Which takedown do you prefer?

[bushido_man96]

Which style of takedown do you prefer, the crouching type, where you just bend down low, or the drop-and-drive style of takedown found in wrestling styles?

I am curious to know, for my own grappling purposes. I would like to know what the advantages and disadvantages are of each. I would also like to know which you use and why, and if you think one is not recommended over the other.

Thanks!

[AndrewGreen]

Both, but I'm more likely to clinch first then work a takedown. Although I will shoot from the clinch, and I will shoot to get into a clinch.

No better or worse here though, you got to learn both. You may find you are better at certain takedowns, but different people prefer different ones, and different ways of getting them.

[ps1]

Which style of takedown do you prefer, the crouching type, where you just bend down low, or the drop-and-drive style of takedown found in wrestling styles?

Thanks!

"Drop and Drive?" That's not a very accurate description of a good wrestling take down. Wrestlers have excellent sense of timing and distance. What may look like a drop and drive to you is full of technique and form. What do you mean by "bend down low?" There is no good take down that has you bending, you will be choked out. Just like most martial arts, posture is very important in take downs.

I'm not trying to be overly critical, but neither of those describe any good take downs. Try to get with a good Judo instructor or a good wrestling instructor.

The advantage of wrestling take-downs is that they do not utilize the gi in any way.

Judo has a larger variety of take downs that are effective against someone wearing a gi, which can simulate a large coat or clothing.

[bushido_man96]

Which style of takedown do you prefer, the crouching type, where you just bend down low, or the drop-and-drive style of takedown found in wrestling styles?

Thanks!

"Drop and Drive?" That's not a very accurate description of a good wrestling take down. Wrestlers have excellent sense of timing and distance. What may look like a drop and drive to you is full of technique and form. What do you mean by "bend down low?" There is no good take down that has you bending, you will be choked out. Just like most martial arts, posture is very important in take downs.

I'm not trying to be overly critical, but neither of those describe any good take downs. Try to get with a good Judo instructor or a good wrestling instructor.

The advantage of wrestling take-downs is that they do not utilize the gi in any way.

Judo has a larger variety of take downs that are effective against someone wearing a gi, which can simulate a large coat or clothing.

Drop-and-drive was not meant to be negative towards wrestlers. When I wrestled in the 8th grade, the coach had us do drop-and-drive drills to improve on shooting takedowns. You would drop to one knee, and drive at the same time. I know that wrestlers are great athletes, and understand distance and timing very well.

The jujitsu takedowns that I have seen don't use the drop, like wrestlers; they tend to crouch more, maybe not bend over so much, but they don't go to the knee and drive.

I am also not saying that these are the only takedowns in the respective styles. I just wanted some opinions as to who has had success with which kind. Personally, I don't practice a lot of takedowns, and want to start, so opinions will be helpful.

Sorry to cause any confusion.

[ps1]

Drop-and-drive was not meant to be negative towards wrestlers. When I wrestled in the 8th grade, the coach had us do drop-and-drive drills to improve on shooting takedowns. You would drop to one knee, and drive at the same time. I know that wrestlers are great athletes, and understand distance and timing very well.

The jujitsu takedowns that I have seen don't use the drop, like wrestlers; they tend to crouch more, maybe not bend over so much, but they don't go to the knee and drive.

I am also not saying that these are the only takedowns in the respective styles. I just wanted some opinions as to who has had success with which kind. Personally, I don't practice a lot of takedowns, and want to start, so opinions will be helpful.

Sorry to cause any confusion.

Oh I see. Sorry about the confusion on my part.

The drop and drive is called a penetration step.

I like a combination of the two.

I really like a single leg take down as long as it's taught by lacing the leg (really hard to describe here). I don't like the single leg that just grabs the leg. In general, it's a very safe takedown that's why I like it. It also combos with the ankle pic very well.

I also like ko soto gari. In a clinch, it's easy to get your opponent to step back. Then you can just trip em up. This combos well with uchi gari.

Like I said in my prior post. The wrestling take downs don't need the gi. Some of the Jiujitsu/judo takedowns do.

[bushido_man96]

Thank you, ps1. That clarifies things a little. I have Kano's book on Kodokan Judo, and from what I remember, most of the takedowns were from the standing position, and done by breaking the balance of the opponent. However, it has been a while since I looked at it.

[ps1]

Breaking the balance is refered to as Kuzushi. It is of the utmost importance. Kano's book, however, is a little deceiving in that it makes it look like the person throwing breaks the balance. Ideally, you should set it up so that the person being thrown breaks their own balance. That is, you take advantage of the movements they give you. The pushing drills you see in the book are designed to give you a feel for the movements in different directions.

It's a great book, don't get me wrong. It's just not very specific in those regards.

[bushido_man96]

Breaking the balance is refered to as Kuzushi. It is of the utmost importance. Kano's book, however, is a little deceiving in that it makes it look like the person throwing breaks the balance. Ideally, you should set it up so that the person being thrown breaks their own balance. That is, you take advantage of the movements they give you. The pushing drills you see in the book are designed to give you a feel for the movements in different directions.

It's a great book, don't get me wrong. It's just not very specific in those regards.

Yeah, I see what you are saying. Me and my brother toyed with those concepts a little bit, trying to feint each other if you will, and to work the balance off to throw. He was a little better at it than I, but he had some wrestling experience as well.

[ThePhenom]

in a wrestling match you usually need the penetration step but on the street you might skin your knee and your opponent can't sprawl anyway so the bend down low works well.

[bushido_man96]

I think both forms have some variation of the penetration step. However, for self-defense, I would agree that going to a knee would be a bad idea. However, if you both are going to go down anyway, you are bound to get scraped up a little. In one of the BJJ books I read, they talked about not opting for the drop to the knee, for a better defensive posture, or something to that effect.