evergrey

Hehe, the Kyokushin people I know are sweet and humble and not bullies who try to solve everything with their fists. That's a last resort. I am horribly out of shape, and was worse when I started Kyokushin. It's a great way to get IN shape, let me tell you. OSU

Hey Patrick- thank you for all your hard work! It'll be okay, ultimately. :}

Well I'm a member of a knockdown fighters forum, and k4l welcomes all related styles also. I am happy to play with my knockdown brothers and sisters. I still only can represent myself, and by extension to a degree my style... but certainly when someone has asked for advice about a style and they mention that they want to do an alive karate with serious contact and practicality, I'll suggest Kyokushin or one of it's relatives, including Enshin and Ashihara, or anything related. But I'll also tell them that I'm biased, haha!

OSU, I'm happy to band together. I just don't have any authority yet. :}

OSU, thank you Dobbersky, I'm honored by your invitation, and if I ever manage to get out there, I'll be sure to look you good folks up! :} I think there are some Enshin dojos around... I met an Enshin instructor at a local tournament but I don't think any of his guys entered. I could be wrong. I don't know of any local Ashihara folks. Always happy to meet new knockdown people, and martial artists in general, though. OSU!

OSU, thank you, bushido_man96! And Dobbersky- I accept and acknowledge the styles that developed out of Kyokushin. I just cannot speak for them, as I have never experienced them. I can only speak for Kyokushin because that is what I know.

I think that goes for all MAists, evergrey. I've never met so friendly people before starting Karate. No matter the style or location. No matter if you saw them before or even know their names. Oh yes, it's a wonderful world! The only exceptions for me (when it has come to meeting people in person) have been a BJJ guy who hated all TMA and it's "trappings," and an Aikidoka (of all people!) who did his level best to harm me at a party. Guess he still felt he had something to prove? Funny thing, when my instructors let it be known that they would like to speak with him and his sensei, he magically vanished off the face of the earth!

It'll be fine! There are a couple of power lifters in my particular training lineage- my Shihan can bench press 600 pounds! Crazy stuff! And he is not young. Well, not chronologically young. He can run rings around me, that's for sure! The really important thing is to stretch after your workout. Otherwise, the muscles will tighten and become less flexible as you heal. I myself am going to start lifting weights soon. I'm looking forward to the extra bit of power the extra muscle will give me! OSU

OSU, do not forget the Shotokan influence! And he studied in Judo and Aiki-Jutsu as well. I wouldn't call TKD an influence on Kyokushin at all, to be honest. Anyway, I absolutely love Kyokushin. It is my passion! And it still has a great reputation, though a lot of people don't realize that the no punches to the head thing is not always the case outside of tournaments. The politics are lame. That's why things like Kyokushin4life exist now... a lot of us are tired of the politics and the games and old rivalries and grudges. Thanks to the internet, us subversive types are able to communicate and work together cross-faction. Muahahahahaaaaaaa! *cough cough* OSU

In my dojo we sometimes put on MMA gloves and punch to the head and face. Well, at this point in my martial arts career, what that really translates to is that I eat a lot of knuckles, lol! But yeah, people often mistake the strict tournament rules as the whole of the style. In the dojo we do head punches, we do grabs, sweeps, throws, armbars, and stuff like that too. :}

OSU, I don't think I have seen Garyu kata yet... In our dojo, we still chamber the low mawashi geris, and turn the hip over to drive our weight DOWN into the thigh. Hurts. OSU

I'm totally sharing your tea master story with my Sensei. I know he'll get a big kick out of it! He also loaned me a copy of Living the Martial Way. Great book, for the most part.

Heh, yeah, we're the crazy ones. :} And thanks! Though I have to say, by and large the Kyokushin people I've met have been some of the sweetest, humblest, give you the shirt off their backs kind of people I've ever met. I guess they have nothing to prove, haha!

Oh yes, please write that as well! That was BRILLIANT!

Haha, what were you waiting to hear, MasterPain?

I agree with a lot of the points that have been made in this thread, and will add a style-specific thought of my own, as I do Kyokushin, like the OP does. (OSU!) What would Mas Oyama do, if he were, say, 33 today and Kyokushin was one big organization? I think that he would take himself and his best students and go up against some big MMA guys. He would gauge his style against what is popular today, and then adjust accordingly. He would incorporate the aspects of MMA he found to be effective. He would use what works. It seems to me that he was quite unafraid of testing his style against others, or changing his style, or learning new things and adjusting to the times. I think that it is a mistake to become like flies trapped in amber. It's a mistake to water down Kyokushin, and it's a mistake to change it completely, but I was always taught that one of the fundamentals of Kyokushin was "use what works." If something worked 20 years ago but really doesn't work today because the science of fighting has advanced or changed, then we have to grow and change with the times and learn to counter these new things. We have to learn to adapt to fighting as it is today. That is how it is in the dojo I train at. We have a very strong lineage going directly to Mas Oyama. One of the instructors spent a good chunk of time training under Sosai himself, even. Most of what we do is traditional Kyokushin, HOWEVER, we do things that some other schools might not agree with. Sweeps, grabs, throws, armbars, knees, stuff like that. There are a fair number of takedowns in our Kumite. And after class, there's a lot of grappling. Many of our more advanced fighters cross-train in something like BJJ, because we understand that, like any style, there are holes in our training, and that to be a complete martial artist able to go up against other styles effectively, we need to understand grappling. We do our best to not go to the ground in normal Kumite, BUT... It's like riding horses. I was talking to another horseperson once about learning emergency dismounts and learning how to fall a lot more safely. I asked her if she'd learned any of that, and she said, "Oh noooooo! I just learn to NEVER COME OFF THE HORSE!" Here's the thing... if you ride a motorcycle, you're going to drop your bike at some point. If you ride horses, you're going to come off the horse sometime. If you fight outside of your dojo, and especially outside of your style when you're only a striking style, eventually, at some point, it's going to go to the ground. Maybe not 91% of the fights like some people claim, but at some point it's probably going to happen. What do you do then? Do you know what to do? If we are too inflexible, we will eventually become relics. That's part of why my dojo also has open sparring days, where all styles are welcome, and there tends to be as much rolling as there is stand-up. Maybe even more rolling... We have to keep up with the times, we have to not compromise so much just to make money, and one other thing- We have to keep up with the way people COMMUNICATE. I've run into this attitude that karate should be secretive! Word of mouth only! Well guess what? People don't make choices that way any more. Word of mouth? That's the INTERNET now. Secrets? Okay, I mean I can understand having some, but we aren't in feudal Japan any more. People want to know what they're getting into. They rely on the internet to learn about the reputation of a school. They really do. They go on yelp. They read BLOGS. They want to feel a connection BEFORE they walk in the door. Not everybody can have or wants a TV show... but if we want to connect to the public, gain a reputation, keep our styles ALIVE, I think we need to be prepared to tell a story. We need to be willing to draw people in, to show them some of our world. Not for our own glory and not as a stroking of the ego, but as a means of communication that is effective in the modern world. With no students, there are no teachers. This is an era where being too secretive is met with suspicion. It is not looked upon with some sense of mystical reverence. Instead of thinking, "this is a great honor to be included in this elite society that gains special knowledge," people will say "what do they have to hide? Are they afraid they will look silly? That they won't measure up to the UFC and MMA? That they'll be exposed as frauds?" It's like... restaurants in China. Here in the states, a brightly lit restaurant is usually seen as a cheap place. Dimly lit places are full of mood lighting, and seen as classy. That's the past. In China, a dimly lit place is trying to hide poor quality food and cockroaches. A brightly lit place is clean with good food, and seen as a good, classy restaurant. They have nothing to hide, and are full of flash and flair. That's the present of martial arts in the eyes of the public. So if you want to bring it back, adapt, innovate, overcome, grow. Hold fast to your standards of training... and tell them a story.

Wait, no bunkaiception? We have to go deeper! It is actually a strike! BWAAAAAAAAAAAAAAH! In all seriousness, Taikyoku Sono Ichi probably doesn't have a whole lot of meanings... but I would likely be corrected even on that.

I got all rowdy wanting to train for full contact knockdown. I was also, however, WAY too tired and dizzy to fight that day, but I fought anyway. I threw a kick at my Sensei, he caught my leg, I lost my balance and I came down wrong, hyper-extended my knee to the side and snapped my ACL right through. That pretty much ended the class for the day- they'd NEVER heard me scream in the dojo before. Grunt, yes, laugh and said "WOW that was a good one," yes, but NEVER had I screamed. That'd be the worst injury, anyway. As for beatings, eh, those are generally a blur. I go into berzerker mode and I don't really tally up the aches and pains until later when the adrenaline has worn off. I've gone home from class covered in bruises many a time. I've had my bell rung with a punch to the ear and I've had the wind knocked out of me. I've had a few fights with Sensei where I've had to say "mind if I just lie down here for a minute?" a-la Ed Gruberman. You know that feeling? Where the pain reaches a certain threshold and you're just kind of done? And you have to lie down? that doesn't happen too much any more. I've had a few shots to the shin where I've gotten a little too quiet and pale and had to pause... but at least my threshold has been raised. Anyway, still, the worst has most certainly been my ACL snapping, though that was more of an accident than a beating.

I always love reading what you have to say, Bob! OSU!

In Kyokushin I have heard that in most organizations, after 5th dan or so it's all politics. Politics, tenure teaching, and the belief in the organization that the person is worthy of grading. But I mean, there's a lot of orgs where 3rd dan involves a 50 man kumite. By the time someone gets up to 8th dan, they're often in their 60s. I don't think at that point it's fair to ask them to do a 100 man kumite... at that point, their abilities shine through their students. OSU *edit* My Sensei was subjected to a SURPRISE 50-man kumite for his SHODAN. Haha, he just told me about that. Wow.

Oh no, I keep getting in over my head, I know! Or is that under my guard?

I train in Kyokushin and get punched in the head and face. Just sayin'.

OSU Bob, Shihan has us do the kick the ground with the ball of your foot thing too!

Hey, Mas Oyama once said that ballet dancers would make excellent fighters, actually...

OSU, thank you both. :} Yeah, seems there's nothin' out there... thankfully I found someone who is Kyokushin and going to be in the area soonish. He's willing to give my buddy a taste of it anyway. OSU!