ONE TROOF

I do Finnish Kenpo in the snow. We spar on ice drifts and then club baby seals for our dinner. Does anyone do Japanese Chuan Fa? I'm a 15 th dan Soke in it. We borrowed the typical AK motto, "Give me money and I'll give you rank". Time reveals everything for what it truly is. Does anyone do Qatar Kempo?

How about Judo Chuan Fa or Muy Savate?

Hah! Coming from one of the oldest...oh wait, you beat me to it. [/end spam] Anyway, why would the WKF not consider Shorin Ryu a traditional style? I'm not exactly well-educated on tournament politics, but that just seems a little strange, especially as it accepts Goju Ryu. You mean you didn't know that all of the major Japanese karate governing associations disregard Shorin Ryu as a true major style? They only recognize four JAPANESE styles for many competitions and I would suspect even the Arnold folks follow suit. These styles are Wado, Japanese Goju, Japanese Shito, and Shotokan. Kyokushinkai and its offshoots have K-1. Real karate styles like Ryuei Ryu, Shorin, Uechi, Okinawan Goju, Okinawan Shito, Isshin and Motobu Ryu are left * out a lot of the time. C'mon you had to have known this. Anytime I can put a Japanese style karate-ka in his/her place I do. Any chance I get to show someone like a Shotokan practitioner that what they practice is schoolkid karate I show 'em and I let 'em know. The Japs' have always been racist, xenophobic bigots, and shite ain't changed. They like to "take a bite and leave the rest". They are vultures to the Nth degree and the most opportunistic of the capitalist-minded dolts out there. For everything they've done to perpetuate their watered down karate and I guess karate in general, they've done everyuthing in their power to dismiss and kill real Okinawan karate--the essence of it all and the original intent. That's why Hodge-Podge Ryu and crap styles like American Kenpo are the most popular. Manifest whatever you want from a limited imagination and narrow thinking. The rest of the idiots will vibe because they're on that average "tip", if you know-what-I-mean! That's the new world way! What can we make money off of now, then throw away? O-friggin'-Su foos'!

So you are a yudansha? Cool. Seito IS very white crane. I learn from Lindsey exclusively so how can I not know crane principles? It's inherent to our forms and principles. How do you like the way Sensei Lidsey teaches? Sorry to get OT. Naihanchi is very good kata, no matter how you do it. That's that.

Yeah, well I disagree with Motobu on this point and agree with Itosu. It just makes sense to use the Naihanchi stance for Naihanchi, if you understand biomechanics and physics. P.A.L.: I would try the Shorinkan version, but I do Matsumura Seito, under Lindsey Sensei whom I'm sure you know . Are you part of the White Crane study group?

Yes I agree. The stance should "feel" as though you are pigeon-toed, with pressure exerted on the outer foot and leg which lends to rising/springing power, a valuable lesson free throw shooters in the NBA have learned. There is no need for extreme pigeon-toedeness. There is a need for a strong and flexible root/base and supple upper body. If you do this kata in any kind of horse stance (kiba dachi) or a square stance then I don't know if you're getting the lessons and qigong that are inherent in Naihanchi. The horse stance, which the Matsumura guys call PaiSai Dachi, is better suited for Passai Sho/Dai and other kata which teach more falling power or maximizing gravitational force. Where do you study in Cali?

My Kobayashi sensei called that a "hard bow" stance. The Matsumura Seito version of Naihanchi Sandan begins with stepping (the right foot) into a pigeon-toed or naihanchi dachi. Next is a thumb breaking strike (where the right wrist bone strikes to the left wrist). I guess Soken eliminated that modified forward stance and made the entire kata in naihanchi dachi, like shodan and nidan. I don't know if the Shorinji Ryu, Seibukan, Shobayashi (Sukunaihayashi) types do the naihanchi kata in a pigeon-toed stance. I know that Matsubayashi doesn't and Shorinkan and Seito definitely do, but what are the benefits of training Naihanchi without naihanchi stance? This is Shuri's answer to sanchin, but how is that if you do a style that doesn't do a stance similar to sanchin (hourglass)? BTW this is technically my first post. Patrick keeps hating and kicking me out of his "kingdom" for telling the truth. I bet he's fat and angry. (j/k) Good thread.