tag. Injuring a partner is counterproductive and the only defeat is that of learning effective defense and counter

Nevertheless, students must learn to take this type of training very seriously and never lose their focus and concentration. This is why feeling the sting of mistakes is the best and only teacher. Making it sting without more than a bruise is the mark of a senior or teacher who has true control.

Many in my dojo get bruises each time we practise. Getting winded from a kick or punch that was improperly blocked or miscalculated is also common. Broken bones are rarer but not unusual for the dan grades. Nobody ever hurt anyone on purpose, but if we make a mistake we know we will feel it. After all, we might depend on what we learn to save ourselves if ever assaulted. Going soft does exactly the opposite of that. Once the moves are learned, it is time to test and train to make it work.

I agree with you on that! train hard and if one person lacks focus they will get hurt.

A few weeks back i was doing seeiunchin bunkai with a fellow black belt, and mistimed dodging the attack and blocking it so i got a swift punch to the nose and caused a blood nose coming out of both nostrils. This was because i wasn't paying 100% attention. And I learnt a valuable lesson, and i knew that i should have been paying attention.

Mistakes do happen, but without mistakes in training we never truly learn what NOT to do.

When i leave the dojo going "that was a great class" i will either have worked so hard and sweated like crazy or have done that and left sore and bruised.