Meditation?

[BLOWN]

Does anybody here Meditate? I'm heard of it before many times and have an idea on how it's done. But I was/am curious as to what it does. The whole concept of Inhaling positive energy and exhaling bad energy and thoughts. Etc...I'm sure theres other things you can 'inhale and exhale' as well. How you gain positive energy. Nothing distracts you. You feel nothing or pain simply pure concentration.

Am I on the right track? Could someone explain it to me so I can have a better understanding. Is it healthy? Would you guys recomend doing this?

Thanks!

-Ray

[Fairfax_Uechi]

Does anybody here Meditate? I'm heard of it before many times and have an idea on how it's done. But I was/am curious as to what it does. The whole concept of Inhaling positive energy and exhaling bad energy and thoughts. Etc...I'm sure theres other things you can 'inhale and exhale' as well. How you gain positive energy. Nothing distracts you. You feel nothing or pain simply pure concentration.

Am I on the right track? Could someone explain it to me so I can have a better understanding. Is it healthy? Would you guys recomend doing this?

Thanks!

-Ray

Ray,

Wow, what a great question. The short answer is that I meditate. Do I do it enough? NO. Is it healthy? Yes, yes, yes and yes. Do I recommend it? Yes.

Feeling pain? Well there is a certain amount of mind over matter. But given enough pain, and it's very hard to focus it out. Can it be done, sure? If you have a chance, go see senior Uechi students during Sanchin conditioning. The student stands in a Sanchin stance while they are hit, kicked, and attempts are made for them to lose their focus. After enough training this just becomes an exercise even while their skin turns bright red. Anyway, the point is that you can focus and tune things out.

As for the positive energy. Look at it this way. Tomorrow, as you wake up. Before you do anything stop. Focus on the ceiling, and slowly breath in and out. Concentrate on relaxing. Then slowly focus on your breath. Think about how you feel good, and how you're going to have a great day. Then after a few minutes, get up and see how your day is.

Now today, after lunch, think about your day so far. Focus on something that went wrong. Really think how crummy your day is. Stay focused on this and how it ruined the rest of your day. My bet is that if you try this the rest of your day will be pretty crummy. [so I'd recommend really not doing this, but thinking about when you have]

The point is that you can control things with what you believe. As for the actual energy and things that you breath in and out. Well, I'm still working with this, but can say that the more I meditate the better I am. What I was taught is to breath in the good, and expell the bad.

[BLOWN]

Does anybody here Meditate? I'm heard of it before many times and have an idea on how it's done. But I was/am curious as to what it does. The whole concept of Inhaling positive energy and exhaling bad energy and thoughts. Etc...I'm sure theres other things you can 'inhale and exhale' as well. How you gain positive energy. Nothing distracts you. You feel nothing or pain simply pure concentration.

Am I on the right track? Could someone explain it to me so I can have a better understanding. Is it healthy? Would you guys recomend doing this?

Thanks!

-Ray

Ray,

Wow, what a great question. The short answer is that I meditate. Do I do it enough? NO. Is it healthy? Yes, yes, yes and yes. Do I recommend it? Yes.

Feeling pain? Well there is a certain amount of mind over matter. But given enough pain, and it's very hard to focus it out. Can it be done, sure? If you have a chance, go see senior Uechi students during Sanchin conditioning. The student stands in a Sanchin stance while they are hit, kicked, and attempts are made for them to lose their focus. After enough training this just becomes an exercise even while their skin turns bright red. Anyway, the point is that you can focus and tune things out.

As for the positive energy. Look at it this way. Tomorrow, as you wake up. Before you do anything stop. Focus on the ceiling, and slowly breath in and out. Concentrate on relaxing. Then slowly focus on your breath. Think about how you feel good, and how you're going to have a great day. Then after a few minutes, get up and see how your day is.

Now today, after lunch, think about your day so far. Focus on something that went wrong. Really think how crummy your day is. Stay focused on this and how it ruined the rest of your day. My bet is that if you try this the rest of your day will be pretty crummy. [so I'd recommend really not doing this, but thinking about when you have]

The point is that you can control things with what you believe. As for the actual energy and things that you breath in and out. Well, I'm still working with this, but can say that the more I meditate the better I am. What I was taught is to breath in the good, and expell the bad.

That all sounds extremly intersting. The main prupose why I would like to get into it is basically to work on my conentration and relax myself. I'm sure you've all seen the movie BloodSport. Before th eKumite begins Jean Claude Van Dam is doing the splits over chairs and doing some sort of kata. He looked extremly relaxed and conentrating on something. Nothing was distractiing him. Granted it's a movie, hes a MA and im sure he does it in real life as well. I'll give your advice a try.

Thanks homie!

-Ray

[Spirit At Choice]

There's lots of good information of meditation out there. I'll shy away from the religious hair-splitting on this issue, but I truly believe that meditation is just another form of prayer and that chi/God/energy are simply different ways of understanding the same concept.

Medical science has proven that prayer and meditation absolutely do impact your health and wellbeing. What you believe you can do, you most certainly can do. And whether you call that great power God, chi or any other name, it is available to you.

A good resource on meditation is Ram Dass' book... the name escapes me now. But do not give up on prayer, in whatever form works for you. Prayer, yoga, chanting, mantras, breath work, walking, don jon... it's all a different means to the same end.

[italian_guy]

I think this discussion is very interesting I like to hear more about it!

In the past I did more then one year of martial Tai Chi Chuan (Yang Style) but I felt no benefit from meditation or from the art itself. I don't think that meditation is a bunch of crap but I think is hard to find some teacher that teach it properly.

However I'm very interested in Internal aspects of MA, now I'm doing a karate style which has some internals (Goju ryu) but the only thing we practice time to time is some breathig exercise at rest (in seiza position) and of course the two chi kung katas (Sanchin and Tensho).

[rs_coble]

I believe meditation has its benefits, but I think the worst advice someone can give you is to empty your mind completely, because you never know what you might let in. There is alot of spiritual forces in this world and we don't understand the majority of what is going on. I am a christian and not trying to say that it is wrong to meditate, but you have to be ready to accept the consequences of doing things the wrong way. This is just my belief and I am not trying to offend anyone, so tell me what you all think about this.

[Fairfax_Uechi]

I think this discussion is very interesting I like to hear more about it!

In the past I did more then one year of martial Tai Chi Chuan (Yang Style) but I felt no benefit from meditation or from the art itself. I don't think that meditation is a bunch of crap but I think is hard to find some teacher that teach it properly.

Well the simplest thing is to think of it as relaxation. Think about clearing your mind and just let your thoughts "be". Think about your everyday, you're probably thinking about the wife, kids, money, job, or something else. What if you just slow down the thoughts, and then learn to "listen". Once you can do this you can really begin to understand meditation. Like I said, I'm a long way from it, but I understand the concepts and have on a few occasions made some decent progress.

[Fairfax_Uechi]

I believe meditation has its benefits, but I think the worst advice someone can give you is to empty your mind completely, because you never know what you might let in. There is alot of spiritual forces in this world and we don't understand the majority of what is going on. I am a christian and not trying to say that it is wrong to meditate, but you have to be ready to accept the consequences of doing things the wrong way. This is just my belief and I am not trying to offend anyone, so tell me what you all think about this.

Actually empty your mind means to slow down your thoughts. As I said above, the idea is to not control your thoughts, but to be able to listen. One thing I find very offensive about some "Christians" is that they have no concept of meditation and prayer. What these people don't understand is that medation has a long history and goes back all the way through the Bible.

I don't think you can really meditate wrong. You can try and not get anything out of it, but like all things that are hard, you will fail many times before being able to do it "correctly". As I've said, I'm still learning to meditate and I've been working at it for 10 years. And it will probably be another 10 years before I'm just good at it. And another 10 before I master it. But it's ok, as it's a journey not a destination.

[Menjo]

I believe meditation has its benefits, but I think the worst advice someone can give you is to empty your mind completely, because you never know what you might let in. There is alot of spiritual forces in this world and we don't understand the majority of what is going on. I am a christian and not trying to say that it is wrong to meditate, but you have to be ready to accept the consequences of doing things the wrong way. This is just my belief and I am not trying to offend anyone, so tell me what you all think about this.

Actually empty your mind means to slow down your thoughts. As I said above, the idea is to not control your thoughts, but to be able to listen. One thing I find very offensive about some "Christians" is that they have no concept of meditation and prayer. What these people don't understand is that medation has a long history and goes back all the way through the Bible.

I don't think you can really meditate wrong. You can try and not get anything out of it, but like all things that are hard, you will fail many times before being able to do it "correctly". As I've said, I'm still learning to meditate and I've been working at it for 10 years. And it will probably be another 10 years before I'm just good at it. And another 10 before I master it. But it's ok, as it's a journey not a destination.

My take on meditation is quite different from this.

I got this qoute from a book which got it from the Tao te Ching, I think its defitnaly worth a read.

"He diminishs it and again diminishes it, till he arrives at doing nothing( on purpose). Having arrived at this point of non-action, there is nothing which he does not do."

Now this is has a religious background in it so hold on:

Although I'm not of the religion or any religion holding this value, I do hold the value of the ideal. I relate it to meditation, if you can reach this point(the qoute stated) then the desired meditation would be acheived...yet not...

Other ideas I've read from similar writings and qoutes showed that one idea of meditation is to have the mind in a thoughtless, yet aware state.

The classic "empty gourd on water example I think would be a sound example for this section. This qourd on water ideal pretty much says that if you touch(push down) a qourd on water than it will move, constantly if you try to move it, it will keep moving. This is supposed to relate to your mind, which at an elightened state, would never "taint" itself with distractions. This would also mean someone would have to not focus on trying to release thier mind as this would be "tainting" in its own sense.

I'm sure somewhere in KF this(general idea of the post) has already been portrayed, but I thought it could give a base on to those who have mixed ideas on this area.

Just thought it was interesting.

In response to Fair_fax's recent post:

When you say some people have no conept or little concept of prayer or meditation, now give me slack because I have no idea on the chirstian religion so maybe I'm defying a sound rule, but meditation for the average person doesnt mean clearing the mind or even slowing thoughts.

Meditation for those who are untrained, is a way just to relax. Saying that there is a correct way could be very condrary to your own statements(if I understood your point correctly). So what I mean is that even though someone thinks they are on a certain path, they are on a path none the less... their desired destination is deluded( I guess this could apply to all sorts of thing), however they still achive(hopefully), some sort of accomplishment, in thier own sort of way.

[SatyagrahaKF]

Meditation is truly a beautiful experience if you can enter into it. Your question about not being able to feel pain during meditation is that you will feel it but it feels good. In other words, it is simply there. One method I used to do, but have stopped because it leaves a bad scar is getting someone I know who is a smoker to burn his ciggarette out on my leg, or arm, etc. The technique is to center yourself into the pain, and concetrate on the fact that it is your body that is being burnt. This can also be done with a pin, I suggest that you first become proficient at getting into a state of meditation before attempting this. However, when done the feeling of the burn is good! To get into meditation, try sitting in a comfortable position with your back straight and as you breath in, send your breath into your stomach into the dan tian region. When the breath goes in, your conscious should follow. As you breathe out, follow it out and gently pull in your abdomen. This is a Buddhist technique and it really works well. Just try to find that point where the breath is neither coming in or leaving. That point is where you are. It might help to visual your breath as chi which is what practicioners of neikung or chikung do often. Good Luck my friend.