"You've Failed!!"

[Harlan]

Once money enters the equation, I think it's a slippery slope. Once you depend on headcount you really are no longer master of the situation. Sure, one can start out with noble intentions, but once the rent goes up it will force a teacher to decide what is more important...teaching or retaining 'clients'. All the tests, belts, tourneys, belt clubs, and semantical and psychological gymnastics only serve to obscure this central fact.

Now, that doesn't mean you have to water down or be a McDojo, either. It just changes your approach to how you advertise or look for students.

[Ohanamalu6]

In the World Martial Arts Association, we don't (often, if at all) fail students, we just don't advance them until they are ready.

I'm a teacher (1stDeg), and I take my students to my instructor (5thDeg) to be assessed for promotion. The student doesn't know about this, of course, but my instructor lets me know a few things they need to work on. He's got the experience to know this, and to be able to see their readiness much more clearly than I.

Only when they have mentally, emotionally, and physically been sufficiently prepared do we announce that they will test at the next event.

So for us, a 'test' is more of a celebration. Oh, everyone is put through their paces at the test, but the outcome - baring a major meltdown - is already determined.

I never have to say "failed" to any of my students, nor have I seen that been said more than once or twice in six years. We just say, "not yet".

[bushido_man96]

Once money enters the equation, I think it's a slippery slope. Once you depend on headcount you really are no longer master of the situation. Sure, one can start out with noble intentions, but once the rent goes up it will force a teacher to decide what is more important...teaching or retaining 'clients'. All the tests, belts, tourneys, belt clubs, and semantical and psychological gymnastics only serve to obscure this central fact.

Now, that doesn't mean you have to water down or be a McDojo, either. It just changes your approach to how you advertise or look for students.

I think a balance can be struck. One can still put through quality students when trying to make ends meet at the same time. If it comes to the point of closing doors or moving to a cheaper location, then that is what should be done instead of sacrificing the quality of what you do.

[DWx]

Once money enters the equation, I think it's a slippery slope. Once you depend on headcount you really are no longer master of the situation. Sure, one can start out with noble intentions, but once the rent goes up it will force a teacher to decide what is more important...teaching or retaining 'clients'. All the tests, belts, tourneys, belt clubs, and semantical and psychological gymnastics only serve to obscure this central fact.

Now, that doesn't mean you have to water down or be a McDojo, either. It just changes your approach to how you advertise or look for students.

I think a balance can be struck. One can still put through quality students when trying to make ends meet at the same time. If it comes to the point of closing doors or moving to a cheaper location, then that is what should be done instead of sacrificing the quality of what you do.

I agree with Brian. It is possible; I always like to use my school as an example of one that makes it work without sacrificing quality. My instructor runs his school as a business; he teaches 6 days a week and its the only job he and his wife have. So in that, he depends on headcount. But headcount doesn't mean he always has to pass people to get them to still train and pay his wages. Last grading we had people fail. Sure some people quit if they then decided they can't hack it but we've always got people waiting in the wings to take their spot in class. Combining great teaching with great marketing (word-of-mouth or otherwise) can help make running a business and producing good students viable.

[ramymensa]

I am not an instructor and haven't failed any grading myself, but our sensei is pretty tough and usually fails at least 20-30% of the people who area allowed to grade. he's always telling them what they've done well and also what needs more work and is always so positive and nice that they do take it well and strive to become better.

[Ueshirokarate]

I am curious, how long does one have to wait to re-test if you fail?

[bushido_man96]

I am curious, how long does one have to wait to re-test if you fail?

We wait another testing cycle. Also, if a student fails a testing, they are not required to pay the testing fees for the next testing. So its not just a money scam off gradings.

[sensei8]

I am curious, how long does one have to wait to re-test if you fail?

We wait another testing cycle. Also, if a student fails a testing, they are not required to pay the testing fees for the next testing. So its not just a money scam off gradings.

For Shindokan, the next testing cycle is the soonest, but, the next testing cycle, for some, will come and go without them having been invited/approved to test. That's just the way it goes.

[Willard814]

I am curious, how long does one have to wait to re-test if you fail?

We wait another testing cycle. Also, if a student fails a testing, they are not required to pay the testing fees for the next testing. So its not just a money scam off gradings.

Good for you! OSO I think it's a shame to have folks test who have no chance of passing and then take their money on top of all that disappointment... can that be considered a ponzi scheme?!?!? lol

[FangPwnsAll7]

My instructor puts a sign up for everyone to see. It lists the word "Passed" with all the students who passed. There's onenext to it that says "Failed" with the people who did not pass.

Somehow I find this method wrong.