MasterH

I heard it was a bit on the expensive side. I went thru Mass Training back when it was just Chief Master Clark, so I know a little bit. But I'm also a bit rusty. Would you know of a group that has a clue, with out charging an arm and a leg? I also heard the Shurman concepts was a good group.

And yes, he's referring to ProMAC.

Expensive!

Yo! WW

You do but it has really gone down in quality. MAIA has much better in terms of tips from Martial Artists like the Kovars, Tom Callos and Bill Wallace to name a few.

The Kovars.......you're talking ProMAC correct?

-Adam

Which is better? One, the other or both? I'm looking at both and can't decide with out signing up for both and comparing. Before I do that, I thought I'd ask.

FWIW, I looked at both of them and was unimpressed.

You I know, online anyway. Just what didn't immpress you about them? And if you didn't have the ATA's business tips and backing, who would you go thru, if anyone?

From what I understand (read) he went thru all lower belt forms thru 3rd degree (I'm sure he had no problem with) then he had to certify as an instructor. Did he go thru the entire 9 SSI seminars, probably not. Just the basic first three and the first test.

Can you immagine the pressure at his test.........he was up there by himself, correct?

-Adam

I don't know, I wasn't at Worlds (Even though I qualified) when he did his testing.

Oh, and the SSI seminars are a thing of the past, they've moved to a much better structure for instructor training. I think they did away with SSI in.....2001 ish?

Aodhan

Probably.......I don't know. I've been with the HTF sense 1999 or so. We have one big certification camp, pass or fail. Simple hu? ROFL

Well, my instructor has threatened to demote within colored belt rank if you forget your material. Also, a brown belt student, who was very close to testing for black belt, has returned after a very long absence, and the instructor is making him retest for his brown belt curriculum before he can proceed to his black belt test.

That makes sense.

-Adam

That's the way it is in our school as well. You can come in to our dojangh and your rank will be honored, but you will not be able to test higher until you can demonstrate all lower rank material up to your current rank.

Which poses an interesting question, I know Mike Chat (XMA creator) did the 4th degree form when he tested into the ATA as a 4th degree, did they make him learn all the forms first as well?

Aodhan

You're back!

From what I understand (read) he went thru all lower belt forms thru 3rd degree (I'm sure he had no problem with) then he had to certify as an instructor. Did he go thru the entire 9 SSI seminars, probably not. Just the basic first three and the first test.

Can you immagine the pressure at his test.........he was up there by himself, correct?

-Adam

Well, my instructor has threatened to demote within colored belt rank if you forget your material. Also, a brown belt student, who was very close to testing for black belt, has returned after a very long absence, and the instructor is making him retest for his brown belt curriculum before he can proceed to his black belt test.

That makes sense.

-Adam

So do I. The US - Korean relationship has been suffering. I wish I had more time to write a good essay.

-Adam

This was sent to me I was going to post it as an article but I want all TKD participants to be able to read. If you enter an essay, why not post it on KF? I would love to read it. Good luck to all

-Adam

KOREAN CULTURAL SERVICE

Embassy of the Republic of Korea

2370 Massachusetts Avenue, NW

Washington D.C. 20008

Tel 202-797-6343 Fax 202-387-0413

korinfo@koreaemb.org

Dear Taekwondo Master,

Please allow me to introduce myself. My name is Lee Hyeon-pyo and I

serve as Director of the Korean Culture and Information Service of the

Embassy of the Republic of Korea to the United States.

Please let me express my deep thanks to you for enlarging and

deepening

the friendship between the U.S. and the Republic of Korea by teaching

Taekwondo.

Your unstinting efforts to teach and promulgate Taekwondo have made it

a beloved sport throughout the world.

The Korean Culture and Information Service will launch a new internet

site https://www.korus.net on Oct. 25 which serves to help young people from

the

Republic of Korea and the United States to communicate each other and

build grassroots ties that wi II strengthen our. all lance.

We are holding a Taekwondo Essay Contest" to celebrate the launch of

this exciting new site with fantastic prizes for contestants. The

essay

topics are "Taekwondo and I" and "Taekwondo and the ROK-U.S.

Friendship."

The second essay serves to strengthen cooperation between Republic of

Korea and the United States of America.

I hope that the essay contest will be an opportunity for Koreans and

Americans to understand each other.

This contest is open to anyone who loves Taekwondo, of any age, either

American or Korean. The enclosed brochure includes detailed

instructions and a description of prizes.

Please urge your students of Taekwondo to participate in this contest,

and feel free to contact me if I can be of assistance in any manner.

Sincerely Yours,

Lee Hyeon-pyo

Director

=====================================================================

Taekwondo Essay Contest

The Korean Cultural and Information Service of the Embassy of Republic

of Korea (ROK) to the United States (U.S.) is holding a "Taekwondo

Essay Contest" for the purpose of strengthening friendship and

cooperation

between the two nations.

PRIZES:

- Grand Prize (1 person): The overall best essay will win a round-

trip

airline ticket from the United States to

the ROK.

- First Prize (3 persons): The best essays written by 1 elementary

school

student, 1 middle or high school student,

and

1 adult will win $500.

- Second Prize (6 persons): 2 essays from each age group will win

$200.

- Third Prize (9 persons): 3 essays from each age group will win an

mp3 player, DVD player, or similar item.

TOPIC:

Elementary and Middle/High School Students: Applicants in high school

or below must write about "Taekwondo and I." This essay should address

your reasons for learning Taekwondo, its effects on your life, and

your

relationship with the ROK through Taekwondo.

College students and adults:

Applicants beyond high school must write about Taekwondo and the

ROK-U.S. friendship, specifically concerning the contributions

Taekwondo has made to this relationship and what Taekwondo can do in

the future to expand it.

SUBMISSIONS:

Essays will be accepted from October 25 through November 15, 2005.

Essays may be submitted over the internet by accessing https://www.korus.net

OR, Essays may be mailed to:

Korean Cultural Service

2370 Massachusetts Ave., NW

Washington DC, 20008

Telephone number: 202-797-6347

DETAILS:

Each essay must include a cover page with the participants name,

age/school level, address, and email address. All entries by mail must

be clearly marked as such, and postmarked by November 15. The essay

should be 500-1000 words. All entries must be typed. No formal style

is

required. This contest is open to anyone who loves Taekwondo of any

age,

American or Korean. Winners will be notified via e-mail or mail by the

end of November 2005.

It is a traditional sign of respect, put forth by the student, to go back as a white belt after a long absence.

Some take it away based upon a drastic unexpected change in the moral, ethical, or legal behavior or actions of the the student.

This is rare, but can happen.

In my system, the rank exists for the instructor first, student second.

However, since they did earn it, I will instead take away the ability to certify other's within the system if such happens.

A form of disassociation if you will.

Interesting. I know of a few people that would have effected.

-Adam

Is it rank? "I'm gonna bust you down to private soldier!"

Or is it a certification?

You can loose rank, if you accept that it is not skill based, but pecking order based. Otherwise, they can't take away your skill. That's like taking an exam and passing, then 2 years later getting a letter saying "Sorry, changed are mind, we're taking your pass back"

Great question (statement)

I would say color belts and recommended (probationary) black belts are rank. Dan is certification.

-Adam

I spoke to an ITF master recently who told me he busted one of his BB's down to white belt after the students returned after a 10 year absence. So, I guess it can be done.

Yea, if I had a certificate with their signature on it saying that I have earned a Dan rank......I would have issues with that.

-Adam

Hey! Found it.

Thanks for the thoughts! Keep them comming, they are working!

The style I study there is no belt or rank,but whatever you get out of your training can't be taken away.

Not even a sash? How do you measure your skill?

I can't really comment on TKD forms, as I've only been studying a short while and only know the Taeguek forms (I know 1-5 and am learning 6).

However, (coming from a karate background), I was surprised at how "karate-ish" the Taeguek patterns are - I would have thought that there would have been much more kicking in them than there actually is.

TKD did get it's start via Japan............

Edit: Modern Taekwondo got it's start via Japan.

In every school I've trained at, the rank you earn is yours. No one can "take it away from you". Even if you stop training and them return much much later you are still that rank. If you are not "worthy" of the rank by way of lack of continued training, that is your shame to bear. You just have to buck up and get going again and prove yourself to yourself.

As for required continued attendance requirement? That to me is nonsense.

That's the way it is here, your world may differ.

That's the difference between a rec rank and a decided rank. Once you're a decided - you're set. Unless you do something stupid. All rank, unless decided black belt, can be resended. That's the way it is in my world.

I'll jump in here as well.

I'm a former ATA instructor. Former as in out for over 5 years. I now study Hwa-Rang Taekwondo under Grand Master Jack Pierce (ITF certified) I can say of all the Korean MA's the Songham forms are the best. They flow very well, from beginning to end. They mix in much more feet than the normal (ITF/WTF) form. The best way to compare these forms would be to look at Moon-moo (for you ITF people) and I really can't think of a WTF form that would come close. Maybe Ko-Ryo or Kum-Kang, but there really is not that much leg work with thoes. I do miss thoes forms, and I still practice them.

-Adam

sorry to make tou mad buddy its just that there was post earlier that said something about being sewed if cought doing a form in without bieng regestered.

Well that was me. The Songahm forms are protected as the intellectual property of the ATA. If anyone is caught teaching the Songahm forms without permission form the ATA (good luck with that) legal action will probably be taken. It's happened before, a group of former ATA instructors (ITC) were teaching the Songahm forms and were sued. The suit was dropped after they agreed to refrain from teaching them.

Heck, when GM Pierce dropped out of the ATA, I was given explicit instructions on how to answer the phones. After what happened with the ITC gents, he wanted to give no reason for anyone to look at him, for any reason.

There are orgs who require a recomended black belt student to test within 6 months for a decided rank, or they would be demoted to the previous rank.

And I know someone who was demoted from 2nd Degree black belt to a 1st Degree recomended rank for bad mouthing their instructor. Funny thing is he's now a 5th Degree and a regional VP.

-Adam

Come to think of it I did meet EGM H. U. Lee, and trained under him as well. He was an 8th & 9th Degree at the time, seeing that he was awarded his 10th Degree after his death.

-Adam

I agree. I would be more likley to through out a basic joint lock than a 720 hook any time.

-Adam

On the street, I always ask myself, "What would Chuck Norris do?" And then, its a no brainer.

But then again, since its never happened to me on the street (in 23 years of training) its not an issue. Of course had I known that was gonna be the case, I wouldn't have bought all those pairs of Chuck Norris & Billy Jack jeans from Century & all those Rex Kwon Do pants fro Zubbaz.

Zubbaz? Never heard of them.......I thought he was wearing Ottomix pants.

-Adam

Man, that sucks! Can you call that bad judges, or a bad system in general? Do these judges get certified in any way?

-Adam

I agree. I would be more likley to through out a basic joint lock than a 720 hook any time.

-Adam