getting lean on starvation diet.

[k4karate]

I was handed down a biography written about Bruce Lee from my brother's friend who studied Bjj for 10 years.

 

A big chunk of the book was dedicated on the journals he kept while training. In it, there was mention of how Bruce use to starve while he trained, yet still gained muscle and obviously lost fat. Basically, it was contradicting the theory of "no food=no muscle".

 

I want to try a variant of this. You see, I've just returned to university, I have very difficult classes this semester and i know i wont have time to cook as much or train as hard. i typically eat more when i'm stressed. i'm pretty fit (16% bodyfat), not over weight (as of yet) and i don't want to fall off my routine. i have a very healthy diet, i normally cook everything from scratch, whole grains only, lots of veggies, no medication of any kind, no sugar or processed foods or fast food ect. However, besides fish, i was raised vegetarian and i consume a high quantity of complex grains to feel satisfied. I've never had a problem gaining weight due to the high volume of complex-carbs because i have a very athletic lifestyle. I wouldn't stay on this plan for more than 3 months, i just want to lower my bodyfat a little so even if i do fall off my routine, i will have more muscle and less fat and thus, calories will burn a little better.

 

but as i read through this health and fitness forum, cutting my cals drastically would mean weight gain. or does it?

[Rich67]

I never heard of this study, but I have some serious issues with the validity of Bruce's-or the biographer's claims. First of all, components needed to gain muscle include resistance, rest, and nutrients. Now, we know that Bruce had the resistance and quite possibly the rest. But if he was starving himself with NO nutrient uptake, his body would essentially have to "cannabalize" itself in order to rebuild and repair his muscles during the rest phase. However, Bruce was quite lean, and had very little fat stores to draw upon. This would then cause his muscles to break down and actually weaken instead of bulk. A good example of this would be the Ironman triathletes who are all so thin they almost look sickly. They cannot feed their bodies sufficiently and end up in a constant state of caloric depletion. Now if Bruce then loaded up on calories and carbs after this "phase", he may have been able to gain muscle and lose fat, but his timing would need to be right on, and the theory of "no food=muscle" is inaccurate. Also, HOW did he arrive at the conclusion he gained muscle? Was this based purely on how he looked and felt? If so, there is no way to prove that theory. The only way to tell would be by body composition testing to determine his lean body mass before and after the starvation mode. If he did in fact measure it in this manner (hydrostatic weighing being the most accurate way to measure this) those results should be in the book. Let me know if there was any scientific method used or indicated in the book- I'm just curious, but I disagree that it is possible to EFFECTIVELY gain lean muscle mass without feeding the machine.

[Rich67]

but as i read through this health and fitness forum, cutting my cals drastically would mean weight gain. or does it?

As far as this goes, you may be misinterpreting:

 

Cutting calories WILL cause you to lose weight, regardless. There is nothing wrong with cutting calories as long as you do it CONSISTENTLY. In order to do it right (with no ill effects to you or energy levels), you must determine your BMI. You have to also take into account your fitness goals and activity lever when determining your BMI. BMI tells you approx how many calories you need a day to MAINTAIN your weight. If you want to lose weight, you create a calorie deficit by reducing food intake or upping physical activity.

 

The problem is, many people simply STARVE themselves. If their BMI says to take in 3,000 caloires a day, they drop to 1,500. Bad,bad,bad. You don't need to be so drastic. What happens then (in layman's terms), is people do this for a month or so, and do it on and off. But in between this type of calorie reduction, they resume or EXCEED what their normal BMI should be. When you reduce calories, your metabolism slows and more energy is stored in your fat cells to fuel your body during the day. Many people lose weight, but this is usually mainly due to muscle loss. Remember, the body's primary responsibility is to save itself-muscle mass is NOT a priority! Then, when normal/excessive coloric intake resumes, the metabolism stays low and more energy is stored in fat cells in case the body is again starved. This is the body's self preservation mechanism we have from centuries of evolution. Yo-Yo dieting is what it's called...check it out on the web. It's not good for you and it is no way to lose weight properly.

[k4karate]

rich67, thank you for your reply, and as i thought, it makes sense.

 

the book was refering to starving for short term only.

 

if i remember correctly, it was more about decipline than, gaining muscle.

 

they went into it more specifically than i could remember to explain.

 

but i do remember that the claim was made that muscle can be gained with no food intake.

 

please remeber that this book was written by/with former students of Bruce, and i would never claim that Bruce said any of these things.

 

however, as i am not too knowledgable about this topic, i wont do it.

 

i have however reduced my cals somewhat, just not too greatly.

[Rich67]

Yeah, that's the way to do it. I mean, you don't necessarily have to reduce cals as long as you are upping your cardio regimen. Then you can still create a calorie deficit without eating less. But I still think the "starvation" thing can be a little extreme. Good luck!

[Shorin Ryuu]

Well, at 16 percent body fat, you have a lot of body fat to lose without worrying about losing too much. However, as mentioned, you must still ensure that you are gaining the proper nutrients for just an overall healthy lifestyle. Your diet does some somewhat similar to mine, by the way. I'm not a vegetarian, but I only eat meat (non-fish) once every other week or so.

 

To burn fat while exercising (unless you do something which I consider foolish, like the Atkins plan), you need to intake carbs. But if you are simply thinking about cutting back on your calories, maybe you want to eat more low calorie foods instead (but not necessarily starve yourself).

 

Now as far as free time goes...you always have time to train, if you really want it. Trust me, I had 22, 24 credit hour semesters back in college, and still managed to train several hours a day (voluntarily, and on top of the other demands of a military academy on my time...). It's all a matter of priority. Fortunately, if you're just concerned about gaining fat, you can just bike or run for half an hour a day and not worry about it. Half an hour a day really isn't that much.

[steveb]

Just one note about the BMI charts. If you have an athletic build the charts will not be accurate for you. They only take into account body weight, not the composition of that weight. Someone who is 6' tall, 200lbs with low body fat would be considered overweight, bordering on obese according to their charts. That same 6' tall person would have to lose nearly 25 lbs of muscle to reach the upper edge of their acceptable weight range.

[Rich67]

^ good point.

[k4karate]

I must say, i do not have alot of bodyfat.

 

My bodyfat percentage came in at 16%, but i think it has to do with

 

the amount of muscle on my legs.

 

though, i could stand to lower it somewhat.

 

I wanted to lower my calorie intake because it mainly comes from complex carbs, which i find takes longer to digest, therefore

 

i tend to feel sluggish and slow after meals. i can't seem to motivate myself to train between school and work,

 

so wouldn't cutting some complex carbs out help?

 

PS. Atkins is not a option for me.....ever!

 

Thanks!

[Rich67]

Complex carbs cannot be left out of your diet, providing you burn those carbs! Now, if you go out to lunch and have a piece of bread, pasta, and a soda, you're killing yourself with carbs. I am not a fan of Atkins, since I believe it is one of those "quick fix" diets that lends itself to yo-yo dieting and inevitable weight gain. You gotta eat your carbs! But try this:

 

Whenever you eat complex carbs, mix proteins and fats in proportion to them. If I eat carbs, like a plate of baked ziti, I make sure I don't have a carb-loaded drink and make sure I eat protein with it. A piece of sliced chicken breast on your pasta is a good way to do this. Or even meatballs on the spaghetti. Even melted cheese can cut balance the carbs and add some fat and protein to your carb meal. But always remember- carbs will convert to sugar and be stored as fat if you don't use them! Eat a heavy carb meal about 24 hours prior to rigorous physical activity. When I say rigorous, I'm talking an hour or more of serious cardio and muscular output (grappling workouts, other MA workouts, triathlons, etc). If you just lift without sweating in a gym for 45 minutes (the majority of "lifters" in Gold's Gym on a given night), the carbs WILL become fat...you're not pushing them enough to burn. Otherwise, just keep the carb intake MINIMAL. Stay away from heaping plates of pasta- PORTION CONTROL is key- about the size of your fist is a good rule. Avoid eating more than 2 slices of bread a day, eat cereal for breakfast for energy, and eat lots of veggies for lunch and dinner. That way, you still get the healthy benefits of carbs without the excessive energy surplus if you don't burn them off fast enough. Regular soda and pasta are physique killers. Eliminate regular sodas and sport drinks- drink water, Crystal Light, and diet caffeine free sodas... eat pasta salads in moderation, and try to avoid the Italian restaurants all but a couple days a month. Furthermore, up the cardio to 40-50 minutes 5 or 6 times a week.