training @ black belt level

[Adonis]

Basically after black belt.

Some take to sparring to develop there abilities for movement, and application of the style. As well as go into Scenerio training to work on self defense.

Others go into Kata to get a better understanding of its bunkai and drill its applications to be profienct at it.

Basically you want to ask your self as you reach black belt level. What is your reasons for starting martail artrs training? Have you met those goals yet? What are your reasons for training now? You want to create a game plan or goals (long and short) to develop your self.

It all depends on the invidual some people feel that they accomplished what they wanted from Martail Arts they want to go onto other things in life. Others get frusterated and don't feel they accomplished much or see a value in what they accomplished and quit.

Others feel they can accomplish more and want to make the Martail Arts Journey for the rest of their lives. Martail Arts training can take the rest of your life and then some. So it all depends on the invidual and how long they want to stay on that journey.

[nine_weapons]

Physically one don't get much better from black belt on up IMHO.

I disagree. When you reach black belt level, or that level which you are considered proficient in the basic fundamentals of your particular system, then that is the time that you are really learning "IMHO". I have progressed so much since that time that I can't begin to describe it since getting my BB back in 1978. My reflexes are faster, timing is better, understanding of what I'm doing is phonomenally better, speed and smoothness of my techniques is better...in general, reaching black belt is just the beginning of understanding what your art is all about.

I don't think that necessarily has anything to do with black belt. That is from years of practice and experience. Those things will come naturally. The more you practice, the better you get. It just so happens that as you progress, you are on a path of achieving rank.

Did you know that as a martial artist, you don't reach your peak until your mid-60's? It's true.

says who? that is an opinon based on perspective. Show me ANY martial artist who can enter a fighting competition at that age and win. If you are in your prime, that would dictate that not only are your skills at their peak, but you are also in peak condition, and at 65, this is not the case. I know you stated that this wasn't included in this study you saw, but in order to really reflect peak performance, it would have to be.

[Adonis]

Probably more or so the understanding of what your doing after learning when your young and when your into your 60's you have a deeper understanding of the material. However physically being able to pull off certain moves have deminsihed very much so.

[Zanshin]

I think that the transition through the Dan grades are of great importance. As said before Shodan is foot on the first rung of the ladder. Nidan is confirmation of Shodan.

I was told by a senior Japanese Wado-ka that Sandan should be considered to be the peak of the physical perfection. This of course sort of depends on your age when you started your training.

I think that Yondan and above is where knowledge of your system and your own body should start to harmonise, if that makes sense.

If you can achieve this harmony then your karate can continue to get better as you get older. Hopefully by the time you are sixty or seventy your karate is effortlessly efficient.

[Adonis]

I guess so, I find it more so that after black belt promotion starts to get political. I will leave it at that though. As that can be another thread in and of it self.

[DWx]

Why does there have to be a before and after blackbelt? Why should my training change just because one day I get handed a new belt and someone says "congratulations, you are now a blackbelt"?

IMO your training should be getting tougher and you should be getting better all the time. I don't really think there is a point when you have become a blackbelt. Its like growing, each day I get taller and taller (well not any more but for arguments sake...). Its only a little bit at a time so its not really noticeable on a day-to-day basis but when I compare it to how I was 3 months ago the difference is noticable. This is how I believe my skills should be.

So to answer KNOCKuOUT's orginal question, I don't train any different from what I did before I attained the right to wear a blackbelt, I train differently from yesterday, I train differently from last week... I still do the same number of hours in the dojang as I did when I was pre-blackbelt, I have (and still do) try to work myself more intensively each session to improve my skills as a MAist.

When you are on your path to black belt, you train several times a week, working your way to your goal of black belt.

Personally, I reached a point where a blackbelt itself was no-longer my goal. My new goal was to attain blackbelt but then try to surpass that blackbelt and try to be better than that. It is impossible for me to reach perfection in my skills and understanding but I want to get as close to it as I can. I think this is what keeps me motivated.

As for when you reach your peak, a physical peak is more likely to be when your body reaches its own physical peak so 20s, 30s maybe? Your mental peak may be a lot different to this. I think that most of us have a better understanding of things as we get older but IMO I don't think there is really an exact time when we reach our mental peak. Some people are quite advanced in their mental age and so will reach there peak earlier whereas it will take others longer to grasp concepts and ideas. If it weren't for our bodies eventually taking there toll on our brains, I would be inclined to say that one can never reach their mental peak... They are just my thoughts though, you may disagree or agree with them....

[Adonis]

dwx I agree with the fact that trainign just to get better is important not the belt. Good post!

[Zanshin]

I guess so, I find it more so that after black belt promotion starts to get political. I will leave it at that though. As that can be another thread in and of it self.

The dreaded "P" word.

I know exactly what you mean. I just try to keep my head down, train as hard as my body lets me, and try not to get tangled up with the "management" side of things.

It also depends on how aggressively a school is trying to propagate itself. Sometimes this can lead to junior Dan grades spending too much time developing a new clubs rather than honing their skills.

Difficult one.

[KNOCKuOUT]

I didn't know starting this thread would stir up such controversy. My goal as of right now is to consistently improve my physical fitness and reach black belt. That does not mean that once I reach that point, I will give up on my physical training. I want to forever improve my mental and physical well being, as long as there is always a mentor there to guide me along. I'm not sure if everyone would agree with me on that or not, but it sounds like a good plan to me and I will try to stick by it the best I can. I agree with alot of different things all of you have said. I think maybe after blackbelt, mental training is more of the process, but that's not to say phsical training is thrown aside. As for the politics aspect, I'm not sure I understand what any of you's may mean. Could you explain please?

[Zanshin]

See my post just above yours.