The complaining thread

[Drunken Monkey]

basic gist=car makers in the u.s get away with selling crap.

 

the same car makers sell good versions of the crap cars in the rest of the world.

 

who is to blame?

 

the car makers?

 

or the buyers?

 

the thing with the EVO.

 

let's use martial arts to illustrate.

 

style A teaches a complete syllabus all over the world.

 

however, in one country, the most important aspect of the syllabus is omitted completely but still call's it self the complete system A.

 

that's basically what is happening.

[ZR440]

Here is the 2004 vehicle dependability study for North American vehicles.

 

http://www.jdpower.com/studies/pressrelease.asp?StudyID=860&CatID=1

[Drunken Monkey]

well....

 

those surveys aren't always a true representation of what's going on.

 

a lot of things depend on the age of the car.

 

take the new mini.

 

in it's first outing, they regularly set themselves on fire.

 

this was quickly fixed following a mass recall.

 

BUT

 

all minis following that (very big) probelm have been pretty much trouble free.

 

in any case, did you notice that in the top 5 VDS rankings, four of them are foreign in origin....

 

and three of them (honda, porsche+bmw), don't make cars for specific markets.

[ZR440]

True, but this survey was conducted for three year old vehicles, I think. I'd also like to see a follow up in another three years on those same vehicles.

 

Might be foreign in origin, but increasingly engineered and made in the USA.

 

I guess I'm not understanding you when you say Honda isn't making cars for certain markets, and you include Porsche with BMW.

[Drunken Monkey]

(it should be 'honda+bmw+porsche)

 

i mean, the bmw range is more or less the same all over the world.

 

same with porsche and honda, except honda have used the same platform to make the odd car or two specifically/mainly for the u.s. (i.e honda legend)

 

AND with honda, even when they make a car for the u.s market, they don't just go and make a bigger car, they go the whole shebang and develope a new AWD system at the same time.

 

honda seem to be following the bmw route and making a single range of cars for the whole world, as is toyota.

 

the other car makers, make cars that do not sell anywhere other than in the u.s.

 

Might be foreign in origin, but increasingly engineered and made in the USA

 

well, the thing is, i'm not saying that everything they make is poo.

 

just that there is more of the ones that are poo being sold under lots of different names.

 

i mean, i think ideally, there should be no poo and just maybe 5 or 6 models or cars from each manufacturer that are good.

 

y'know, i'd rather have a more limited choice of good cars than to have a bigger range of cars that might not all be as good.

[ZR440]

Sounds to me like your country gets the leftovers that nobody cares about. Makes sense though. Most car companies are going to target the US market first and foremost because of all the money involved.

[battousai16]

actually, i think his whole point was that the reverse is true.

[DLopez]

the car manufacturers know this and hence sell you guys big steaming piles of poo and you don't complain.

 

instead, you eagerly await the next, newer bigger pile of steaming poo.

 

That may be true for some vehicles, but I owned two Toyotas before I had it with the expensive parts repairs when things did break, and went back to a domestic vehicle.

 

Lessee, less frequent but more expensive repairs (Toyota) vs. more frequent but less expensive repairs (GM).

 

Does it really matter how good quality is, if in the end, repairs cost practically the same?

 

I've since eliminated 80% of the repair costs by performing them myself now!

[Drunken Monkey]

it's expensive to fix a toyota?

 

well, like i said elsewhere, i've only just realised that our car industries are too different to be able to compare things directly.

 

let's just say, toyota is cheap with regards to all facets of upkeep over here as well as having the best after-sales care.

 

but then cheap doesn't mean good.....

 

the thing about costs is that their 'worth' depends on how much you earn and what you drive.

 

i mean, the poor student who pays £30 for an oil change once a year at his garage is going to go spare when he finds out that his dream ferrari needs a £100 (not done in a garage mind you and hence much cheaper) worth of oil every 3 months.

[DLopez]

i've only just realised that our car industries are too different to be able to compare things directly.

 

Britain still makes autos? Does the mini-Cooper really count as an auto?

 

Just kidding!!

 

When I visited Ireland for 3 months, it appeared to me that the driving factor behind the choice of most Europeans of which auto to purchase, had more to do with gas economy, and not so much quality of build. Of course, you still have those that can afford luxury autos like here in the States, but the "expensive" cars I saw in Ireland were not of British make... is that not the way it is on your side of the Irish Sea?