Steve_K

I haven't posted in a while, but from what I have read and learned about the Brazilian style of Jiu Jitsu, to hold the rank of black belt is among the highest of prestige, and signifies that the holder is completely competent to perform the moves he/she has learned as well as being fully qualified to teach them. An honorary black belt would normally be given to someone who has extensive experience in a somewhat similar art. For instance a well experience black belt in Chung Do Kwan (non-olympic) Tae Kwon Do, being awared an honorary black belt in Shotokan Karate after learning the differences between the two, such as the terminology and theory.

The school I earned my black belt from, we completely recognize a black belt from any style, as a black belt and show them complete respect. If they are from a different style, they often teach some of their art to the students, but if they are there to learn our art, we teach them as if they were a white belt. We believe in the belt ranking system enough that, if you have a black belt, you deserve to wear it, but we don't believe in it so much to the point that, if you're not a black belt in our specific style, then you HAVE to wear a white belt. Some styles may disregard others and only respect their own, with the mentality that, if you want me to respect you, you have to devote yourself to MY art. Where I train Jiu-Jitsu, I wear my TKD black belt. Everyone there knows my rank is in TKD, and if I roll with someone I've never met before, I make a point of telling them it's a TKD black belt, and not Jiu-Jitsu. Again it goes back to my mentality of, I earned my black belt, and I want to train in it, but I'm not so hung up on belt ranks that I feel the need to go back to wearing a white belt. To me, telling a black belt that "you have to put on a white belt to participate" is very disrespectful to the hard work they put forth prior to attending that particular class. At the least, they deserve the respect of being allowed to wear their own belt, and simply being recognized as someone with experience and knowledge. However that black belt, must also respect the rest of the class as having more experience in that particular style than he/she does, and respect the teacher as the head of the school, and remember that he/she is there to learn, and not to prove something.

Hi everybody My sister watches this show called Real Life, or something, and one episode I saw had this guy who was trying to make money to train for an NHB fight. He was training at this gym that focuses on just that. His coach was talking about him and his chances, and how he never fought before that, and I think he even said he had only been training for a matter of months. Surprisingly he won his fight against a guy who had been fighting for a couple of years. I was wondering how some of you felt about these gyms. Not schools that teach TKD, Karate, Muay Thai, Boxing, and Judo or BJJ as complimentary, but a gym that teaches people to fight in these mixed martial arts competitions specifically. I have less than favorable opinions for this idea because I feel it skips practically all the philosophies that you get training at a traditional martial arts school (I use traditional loosely). I believe the students skip the cultivation of technique and skill, and allowing their minds to grow with them with the realization of their potentially deadly new skills. I realize these gyms could be compared to boxing gyms, but I have a friend who has been boxing for six or seven years, and I know that his first fight was nothing like this guy's. He had the whole show going on, with an arena filled with spectators, a silk robe, girls in bikinis... the whole nine yards. I believe however, that more martial arts schools should be a little more aggressive in their realistic combat training. Some schools do tend to favor the aspect of developing good self esteem, pacifism, forms, technique etc, but not so much realism. The standard for "martial artist" can't be only someone who knows self defense moves, techniques, katas, but also someone who is known to be able to seriously take care of him or herself. On a less philosophical level, these schools eliminate the necessity and adventure for a martial artist to go from style to style, and school to school, to develop his or her own complete martial art. Thank you if you've read my entire post, and I look forward to your response.

If you can, get on the internet or do something to find out if there is a free club that gets together and trains Jiu Jitsu that is made up of currently practicing students. I don't know how common they are, but I had the good fortune to find one only 20 min from me (I live in Cincinnati OH). I really like training there, because there are people from Tae Kwon Do and other martial arts there as well, and they aren't all hung up on belts either. I asked if they minded if I wore my black belt (in Chung Do Kwan) to practice, not to see how much I could push my weight around, but I do that to guage the attitude there, and they said "no problem, we just wear belts here to keep our gis together". My point is, IF you can find a free club, go there, because chances are, most or everyone there has an open mind and most importantly, they are hungry to learn and become better too, so you will get intense training and instruction there as well. Where sometimes with high ranking instructors who are trying to make money won't be too concerned with high quality training, because they already have a wealth of skill and already have your money and want you to NEED to come back. I by no means claim that it encompasses all or even most high ranking instructors, but that is a flaw I know you can find. That's just my suggestion Good luck

Lets see, we have testimonies from A Brazilian Jiu Jitsu black belt... okay, maybe I'll buy that A S.W.A.T. leader... mmm, I don't know but seriously, A bounty hunter AND mixed martial arts champion? Seriously I looked up the names of the BJJ bb and MMA guy on google, the only response I got was for the MMA guy, and it was in reference to that advertisement. also Baton Rouge? Los Angeles? Newark? I know where those places are! They couldn't have picked more obvious cities

Excellent replies guys, very insightful, I appreciate it. Yeah when I was progressing through the ranks of tae kwon do, we would work on certain ground applications and strategies, but we would never go so far as to say that "we train in ground fighting". As fallen_milkman said, we would basically learn escapes and ways to get back to our feet.

Hello everyone; I first want to say that I am putting this in the "General Martial Arts" section instead of the "Chinese Martial Arts" section because I would like resonses from both Kung Fu practitioners, grapplers and anyone else who can offer insight. Here is a little back story before my question. A couple of years ago I accompanied a friend to a Kung Fu school in a nearby town. The instructor there was talking about the superiority of Kung Fu, and that the style encompases all aspects of fighting, including ranged fighting, close in fighting, weapons and ground fighting. I did not care for the instructor's attitude towards other martial arts, because he seemed to show a general disrespect to seemingly all other forms, and spoke of how after he and a friend or brother learned a little kung fu, he and his friend/brother would go to other martial arts schools and beat up on the instructors there, I certainly didn't believe him, and and I certainly lost my respect for him, not for Kung Fu, just the instructor. What I am curious about is the ground fighting style taught in Kung Fu, if any. The instructor at this school stated that students of his style (not [/i]his style) of Kung Fu can/will enter all forms of competition, including grappling. I am questioning the reliability of the instructor due to his apparent low opinion and lack of respect towards other styles. I cannot recall which form of Kung Fu it was, but for any of you knowledgeable in various forms of Kung Fu, could you tell me how accurate this person's statements were, and what styles teach it? And for those of you who enter in grappling competitions, could you please tell me if you have gone up against a Kung Fu based grappler, and how well they fought? Thank you in advance.

I've seen the product in question before. When I did, I took a quadruple take when I passed it. I don't like it. To get a black belt, takes, or at least should, take as much time as it does to get a bachelors degree... it's like saying "become a psychologist with this 30 min video. Kit includes tape, notepad, and diploma (artificial of course)" I realize that the product IS NOT advertising that kids will become black belts with this kit, but that is the notion it could instill in children. I guess it's good if it gets kids interested, but too many kids nowadays are too lazy to say "hey this is fun, I want to join a real class". The worst case scenario would be that kids believe that they know karate from this video, and want to use it, and will start fights as a result. I realize my view is slightly pessimistic, but some things need to simply remain on a personal level. But honestly; a child cannot learn martial arts from a video, let alone a 30 minute video. Only someone with prior martial arts experience would be able to take something away from video lessons. But if I am wrong, I'll be happy to admit it.

After I was awarded my black belt, I was told that it was "probationary", and that I could later be asked to repeat any aspect of my black belt test, at any moment. I think I was told that that policy would last for a year, or something like that. However, after that, to my knowledge, they won't/can't demote me. I think technically you can only be demoted if you comply with your instructor's decision to demote you. The only "official" thing I can imagine a teacher doing, that you can't defy, is being expelled from his/her school, and you will not be recognized as a black belt there. Basically all they can really do, is blackball you as a bad student/black belt. But when it comes to lower ranks below black belt, they can definately demote you, because you are their student, and MUST comply with their decisions.

I shall respect Rex I shall never misuse Rex Kwon Do I shall be a champion of freedom and justice.

It's probably not the best idea to go into an open competition as a white belt, if like you said, they are not dividing competitors by rank. But that doesn't mean that you shouldn't enter. Like the above say, don't just assume you are going to lose, but if you feel someone secure a choke or a lock, just tap. Psycho or not, whoever you're up against, probably won't have any desire to hurt you beyond your tapping out. Just hope that it doesn't happen early in your first match, because then you won't get the full experience of really competing. If you're not competing for money, and you are only a white belt, the only reason you have for going is to have fun, so make sure of that, foremost. Good luck.

I personally have never let my ego get in the way of my judgement. I have had plenty of opportunities to fight someone, and wanted to, but chose not to. However those instances, were not very pressing, and didn't really call for violence. Now as for your situation. I would not hold your actions against you at all. I'm not saying what you did was right, but I do not believe it was wrong either. I may very well have reacted similarly myself. It would have been different if he spit on you, because you should be mature enough to let that pass, or at least not let it escalate so quickly. However when someone does such a despicable act towards someone else, especially a girl, since I am really kind of old fashioned, I do believe that warrants some kind of response. To me, spitting is one of the most disgraceful and disrespectful things someone can do to another person, and it technically qualifies as a physical attack, because it is certainly not verbal. Long story short. You can do and say what you want to me, but if you do that to someone I care about, I am going to respond. That's my rant, everyone is free to agree or disagree with me.

My school had the same kind of conditions. We didn't have a separate "probationary" belt, but they basically just reserved the right to take our rank from us if we didn't prove to be adequate black belts, ie. we quit right after promotion, misused our skills, were insufficient teachers etc. They said that period would last a year before our promotion was permanent.

I train in Chung Do Kwan, and that is why I say I practice "traditional" tkd, because it's easier than explaining the fact that I don't do sport/olympic tkd, and that our training is more functional, and that Chung Do Kwan is derived from Shotokan Karate, because that is a mouthful, and most non-martial artists, wouldn't even understand what that means anyway. I don't know about everyone else, but that is what I mean when I say traditional.

I don't have an answer to your question. But I thought I would add that I study Chung Do Kwan, and I am very pleased with it, compared to some of the other styles, basically the olympic styles. Good choice, I must say, no offense to the olympic styles.

Whoops, nevermind, I just realized the title specifies black belts with stripes. The only stripes I have seen on black belts, are the stripes denoting the degree of black belt the person is. This is common with most all systems that have the classic belt rank system. The striped belts I described earlier, are the ones with the stripe running along the entire length of the belt, usually of a different color, or black. If I recall correctly, the belts with the black stripe are sometimes used to show that someone is a member of the "black belt club" you don't have to be a black belt to be in it, but sometimes schools give special offers to members of the club. In case anyone wanted to know, that's the story about the those striped lower rank belts.

I don't know about other school, but at the school I trained at, instead of having a separate belt color for each rank, we would just take every other belt color and put a tip on it, each tipped belt was a separate rank all together, white 10th kup/kyu, white/yellow tip 9th kup, yellow 8th kup, etc. This saved money and the confusion of having ten separate belt colors, so the only colors we used were, white, yellow, green, brown, red, and black. My point is, that when I started training a friend in college, who also attended our school back home, he or I didn't have a way of sewing the tips onto his belts, so I just had him order his belt with the next color stripe down the middle, instead of translating them into orange and blue or purple or whatever. I don't know how others use them for, but that's just how we used them. To repeat, a tipped belt, was a completely separate belt rank, they didn't mean you were almost a green belt or almost a brown belt, you were a yellow belt green tips, or a 7th kup/kyu.

You know, a lot of people have made analogies for the meaning of the black belt, which were all very good, and got me thinking. Forgive me if this analogy has already been made. Patrick said earlier that a bb is like a diploma or a first dollar of a business, which are very good, as those things are great symbols to a person, but got me thinking about a perfect parallel, and I think I have one. A black belt, is just like a wedding ring. There are plenty of places out there that just "hand out" black belts, just as there people out there that get married for the wrong reasons like money, social status, or just to feel like they got somewhere in their life. But then there are those who get married for the right, and only reason, which is love. They all have wedding rings, and they all wear them all the time. To those who got married for not wanting to have a child out of wedlock, or to simply look complete, that ring essentially means nothing, which is why many to most of those marriages end in divorce. However, just because there are so many people walking around with worthless rings on their fingers, is it right to say someone who truly loves his/her, wife/husband, that their rings are worthless? Of course not. To them it is a symbol of their devotion and commitment to one another, by willing to vow to spend the rest of their lives together, and the time, be it months or years, that it took them to get there. I know that, at least for a woman, if she lost her wedding or engagement ring, she would be heartbroken, even though she may be able to easily replace it, that is not the point. The ring she cares about so much was the one that there, and she wore on the most important days of her life. The black belt that means so much to me, is the one that I never got to see for five years, and that sat on a table right in front of me, for the six hours I fought for it, and that I had to traditionally wait an entire month for before I finally got to put it on. That is the belt that means so much to me. If I lost it, I may or may not get a new one, because to me that belt would ONLY be a strip of black cloth, and mean essentially nothing to me. Sure there are couples out there that truly love each other, that may not be married and may never get married, just like there are great martial artists out there, without a black belt. The only thing they lack is that special object that will take them back, and remind them of all those important times of their life, every time they look at it and put it on.

White Warlock gives some good advice. However I feel that if you still love the martial arts, then you should not allow yourself to cease practice and involvement completely, but if you find yourself not loving it anymore, as opposed to just being bored, then maybe you should. If you are just bored, you may, as you already pointed out, want to explore other martial arts and expand your horizons. After attaining my black belt I found myself losing interest in my own personal practice, but then I discovered something else I loved doing, which was teaching martial arts to others. For a year after reaching black belt, I taught the other students at my school and I loved it. In that time I felt my skills were preserved but were not growing. However after teaching for a while, I realized that there was more room for my skills to grow than there was for them to diminish, so once I went away to college, I began my training anew, and started to develope my own specific principals, which have turned out to work very well by the way. My point is, (I am assuming your test was for black belt) that you are no longer a blind student who needs to be shown where you need to go, but yet your training is not over. You now have the means to forge your own way, and cultivate your skills on your own, be it by teaching someone else, or realizing, truly how much room your abilities have to improve, but if that is not your desire, then it may in fact be time to put it behind you, it's your choice.

It took me nearly five years non stop to get my black belt in chung do kwan.

I never said that a doctor shouldn't drink, and I was illustrating a parallel between the two. However it does set a bad example when he/she (a doctor) drinks too much and act like an idiot, moron, jerk, etc. "I don't know about that doctor, I heard some bad things about him." "Oh don't worry about that, he was just drunk." hmmm There are some idiots out there that would make assumptions and stereotype a group, giving that group a bad reputation. "Hey you know that one martial arts guy?" "Yeah." "Well I saw him drunk out of his mind at a party last night and he was picking fights with everybody." "Those martial arts guys think they can beat up anybody. They're such jerks." Now I realize that the above examples are quite explicit, but that is often how things can be perceived by people. And MAKOTO I have a problem with people who drink too much for many reasons. 1) when I am at a party, of any kind, much of the time they are loud, obnoxious, rude, violent, disgusting etc. 2) If because of their drunkenness, they happen to stumble across the street and get hit by a car and killed, he/she has one, scarred the person that hit them for life, and two, caused his/her family and friends to mourn them the rest of their life. And 3) Most importantly, they endanger not only my life, but my family member's lives, my friend's lives, and the lives of other innocent people, when they think they are fine, and need to get home, and then go left of center and smash head on into someone, or go up onto a sidewalk and hit innocent pedestrians. So I think that their drinking in excess concerns me quite a bit. And too much, is however much is needed for the above scenarios to occur.

I personally don't really like it, simply because of the fact that it claims to be a martial art. At first when I saw the special on it I was like "Heck yeah!" and I'll still watch it but not thinking that those guys are great martial artists. They may be, Mike Chat and Matt Mullins, because they started in a traditional school, because XMA really just came about in the past few years, to my knowledge. Also I don't like the way that unexperienced spectators perceive it. They would think that because a 12 year old can throw an aluminum bo into the air and spin it 30 times and catch it and scream really loud, that he/she is a better martial artist than I or someone else, not saying that I AM better than they are, but it just creates that kind of notion in people, because they could never do that with a heavy wood bo staff. It's baton twirling, is all it is. Also in competition, if you don't have at least one back flip in your routine, you lose. I'm working on my own philosophy for my own martial art, and you know what has happened? I unintentionally went straight back to basics, and basic kinds of techniques, it's amazing. I don't mean to rag on XMA and I mean no disrespect to it at all. I mean, it looks great, I respect Mike Chat because he doesn't seem to have any heir of superiority to others and I'm sure it's helped get lots of young people involved in the martial arts and away from less savory means of passing their time. It's just that watching their tournaments leaves a bad taste in my mouth, but that's just me.

I think someone being a martial artist is irrelevant. Drinking in excess is harmful and inappropriate no matter what you do. I'm not talking about drinking enough that it helps you feel good and sociable and relaxed, but about drinking so much that you begin to act in a way that you normally wouldn't. I do believe though that if someone has a reputation as a "martial artist" similar to someone who has a reputation as a "doctor", then they should definately take more care in not showing too much change in their personality, as it could damage their reputation, but other than that, as long as you don't drink too much that your liver can't process it fast enough, physically you should be fine. I personally don't drink, but I have no problem with others who do choose to, but I do have a problem when others choose to drink too much.

He was probably referring to the western movie style, round about kind of punch. You know when the guy twists his body back, and throws his fist around as opposed to straight. At my school we call it a John Wayne punch. It's kind of hard to explain, but yeah, it's like a hook punch, but less sophistocated, if you will.

Hey, congratulations! You should post this story in this thread as well, to add to the other stories of black belt tests. http://www.karateforums.com/viewtopic.php?t=22952