Favorite way of teaching applications of kata to students

[JR 137]

I think you are correct in that we agree to a point Luther unleashed; that ultimately we view the instruction of young people in the same broad theme.

Saying that though, in terms of applications of Kata, I am a sceptic. I am not sceptical of the idea that kata contain combative methods, and that these can be interpreted and inferred to with the trained eye. However, I take every approach to applications with a pinch of salt.

When I did kenpo, every form could be related back to the self-defence techniques. However, the forms never evolved beyond just contained the techniques; so one might as well just work on the content.

When I did Wado-Ryu, bunkai never quite worked because it was not part of Ohtsuka Meijin's concept of kata. Also, the waza needed significant changes to be made workable with regards to models such as HAPV.

Also, my experience of Judo and other grappling disciplines has taught me something; you need the benefit of working against someone to understand how grappling techniques work. The Kata might contain ways to stand and resist body-to-body techniques, and how to perform take downs, but I am doubtful you will find locks in them beyond holds such as grabbing the head.

I believe this is what Mabuni and Motobu were discussing, and criticising, when they talk of kumite drills derived from kata movements with no alteration but also of the negligence of traditional kumite. Mabuni also states that although kata should be 50% of one's study, that one should not neglect hojo undo and kumite. I believe the grappling techniques of karate are in fact found in kumite, and hojo undo, not the kata.

I believe the Kata contain broad themes and ideas, but mostly deal with what you can actually practice via kata. Movement, and ballistic techniques. Hence, bunkai should not be a deconstruction of kata but the meeting of all aspects of one's training.

To return to Mabuni and his criticism of kumite drills derived from kata with no alteration; I believe this is true of most application practice today, even among those who practice so called ohyo bunkai. Mabuni, and others, speak of kata as a map but from which can be derived spontaneous and numerous responses.

A fixed application drill cannot reflect this. Thus my approach of simply practicing the kata against force and attacks, and evolving spontaneous responses from there. The physical intensity of such is beyond children, and hence why I do not do application work with children.

Practice kata as kata, and find the content through training, not thinking. I know this runs counter to most, but hopefully it serves to expand on my earlier post regarding my favoured way of engaging in application practice.

I really like your post. It goes along with my way of thinking about kata, and even kihon kumite, yakusoku kumite, etc.; they're principals of movement/techniques. They're not set in stone techniques that must be followed rigidly during combat. They're the abstract form of the art, if you will. Learn the form and try to see what was envisioned with the movements. Incorporate those principals (not the EXACT movements) into your actions. No matter how much you drill kata and bunkai, it'll never be like you practiced it. Real fights are too unpredictable, especially for complex movements.

Yes, the argument can be made that by practicing them over and over they become muscle memory. But how many times have you seen someone successfully pull off a prearranged bunkai against a truly resisting opponent in free fighting/sparring that's equally matched and has no idea what they're trying to accomplish? I'm not saying it doesn't happen, I'm just saying I've never heard of it happening. It's not like someone was sparring and said "That was cool, what was it?" and the person responded "step 5 in Kanku!"

For the record, I love kata and bunkai. But I look at it as the "textbooks" part of my education rather than the "this is exactly how it's to be done" part. Kata and the like are the theory, kumite is the application of the theories.

[Wado Heretic]

You have essentially summed up why I have become a sceptic; I have never seen a direct over lap between the drill work, and free-fighting. Also, when I have studied combatives, many of the drills suggested when taken from kata find no analogues in modern day self-defence tactics or combatives.

However, I would be hesitant to dismiss the practice entirely; after all, it lead me to where I am today. Plus, kumite has it's own rules and concepts, which prevent it being entirely realistic. Drill work allows one to explore situations without rules, why also training in a safe manner.

What I would say, is that I encourage congruence and sincerity with regards to what one is in fact practicing; when doing a drill I ask questions, for example:

1. Does this drill have an analogue in self-defence practices, and can I actually rehearse what I am doing by performing the kata?

2. Have I deduced what I am doing from the kata, or have I inferred this from my other training?

Then I like to test the answers to these questions through kata based sparring. Ultimately though, I rarely do drills, I just do the kata against someone trying to stop me doing the kata, and see which one of us feel more beaten up at the end. In my mind, if you have to change how you perform the kata movement to do your kumite; your kata is bad.

[Luther unleashed]

This topic will always pull me in. Everybody has a different understanding of fighting/self defense. How many times has of e seen a person pull off particular bunkai in a real sithation. Well, the exact technique?

My take and the way I develop from from is very similar to how I develop from one steps. I feel they do a great job of helping you to understand angles, distance, timing etc... It's not always about the exact movement to me. As an example, I teach a jab as thrown to the face, but in a real situation can it become free movement to be thrown anywhere if, lest say, your opponent ducks? Of course, it changes as your tarvet/opponent does. Does the training going become not practical, no its still very practical Indeed.

In bunkai there is also one thing that must be understood to have the greatest success. The more complicated any technique, the less practical. The more basic, the more realistic and useful. This is true In my experience, of all technuiqes. It is sort of the old "I do not fear a man who knows 1000 kicks, but I fear the man who knows one kick and practiced it 1000 times". There are many great purposes in forms, but to me, not always directly seen even if I call it bunkai, think less specific, think more simplistic, a different set of lessons begin to form in this way of thinking.