IcemanSK

I've told the story of a former instructor who lied about credentials and gave bogus ones to me and others. That wasn't the extent of his "charm." During sparring, the unspoken was that your groin was fair game if he felt you were getting the best of him (or if he was bored). His groin was never fair game and was answered with a punch in the face (never legal in our style). He saved the largest degree of punishment in sparring for his wife. Found out years later (although I shouldn't have been surprised) that he gave her one-sided sparring classes at home without pads. A real jerk all around. I stayed there too long. I regret it to this day.

I've heard good things about Shureido, too. For awhile, genuine Shureido was hard to get shipped to the states. But that was a dozen years ago or more. I have to agree with sensei8 on EP's customer service. I ordered a belt for a friend a few weeks ago. They called me the day before they shipped to ensure that I was correct. Attention to detail is so important when doing custom work. Thanks also for the comparison between Eosin Panther and Kataaro.

Congratulations on the weight loss!! Soft core belts stay tied better than stiff core belts, in my experience. I don't know if that's issue with your belt or not.

Eosin Panther Personal preference; they supply what I/we need. When we eliminated outward rank identifiers, Eosin products exceeded our required parameters. I left Century MA Supplies after being with them ever since they opened. Between these two companies, I've only purchased from Eosin Panther. N/A Thank you for your response. I have always had great customer service response from Eosin Panther, also. On a unique order, they reached out several times to ensure that they got it right.

I've long been a fan/champion of Eosin Panther as a company and a product since someone here on Karate Forums recommended them to me in 2005. I have several of them and have bought them for students and friends. They really do amazing work. In the past few years, Kataaro has become another popular high-quality American made belt embroidery company like Eosin Panther. Which belt do you prefer? Why do prefer that belt? Has anyone purchased belts from both companies? If so, how does the quality compare? I don't work for either company. I know more about Eosin Panther, but the quality of Kataaro can't be denied either.

Welcome to KF, Pancor357; glad that you're here!! From what your OP speaks about, it's the dojo that's being disloyal to its Student Body. So, I'd speak to the CI!! If that doesn't pan out, then I'd start looking elsewhere. Good luck, and please let us know how things are going. First, Welcome Pancor357. I concur with sensei8, completely. If you're teaching yourself, the dojo is being disloyal to you. Put another way, if you're teaching yourself (and not being taught by chief instructor) who is there to be disloyal to?

I've trained in Kuki-TKD for most of my career. Back in the 80s, heavier weight duck canvas and other types of heavy dobok were very popular. With every kick or punch, the material would make a great pop sound. They even used to make KKW v-neck dobok in heavy canvas. Today, the thinking is lightweight (or even ultra lightweight) dobok marketed to fighters. How many of you have trained using both heavy and light styles? Which do you prefer to train in? How many of you have only tried one type or the other?

I've been training for 36 years. One thing I'm sure of is that the value is in embracing the suck. The best part is in the difficulty. The sweat. The struggle. The working through the confusion about a technique. The feeling of "I'm not sure I can keep doing this" in the middle of class, followed by the "I get so much out of being here" feeling as I leave.

I don't know of any demotions of rank that Kukkiwon has ordered, but I recall Illinois state Taekwondo association kicking people out and barring them from being a part of the organization in any way. The reasoning was justified. Two cases I'm aware of were both because they'd been found guilty in the courts of molesting children. I'm sure Kukkiwon would probably agree to strip folks like this if they were aware of it. But, I think stories like this would take up a lot of their time also. The WTF (sport body of Kukkiwon) did expel a fighter from Cuba for intentionally kicking a referee during a match at the Olympics, before the guy left the arena. I don't know if Kukkiwon ever stripped him of his rank.

My grandmaster defined a belt test as, "regular things done in class under stressful conditions." The concept of "stressful" is different for every student. I once had an adult student, who was quite successful in his career, experience a lot of anxiety if I even mentioned the idea of a belt test to him. Other students do their best work in the stress of a belt test. For some, a belt test might be a good distraction from the anxiety of a hospitalized family member, school exams, or other such stressors. For others, it might be unhelpful and even damaging to train or test during times such as these. The danger is when we put moral or value judgments on ourselves or others during these times. Saying "you must" or "you shouldn't" train/test is unhelpful. What is helpful during a stressful time is to ask oneself, "What will benefit me at this time and what are the consequences of my actions?" Missing a belt test or classes to be with family might be the better choice in the long run. Knowing how you react to stress is key. If one is in class, but their head is on family or school or other things that bring them anxiety, that may be dangerous. If completely a task of a test helps you focus, it might be a good thing.

This!

As a teen/young adult, I trained for a dozen years with a mouthpiece as an afterthought. I didn't care that one mouthpiece wasn't good enough to keep a kick from ruining my orthodontic work. I eventually got a dentist-made mouthpiece. They're worth every penny. I've had several over the last 20 years & never regretted the expense. Whether stand-up or grappling Art, you want to protect your teeth and gums.

I want to make grandiose claims based on great intentions for the new year. However, I finish up graduate school in May and am planning two non-MA careers at that point. So, my MA goals are humble ones. I know that I will continue to support my instructor and help her stay up-to-date on Kukkiwon/Chung Do Kwan info. I hope to return to regular training on my own and training at friend's dojang, as I can in the coming year. I take my training with me everywhere I go. I miss training and teaching regularly. It will happen again, but I have things I need to do first.

I talk about martial arts less over the years simply because most of the people that I talk with aren't interested in it on the level that I am. I also enjoy other things that aren't things most people enjoy. I don't talk about them openly, either. When I was a kid, my dad was a salesman. He couldn't stand sports, but he watched the sports segment on the news every night without fail. He did this because he knew most men used sports as their default conversation. I'm practical. I talk about myself only to the degree people want to know. Personally, I'm interested in what other people want to talk about.

I bow when I enter a school not my own out of respect for the space and out of tradition. How I'm treated when I'm there is up to those who are there. I don't view bowing as any more of a big deal than offering my hand in a handshake. When I was a teen, I idolized my instructors and clergy that I knew. I'm an adult now. I've learned that anyone can have a hidden agenda. My showing them respect doesn't alter that possibility. I try to show respect everyone I meet. I have no control over what they do with that act of kindness.

Not much of a mystery considering hair pulling is against the rules, in at least UFC is concerned; Rule 15.A.v. There are more disadvantages to fighting with long hair than just having it pulled. Henderson spent so much time pushing his hair out of his face during the first fight with Anthony Pettis that it negatively affected his ability to defend himself.

It is up to the instructor and/or organization. If (and only if) there is no standard from one's seniors, and the student has a choice, the possibilities of colors are truly endless. Even black thread on black belts CAN BE done. I'm a minimalist with embroidery. On my everyday belt, I simply have my name in Korean on one end and my style in Korean on the other in yellow. My "dress belt" for my organization has a lot of bling (rank stripes and more) in yellow. At the risk of sending you down a rabbit hole, I'll recommend these two websites. Eosin Panther makes the best belts on the planet & does embroidery in many colors. eosinpanther.com Kataaro.com makes a great belt, also. The specialize in very blinged out embroidery with many colors and ideas.

I had long hair in the late 80s in college. I used to get hit in the eye by my ponytail holder when I threw spinning kicks. As a stand-up fighter, I never thought twice about it. That is until I watched UFC One. The ability to grab at the head & hair. Then my eyes were opened to the ugly possibilities. I watch MMA fighters like Benson Henderson wear their hair really long is a mystery to me. Yet even he had braided it many times (although not every time, oddly) for fights. Time has taken care of my ability to wear my hair long and it still has the chance to look good. But as a fighter, I certainly see the need for shorter hair...even for stand-up fighters.

Demotion due to poor testing is excessive and needlessly punitive. There's no incentive for the student to continue. Telling the student to wait until they're ready to test (as in, up to standard) encourages continued training and growth. Demotion after a poor testing tells the student that they are bad and unwanted in the training hall.

While I'm Chung Do Kwan, not Ji Do Kwan, I have done the Pal Gwe poomsae in the past. The Pal Gwe poomsae were only official KKW/WTF poomsae for a short time in the early 1970s. The Tae Geuk poomsae have been the Kukkiwon standard for more than 40 years. Here's a great piece on a bit of the history and philosophy of the Tae Geuk poomsae written by Master Peter Miles of Michigan. **Note: both the Pal Gwe & Tae Geuk were designed by the same group of men: with additional men added for the latter Tae Geuk. Note also the Ji Do Kwan men involved. GGM LEE Chong Woo being chief among them.** During the 1950's Korean martial artists were primarily performing Okinawan and Chinese forms. With the efforts to unify the various Kwans came an effort to standardize the material taught. To this end, the Korea Taekwondo Association had representatives from the various Kwans become members of the Poomsae Committee. The task of the Poomsae Committee was to create uniquely Korean Taekwondo poomsae. The members of the Committee and their Kwan affiliation were: 1) KWAK Kun Sik (Chung Do Kwan) 2) LEE Yong Sup (Song Moo Kwan) 3) PARK Hae Man (Chung Do Kwan) 4) HYUN Jong Myung (Oh Do Kwan) 5) KIM Soon Bae (Chang Moo Kwan) These original members created the Palgwae poomsae and the Yudanja poomsae (Koryo through Ilyo). It is important to emphasize that the Oh Do Kwan, which were using the Chon Ji forms created by Gen. Choi, participated in the creation of the new KTA poomsae, and thus were an active part of the unification process. The Oh Do Kwan member who participated was GM HYUN Jong Myung, the Oh Do Kwan Jang at the time. The Palgwae poomsae were the first uniquely Korean Taekwondo poomsae. Unfortunately, they were created without the input of two of the original Kwans: the Jidokwan and the Moo Duk Kwan. The reason for this is that the Kwan Jangs of these Kwans: Dr. YOON, Kwe Byung and GM HWANG, Kee, respectively, had left the Korea Taekwondo Association and had a rival organization, the Korea Soo Bahk Do Association. Several years later, a majority of Jidokwan (under the leadership of GM LEE, chong Woo) and Moo Duk Kwan (lead by GM HONG, Chong Soo) members rejoined the Korea Taekwondo Association. At that time, it was felt that the input of these Kwans should be included, and new poomsae, the Tae Guek series was created. The additional members from the Jidokwan and Moo Duk Kwan were: 6) LEE Chong Woo (Jidokwan) 7) BAE Young Ki (Jidokwan) HAN Yong Tae (Moo Duk Kwan) (Names and Kwan affiliation of Poomsae Committee members comes to me courtesy of my friend and senior Glenn U. from his many conversations with Kwan founders and pioneers). Background. In order to discuss the philosophical context of the Taeguek series, it might be a good idea to look at what "Tae" "Guek" means. "Tae" means "largeness" and "Guek" means "eternity." Together the thought behind "Taeguek" represents the creation of the universe. The symbol for Taeguek is the familiar red/blue yin/uhm (negative) and yang (positive). The circle of the Taeguek symbolizes infinity-no beginning or end. Around the outside of the Taeguek are 8 "gwes" or "Palgwe". Each of these "gwe" consist of various combinations of three solid (yang) or broken (uhm) bars. From the 12 O'clock position and moving clockwise, the order of the Palgwe is as follows: "keon", "seon", "kam", "kan", "kon", "jin", "ri", and "tae." For those who are not familiar with what the Palgwe symbols look like, you can see them here: http://fisks.com/tkd/taeguek_poomse.html Philosophy: Taeguek 1 represents "keon" which is heaven-that which is great and original-it is the first poomsae so it is easy to learn. Since it has 3 solid bars, it is all "yang" or positive. Taeguek 2 represents "tae" which is strength of mind-gentle or soft on the outside, firm of intention on the inside. Taeguek 3 represents "ri" which is sun or fire or light. It is hot and bright like one's passion for training. It is the last of the beginner poomsae. Taeguek 4 represents "jin" which is thunder. It is loud and strong but disappears and brings forth freshness. This poomsae is for intermediate students-those who have trained long enough to have a grasp of basic techniques but desirous of new challenges. One of the challenges of this poomsae is the introduction of returing the kicking leg to its original position. Taeguek 5 represents "seon" or wind. Wind can be refreshing like a gentle breeze or overwhelming like Hurrican Rita. Like a gathering storm, Taeguek 5 starts out with easy motions and builds up to a crescendo with the front kick/stomp and backfist combination at the end. Taeguek 6 represents "gam" or water. Water can form to fit any container yet can also be dangerous. Like water, this poomsae has both fluid and strong motions such as the ending combination of pushing blocks and reverse punches. Taeguek 7 represents "kan" or mountain. A mountain is majestic and can be either tranquil or angry.This is an advanced poomsae and the majesty of the covering fist (ITF stylists begin "Won Hyo" in this position) pause followed by the scissors block is an example. Taeguek 8 represents "kon" or earth-the opposite of heaven so it consists of 3 broken sets of bars (all yin-negative). The earth is firm, rooted, like those ready to test for black belt who are grounded in their knowledge and like earth, ready to spring forth with new knowledge. Technical Aspects: The first 3 poomsae are for beginners. They are characterized by simple, straightforward moves such as walking stances, low blocks, middle and upper section punches. The only kicking technique is a front kick, again, the most basic of the kicks. Nevertheless, they increase in level of difficulty from 1 through 3. For example, in Taeguek 1, the 5th motion is a low block in front stance followed immediately by a reverse punch. In Taeguek 3, there is a middle section knife hand block in a back stance followed immediately by a stance change before the middle section punch. The second set of 3 (i.e. Taeguek 4-6) are intermediate poomsae. These poomsae introduce increasingly difficult techniques. For example, Taeguek 4 introduces double knife hand block, spear hand strike with push block, simultaneous knife hand block and neck strike, consecutive side kicks, and body-weight concepts (i.e. returning kicking leg to original stance, use of forward momentum from front kick in subsequent front back fist strike). The final 2 poomsae in the Taeguek series, Taeguek 7 & 8 are advanced poomsae. They have a different feel and flow than the earlier 6 poomsae. In fact, Taeguek 7 has what I perceive to be an almost "kung-fu-like" feel with soft palm blocks, body-weight shifting 180 degrees in tiger stances, and inside crescent kicks to open hand targets. Taeguek 8 likewise diffentiates between kicking combinations moving forward and those which are stationary. It also introduces in the final half a sliding stepping motion not seen in any of the earlier poomsae. What is fascinating about the Taeguek series is that the footwork matches the respective Palgwe symbol. So, if one were to do Taeguek 4 for instance in the sand, from overhead, the sand would be marked with the Palgwe symbol "ri." Clearly there was a great deal of thought put into the series.

Performs?? More like mimics them; many errors...balance, to name just one. I was wondering the same thing myself. Who in their right mind taught a student forms that are above that students current rank?!?! Unless he taught himself the forms out of a book/DVD/internet. Still, his CI needs to curb him away from the forms that are above his current rank. He does struggle with the BB poomsae, yes. He doesn't perform them in competition, however. He is simply not allowed to do so. As has been mentioned on other pages of this thread, in WTF elite poomsae competition, poomsae is done by age and rank. For example, at age 10 a 1st poom would do the 2nd Dan poomsae, at most. A 55 year old BBwould need to prepare up through Ilyeo (9th Dan poomsae) regardless of their Dan rank. Since the early 2000s, the WTF decided to change the way poomsae competition is done in order to showcase the value of poomsae. Previously, poomsae took a back seat to the all important kyoroogi. It is a pendulum swing from the 80s when the 1st Dan poomsae was the only BB poomsae performed, because it was the only poomsae any BBs of any Dan rank knew. I get that it's not everyone's cup of tea.

This young man (James Chua) is a Southern California phenom. He's 8 years old & performs Tae Guek 1-8 & all yudanja poomsae.

Yeah, I agree. I've worried about that in the past. I went to the Kukkiwon Instructors Course several years ago. The man who taught poomsae was GM Jae-yoon An, an instructor at KKW and member of the Korean National Poomsae team. He is as solid as any MA-ist I've met. Friends have said the same about other KKW instructors. As Kukkiwon produces things like these new poomsae for young, gymnasts, those who teach at Kukkiwon are held to a very high standard. They intend to teach others to do likewise.

Kukkiwon has been of two minds, in recent years. On the one hand, "let's standardize poomsae so everyone understands how they 'should' be done." And on the other hand, "let's create poomsae that only teenagers can do." The latter has appeal, but not for the long haul.

These are indeed new "Elite-level" poomsae for competition. They're not consider for rank testing. My elite-level poomsae friends enjoy them. WWF has produced these types of poomsae in the fairly recent past (within the last 10 years), but they never got popular among elite-level or other TKD folk. Time will tell how these will be accepted in the long term.