cross Posted June 2, 2004 Posted June 2, 2004 You might be thinking of "STRIVE for perfection of character" which means its a constant process, and to be honest with you I havnt met anyone who has perfected his or her character.
Heian Posted June 27, 2004 Posted June 27, 2004 "Shotokan only for sports" I TRULY resent that.. I've been studying Shotokan for 6 years.. and I've run into Shotokanist martial artist who can kill you with their pinky.. I don't know what Shotokan YOU'RE talking about.. but we study some pretty nasty ways of dealing damage.. My sensei defeated martial artists from Tae Kwan Doe, muay Tai, ninjitsu, you name it.. We got one of the nastiest killers in the country. In other words.. Dont' go around saying Shotokan is for sports .. it's a bitter generalization that comes , if you ask me, out of lack of knowledge. Jijutsu Yori Shinjutsu (Spirit before technique)"..The way, who will walk it clear and pure?"-Gichin Funakushi, founder of Shotokan.
wing chun kuen man Posted June 30, 2004 Posted June 30, 2004 Hello Heian, I don´t know anything about the Oshima style of Shotokan, is it more tradition/martial oriented than the JKA variety? Do you have full contact sparring? Does your style follow the "one punch one kill" philosophy? I am just very curious. Your comments will be appreciated. Wing Chun Kuen Man Real traditional martial arts training is difficult to find.....most dojos in the west are Mcdojos....some are better and some are worst....but they are what they are....do you train in one?
Heian Posted June 30, 2004 Posted June 30, 2004 Sorry for the slow response. I'm a soldier in the IAF (Israeli Defense Forces) but luckily I get to be at home 4 days a week. (so far). Anyhow, the Oshima style of Funakushi is a much less so to say "westernized" version of JKA.. The Shotokan method we do in Israel (where I live) is usually quite different than what's being done in JKA.. form what I've heard, JKA has become so enormously widespread, that I can't really give you a good assessment on how JKA is different from Oshima-style Shotokan. What I do know that in our method we have a very aggressive training regime, we have what is called "special trainings" which are basically biannual training sessions done in winter and summer , both at least 3 days-long, with each practice taking about 3-4 hours to complete (One nasty little bugger, I've done them twice and I'm still recuperating). Since Israel is a fairly small country , almost all if not truly all of our dojos are consistent in their method of teaching, which, in many respects, is drawn from Master Oshima himself. In the dojo so far, we've practiced things like To-ri-te (escape techniques) , some elements in Judo (pretty much like To-ri-te only with more full-body element) ground-sparring (it's called "iai" in Japanese, it is, in fact, a part of the dan 2 test in our system) and when we go into the general "throng" Karate, we do full-contact sparring. At least that's what it's been for the better lot of the time, when the kiddies learn how to spar we give them protective equipment so they won't kill each other, but it's very uncommon for higher ranks to wear them. .Plus, this "forbid to hit someone in the face" stuff is quite unheard of.. My sensei once got kicked in his crotch during Kumite once , he laughingly said that that's one of the most amazingly excruciating times of his life The training regime includes kata training into very extreme nuiances (up to points where the sensei says :"you should put your back leg 5 more degrees forward during Kokutsu dachi)" the sparring training has no mercy for those who can't keep up, which I can attest, being beat up at 13 years old by a frightning dan 3 I really don't know about JKA much, but in Shotokan Israel, which is Oshima style as far as we know it.. we strive for perfect precision (and we've won global contests numerous times for that), KILLER combative ability and inner strength and tranquility.. I can truly say that I've been a totally different person before I started training.. I was timid, unambitious, shy and quite cowardly.. Now I'm a lot more confident, open-minded, courageous and resilient. I have seen similar change in many Karateka in the dojo area I go to and at this point I know one guy in my age who's a couple a ranks higher than me (I'm Sankyu, he's Shodan) who is currently in the Isreali naval commando (something that has EXTREMELY BRUTAL entry exams) another guy in a special covert unit I can't really disclose on much (let's just say that he once GRAPPLED (!!!!!) a suicide bomber ) So, in other words.. to say that Shotokan , as a whole, is not useful for real life combat, is a very generalized and false remark. If you want to know any more about Shotokan do ask, I can talk about this for hours! Jijutsu Yori Shinjutsu (Spirit before technique)"..The way, who will walk it clear and pure?"-Gichin Funakushi, founder of Shotokan.
aefibird Posted June 30, 2004 Posted June 30, 2004 Heian, would you say that there's more of a focus on sparring and street defence than on kata in your dojo, or is the balance between kata & sparring pretty equal? Also, do you do much 'sport' type fighting or is more geared towards self-defence than point sparring? Thanks. "Was it really worth it? Only time and death may ever tell..." The Beautiful South - The Rose of My CologneSheffield Steelers!
wing chun kuen man Posted June 30, 2004 Posted June 30, 2004 Hello Heian, Thank you for your response. It looks like you are practicing a REAL style of karate, that has the bushido spirit and great variety of techniques (grappling and etc.) making it a complete system. I think the image of shotokan just being sport is a result of Shotokan´s popularity in the west where winning competitions has become the main focus of many practitioners, at the expense of the martial side. Mcdojos have played their part probably (as always). Funakoshi and his son did water the style down a little bit, if not in technique maybe in the way it is taught. I am sure there are other members in the forum who can correct me or give more info on this. Despite its sport image I have always believed that taught the correct way (the Oshima way in this case) Shotokan karate is a lethal self defense system. One more thing, when you said punches in the face are allowed during sparring, did you mean bare knuckle? Wing Chun Kuen Man Real traditional martial arts training is difficult to find.....most dojos in the west are Mcdojos....some are better and some are worst....but they are what they are....do you train in one?
kempocos Posted July 14, 2004 Posted July 14, 2004 SHOTOKAN is the result of chages requested by Japan to make OKINAWIAN KARATE less brutal so school kids can use it for grade school gym classes and it would look pretty. The deep stances and removal of much of the TUITE/TOUDI ( GRAPPPLING and KYUSHO ( vital/pressure point striking) . rigid linear movements from what I have seen. I agree search down a student of Taikia Oyata's RYUTE system. Hands down the best in this. "If you don't want to get hit while sparring , join the cardio class"
wing chun kuen man Posted July 14, 2004 Posted July 14, 2004 Hello kempocos, Thank you for that info. Can you recommend me any good web sites with info on Taikia Oyata´s RYUTE system. Wing Chun Kuen Man Real traditional martial arts training is difficult to find.....most dojos in the west are Mcdojos....some are better and some are worst....but they are what they are....do you train in one?
Drunken Monkey Posted July 14, 2004 Posted July 14, 2004 It looks like you are practicing a REAL style of karate again with the obsession with 'real'..... post count is directly related to how much free time you have, not how intelligent you are."When you have to kill a man it costs nothing to be polite."
kempocos Posted July 15, 2004 Posted July 15, 2004 Hello kempocos, Thank you for that info. Can you recommend me any good web sites with info on Taikia Oyata´s RYUTE system. Wing Chun Kuen Man https://www.ryushu.com "If you don't want to get hit while sparring , join the cardio class"
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