Crosstraining across Japanese and Chinese MA's

[Spaceman]

I see a lot of people who do Japanese MA's, and a lot who do Chinese.

 

The two, to me, seem to have very different esthetics.

 

I don't think I've seen anyone on the board, though, who trains between a Japanese MA and a Chinese MA, or who started in one nationality and then trained in another.

 

Why is that? And who has done that?

 

Why aren't they ever mixed?

[Luckykboxer]

they are mixed.

 

American Kenpo has aspects from both styles, Japanese and Chinese and has included them into the system.

 

I am sure that it isnt the only style either.

 

I think that alot of people who are into the traditional styles work hard to master that particular style, and since mastering a style takes a lifetime, and since there are other aspects that may prevent someone from cross training... like availablity or cost etc. that you dont see alot of people doing it.

 

the biggest reason i see people cross training in different styles is for competition in MMA matches, and usually they are not crosstraining in traditional forms of either system but rather in some form of grappling... usually BJJ atm.... and some form of striking..... usually kickboxing and boxing.

 

I see people tossing in things like Tai Chi but unfortunately i think that the peopel who take the traditional styles.... on the most part there are obviously exceptions.... take that style for as long as they can

[Vito]

Yeah, pretty much. The traditional styles that people actually take seriously tend to become a life style, as well as a "complete system" in itself (allegedly) so doing do is redundant if not impossible. At least thats how I understand it. (Im a MMA guy.)

[Kyle-san]

I've trained more heavily in Japanese systems and had some minor experience with Chinese ones. I took what I liked best about them and attempted to apply it to my overall outlook on martial arts and how I fight.

[italian_guy]

I do Goju-ryu karate (Okinawan, Japanese) and Tai chi chuan. (chinese) in two different schools. They are quite different, TCC in the beginning is mostly forms and some basics, we start application and pushing hands only after 2.5 years of training so I'm doing it mostly as a form of gymnastic now, very useful also for the other martial art because it improves my flexibility and it help me being loose ( I heve the tendecy of tensing too much). There are some little conflicts on how to execute basic techniques but the conflics are still manegeable. In the end they will be an amost purely striking art with soft and hard elements (go-ju ryu) and a mix of grappling and striking soft art (tai chi chuan) so I hope that they mix togheter well. I'm a beginner in both (yellow belt karate, 5th chi TCC).

[Drunken Monkey]

ignoring such variable as techniques and theories

 

(cos well, any two styles no matter the country of origin are going to haev differences)

 

the biggest difference between a chinese class and a japanese class is in the structure of the class.

 

with the exception of jujutsu, the japanese styles i have seen run in a very organised fashion with lots of little 'customs' and a clear structure/syllabus.

 

the chinese classes are more 'free' (organic might be a better word) that has an idea of what you should be learning but not a clear teaching strategy.

 

i can't explain it but i feel more relaxed in a chinese class (not teaching little ducks style)

 

but that might be because of my background.

 

i guess the basic/simple reason for the clear distinction between the two is because they have their base in vastly different cultures.

 

it's kinda like asking why iado and fencing don't mix.

[italian_guy]

DM I do not understand your point. What do you mean by organized fashion? In my case karate give more importance to general body training and conditioning which is basically longer preparation exercises(pushups, more flexibility exercises, abs exercises, more endurance training etc.) while the training in tai chi chuan school varies with the period of the year but is not as physically heavy like in karate. I do not think that this difference is due to the country of origin but mostly to the nature of the art itself and the average age of the students (about 24-25 in karate, and around 35-40 in TCC).

[Drunken Monkey]

organised as in well structured.

 

class has a clear hierachy as seen in students' placement in the room.

 

the dojo has a clear layout.

 

proper bowing in and out.

 

'ceremony'.

 

organised as seen in the forms with their progressive nature (it is almost the same but with an added or variant move).

 

the typical chinese class does not have such rules as seen in the typical japanes karate class.

 

bowing is more relaxed and more often than not, ommited

 

(unless you're part of a class that bows to kwang yee but that is a totally different matter...).

 

the forms aren't as progressive compared to to the japanese katas.

 

as i say, this is mainly beacuse of the basic teaching methods of both cultures.

 

in the japanese culture, the sensei really is a teacher.

 

whereas in the chinese culture, the student is more of a son to the sifu who guides.

 

like i said, i was ignoring the actual training involved because well, like i said:

 

take any two styles and there will be differences, even if they are from the same country.

[wing chun kuen man]

Spaceman,

 

Let me tell you about my personal experience. When I started training traditional Wing Chun, I had about 3 months of Shotokan Karate training under my belt. I continued to progress in karate as I practiced in Wing Chun. Eventually, the two came into conflict. The main reason for this was the fact than in Wing Chun you need to be extremely relaxed while performing the techniques. I am sure that how relaxed you are varies between the various styles of the system but take my word for it that in our school you needed to perform the techniques in an extremely relaxed manner. On the other hand in Shotokan it was hardness that was emphasized and many of the tension priciples were different. To switch mindlsets between the two MA´s was not very easy and eventually I chose to stay with the Wing Chun. It is a pity that I could not do both, because the Shotokan school was a very good and authentic school. I would have liked to have been able to practice both - not because I believe in cross training, because I don´t (not the way it is sold nowadays anyway) - because I was lucky enough to find 2 great instructors within walking distance of each other, and also because I am striking/hitting kind of a guy.

 

Anyway that was my reason for not doing both chinese and japanese MA at the same time.

 

Wing Chun Kuen Man