Ju-jitsu vs. Karate

[aefibird]

This is weird... i itrain on a shito ryu dojo, and the bunkais for alot of the katas have jujitsu implied into them, like one for heian sandan you do the wrist twisting thing... im not sure if my teacher edited the bunkais to mix them with jujitsu or they are like that, but id rather go with karate anyways.

 

No, they probably haven't been 'edited' with jujitsu bunkai - many karate kata have jujitsu elements in them. There are some cross-overs between JJJ, Karate, Judo and Aikido, although, each style has its own emphasis.

 

Sky, the best thing to do would probably be to try a few lessons in each style and see which one you prefer. If everyone on here says that (for example) JuJitsu is the 'best' style, but you try it and hate it then our advice on which is the 'best' will have been no good to you.

 

Anyway, as WW has already pointed out, it's isn't the style so much as the teacher.

[Shane]

I believe its all going to depend on the school. I know I teach my Jujitsu class now as a Mixed Art. I actually teach my kickboxing program to my C.T.E. Jujitsu students, this ensures that they are getting the striking and kicking training needed to make the program well rounded. Once again it all depends on the school and what they are teaching. Dont under estimate someone because of their styles name. Now days you are seeing alot of schools teaching with a Mixed Arts method to make their program well rounded.

 

Just my opinion

[username9]

I can't be bothered reading all the posts to this but I will give you my opinion - it's not a matter of Karate vs Ju Jitsu. Like someone said - they are both generic terms. But they aim to do different things. The original (and I mean ORIGINAL) concepts behind Karate included all elements of fighting anyway - but these have been lost. If you look hard enough for them you can find throws and locks etc in Karate - especially in Kata. Check out Ian Abernathy's work for this:

 

https://www.ianabernathy.com (I hope I spelt it right - if not use the search on here for Bunkai - someone else has it on there!)

 

Basically I advise people to train in both nowadays - and also Wado Ryu is not a bad idea if you only wanna join one club!

[username9]

Found the link from the thread I was talking about:

 

This one works !

 

http://www.iainabernethy.com/books/Free_Ebooks.htm

[italian_guy]

I can't be bothered reading all the posts to this but I will give you my opinion - it's not a matter of Karate vs Ju Jitsu. Like someone said - they are both generic terms. But they aim to do different things. The original (and I mean ORIGINAL) concepts behind Karate included all elements of fighting anyway - but these have been lost. If you look hard enough for them you can find throws and locks etc in Karate - especially in Kata. Check out Ian Abernathy's work for this:

 

https://www.ianabernathy.com (I hope I spelt it right - if not use the search on here for Bunkai - someone else has it on there!)

 

Basically I advise people to train in both nowadays - and also Wado Ryu is not a bad idea if you only wanna join one club!

 

Not totally lost! We do actually throws, standing locks and also ground work in our karate school both as drills and as bunkai for some kata.

[gojuchad]

that question really stirred up the bee hive.

[Kreisi]

JJ will win because of it's grappling. and locks

[Shorin Ryuu]

Interesting...anyway, the following isn't taking a side in the debate, since I think the debate is a bit misguided. However, I will try to include some more information to perhaps dispel some common misperceptions. Not that I think I will be too successful, as I usually just end up saying the same thing whenever this debate comes up.

 

I don't think the practice of grappling is that hard to find in karate at all. It is probably because you (meaning all those who say it is) are not looking in the right places. Traditional karate (and I mean those that are Okinawan and maintain the original focus) is all about in-fighting and grappling. Certainly, a lot of what you see is striking, but that is merely the first stage of everything. But to say that these styles have disappeared or lost a lot of their concepts is to be a little misinformed about the issue.

 

As far as training in grappling, every traditional Okinawan teacher I have met teaches that from an early stage, like around the white belt level. Nothing I have ever seen implies that there has been any aspect of grappling lost in karate. You might bring up many karate styles that do not have them, but that is more indicative of systems of teaching that are relatively new and included in the umbrella of "karate", not that the older systems have lost the emphasis.

 

I remember reading a post of Drunken Monkey's somewhere where he wrote something about "strikes that transition into grappling." I think that little phrase describes Okinawan karate pretty well.

 

I'll even use a different style of karate than mine, just as an example. You ever see Ryukyu kenpo (semantics, but really a type of Okinawan karate), with the likes of Oyata? If you have, then you will have a hard time explaining how that is not grappling.

 

At any rate, I'll stop rambling now, as you will have either seen my point by this time or disagree with me still.

[italian_guy]

I agree with SR, Karate is NOT a pure striking art like kickboxing, it has throws, locks, and ground fighting (I'm also talking about okinawan karate but this is true also for wado ryu).

 

BTW even kickboxing has sweeps so even kickboxing has little grappling in it.OK very little.

[Aiki Ronin Samurai]

To give you some insight, Jujutsu is a relatively generic term. Classical Jujutsu often referred to as Taijutsu is a very old method of combat used in feudal Japan , more modern arts such as karate, judo, aikido, and such all hold many off their roots in the combative methods of Bujutsu, or the warrior arts of the samurai. Jujutsu as a Goshinjutsu, or self-defense system is very encompassing, and brutal in its capability. IT is geared only toward combat and self defense. Okinawan Karate, practiced by the methods of the old sensei, maintained a great deal of "jutsu" in their arts. Unfortunately, in this modern age of "kick-boxing" and "cardio-Karate" much of the teachings of the old masters have been lost or compromised. Karate was developed primarily as a means of coordinated striking, but it also included combative methods of grappling as well. Arts such as Daito-Ryu Aikijutsu, Ninpo-Taijutsu, Hakko-Ryu Jujutusu, and many other Japanese Jujutsu Ryu-Ha have maintained their combat effectiveness, because they were never altered for sport. Even though when you think of Jujutsu, you think of "grappling", understand that the true Jujutsu of the ancient Samurai is a complete art utilizing striking with the hands and feet, joint locks, throws, weapons, choking, and all manner of tactics to help insure combat survival. Its about winning, not conforming. I have nothing but praise for all the Okinawan Karate disciplines, as their combat effectiveness lies in the practicioner, But I am a hands down believer in the battle sciences of classical Jujutsu. THE SAMURAI DIDNT BECOME SOME OF THE WORLDS MOST FEARED AND RESPECTED WARRIORS BECAUSE OF THE TEA CEREMONY, they earned that respect from 1,000 years of perfecting technique and spirit.