Here is a challenge

[usatkdwtf]

Weight lifting DEFINETLY builds power and strength in the MA. They work the same fibers.

As far as the squats, weighted squats would be much better. If one quy did these for a month, and another did weighted (assuming guys are equal size/strength to start with) then the weighted squat guy would be stronger, and have developed more strength. By far.

I would bet money on that.

[Sam]

That was REALLY REALLY difficult - sorry to skip past the debate... tried the 500 thing last night, didnt quite make it, lol,

got to 410 and fell over.... couldnt quite walk that wll

[Aodhan]

Weight lifting DEFINETLY builds power and strength in the MA. They work the same fibers.

As far as the squats, weighted squats would be much better. If one quy did these for a month, and another did weighted (assuming guys are equal size/strength to start with) then the weighted squat guy would be stronger, and have developed more strength. By far.

I would bet money on that.

And you'd win.

The issue is what kind of strength you are developing, at least from what I'm reading from everyone. Even with weights, if you don't do them explosively, you are developing the slow twitch fibers more than anything. This will result in a very powerful kick, but it may not necessarily be a fast kick. You'd need to do plyo's and speed drills to develop that aspect of it.

Aodhan

[AnonymousOne]

Weight lifting DEFINETLY builds power and strength in the MA. They work the same fibers.

As far as the squats, weighted squats would be much better. If one quy did these for a month, and another did weighted (assuming guys are equal size/strength to start with) then the weighted squat guy would be stronger, and have developed more strength. By far.

I would bet money on that.

And you'd win.

The issue is what kind of strength you are developing, at least from what I'm reading from everyone. Even with weights, if you don't do them explosively, you are developing the slow twitch fibers more than anything. This will result in a very powerful kick, but it may not necessarily be a fast kick. You'd need to do plyo's and speed drills to develop that aspect of it.

Aodhan

You are 100% correct.

Thats why complex training is so valuable. When I say complex training I mean:

One set of fast explosive bench press followed by say one set of plyometric pushups

Or

One set of fast explosive squats followed by one set of squat jumps

[Aodhan]

Anonymous-

Yes, and it's also important to train the fast twitch fibers first. Fast twitch is easily recruited, and also easily exhausted. If you do slow reps/heavy weights for a while before you go to plyo and explosive training, then it's very likely your fast twitch fibers are already exhausted and not enlisted for training.

Explosive/speed drills first, then followed by the core strength training.

Aodhan

[DaChroniclez]

I am not talking about the kind of power and strength needed to lift massive weights, that is useless to the MA. I am talking about the kind of power needed by a MA.

Apparently you've never taken hits from a really big guy.

I have, and I've also taken hits from guys much smaller, and i can tell you, aswell as any other experienced martial artist here that being bigger doesnt mean having more power. It does effect your power, but only to a certain extent. I've sparred guys that are very skinny and tall, and can hit like a freight truck. to have lots of power you must first train technique, then train speed, and then last train strength, strength is the smallest variable in achieving great power in your attacks.

[Martial_Artist]

EDIT: *This is a response to an earlier post.*

You confuse power with strength.

The ability to benchpress, for example, a lot of weight does not translate into power when hitting.

Because you can PUSH a lot of weight does not mean you can PUNCH a lot weight.

There are different mechanics involved. A punch and a kick are nothing of the similiar to lifting heavy weights.

This is not to say one should not develop strength. A strong body is requisite for the true martial artist. But, for the scope of this topic it is a misconception to believe that the ability to lift a lot of weight is what is responsible for power in strikes.

[Hudson]

Wait, are we talking about a push or a strike?

Bigger, more powerful guys tend to have a lot more push - when we count speed into it, I know small guys who have such lightning fast kicks that they can near bend a heavy bag in half on impact.

But, that being said, muscle size also correlates into speed and strength, and generally, the bigger the muscle, the faster it gets, the stronger it gets. The ratio of size to speed to strength isn't always the same, but it's very simple if you think about it.

A bigger muscle can harness more muscle fibers then a smaller muscle, producing more strength. More strength pushed against the same weight results in greater speed.

Obviously there is an issue of density as well, and bodybuilders do realize this. That's why many champions do hard, powerlifting exercises on certain days (or weeks, depending on how they schedule). It gives a more solid, dense look.

So, yes, a guy with great muscular endurance is well conditioned. But a bigger guy with the same endurance is even more so better off. It should be obvious that you need all sorts of different training for different aspects of your musculature.

(Sorry, this post is kind of messy. It's how I think.)