JaseP

Not every federation requires there to be a separate Sah Bum and 4th Dan test... Mine doesn't... In fact I'd say most TSD federations DON'T break it out that way... Usually the minimum time to earn a 4th Dan is about 13.5 years of uninterupted training. Most people take longer (education, illness, family obligations, etc.).

Jin Do is really a form for 1st to 2nd Dan... Bassai Dae is appropriate for 3rd Gups and up... I can't think of a Tang Soo Do federation that teaches those forms to Green Belts... (which is what 4th Gup is). There are various places on the web where you can download video clips of the forms being performed... but you really can't learn them that way. You're better off learning them in class.

Lots of personal stuff to deal with... Separation and pending divorce (amicable)... New job. New girlfriend problems. Fixing up apartment. Broadband internet and wireless router. Etc., Etc.

What style of Tang Soo Do doesn't strike to the head? Many schools train with no punches to the head due to the risk of injury during sparring,... it's not that there IS no punching to the head in the style,... it's just to prevent people from going home bloody...

Tang Soo Do borrowed the forms and incorporated them into the style... So the forms do not define the lineage of Tang Soo Do. Tang Soo Do/Soo Bahk Do also has Korean forms, not shared by any other style.

Uhmmm, not at the tournaments I've judged at for the last 13 years or so... Open just means that you don't have to be invited... The Forms competition can be Open, Traditional, etc... If the forms competition is Open, then the Xtreme MA gymnastics poodo is permitted. If it is traditional, you risk being torpedoed in your scores by doing a form with flips etc. (Many Judges, myself included, take very seriously the "Traditional" heading for Traditional Forms competition). When judging Open competition, I don't give backflips, etc. any higher score. I judge the form strictly on its martial content. If it has it despite the flips, then it gets a higher score,... if not then low score... Same for weapons forms,... I once saw a guy doing a Sai form, and holding them wrong like Jen Garner in Elektra (index and middle fingers straddling the shaft of the Sai)... I gave him a 6... You need to be congnizant that there are still "Old-timers" like me and others out there who don't care how acrobatic a form is... we want to see martial arts technique in the form, stances, proper alignment, kick control, snap, etc. If we don't see it, but see a gymnastics routine,... we'll shut you down, no matter how entertaining it is.

True,... but the color belt system is more on the order of 150 years old, borrowed from Judo... To me it doesn't make sense to use belts that are outside of convention. You get problems in open tournaments, when people change styles (due to relocation, etc), or when people are trying to investigate the system to join. It leads to confusion and doesn't change the fact that the more belts there are in a system, the more oppurtunity exists to charge additional money for tests... and hence be labeled a "McDojo." This is both real and perceived... Keep in mind that most systems traditionally use a gup or kyu system for advancement in the color belts and they typically work their way backward from 10... If you have a different color belt for each of these ranks... fine. But if you not only have those ranks but add stripes to the belts to further create testing oppurtunities, the school is most definitely a McDojo,... even if they offer good instruction. Overt commericalism needs to be balanced by the teaching of the art... The best scenario is when the commerical aspects of the school are transparent to the instruction.

I'll bite... There were a lot of ticked off Masters when KJN Hwang Kee turned operations over to HC Hwang due to the seniority issue. However, it was well known that this was going to occur for many years (hence the split early on creating the World Tang Soo Do, International Tang Soo Do, et al.). When it finally came to pass, many Masters who were on the fence finally jumped ship rather than stay with an organization who many felt was too concerned with propriety and economics (read - money for the people in power) than being concerned with the promotion of the art... This was not something that was foreign to the Moo Duk Kwan. There was a significant factor of economics and control involved in the whole refusal to participate in the TaeKwonDo unification of the 40s, 50s and 60s... Coincidentally, or fortuitously (depending how you look on it), keeping seperate from the TaeKwonDo unification was something that many were inclined to do anyway, since there was a notable decline in the standards associated with going with the standards the younger generation of TaeKwonDo Masters who were in charge of the administration of that movement were promoting at the time (1960s standards)... Ramifications of the TaeKwonDo unification continue to this day,... such as critizism that it promotes sport as opposed to art, quick promotion schdules to Dan ranks,... sliding scale as to who is considered Ko Dan Ja (senior Dan holder or Masters,... 5th Dan as opposed to the traditional 4th Dan)... etc. Tang Soo Do resisted these tendencies,... but at the same time, the motivations were also money and power related. If the money and power related motivations ceased, there wouldn't be any concerns as to the US Soo Bahk Do Moo Duk Kwan. However, Dan promotions continued to get more expensive,... restrictions on the activities of Masters got more pronounced, and seniority got less concerned with how seasoned the Masters were who were in charge... all the while, intellectual propertly issues were raised (a bad mistake, since they are still based on very tenuous grounds, legally speaking)... All of that contributed towards the current trend of USSBDMDK hierarchy leaving the organization and striking out on their own.

A red belt should never turn pink,... belts aren't suppoed to be washed. If they appear tattered, it should be because of training, and not the spin and fluff cycle of the dryer... That's what I meant... a red belt that turned pink with ware... hence it's not a McDojo school and he can hand you your rear.... I don't know where the washed comment came from... I made no comment about the washing of the belt. Red belts NEVER turn pink through wear alone. They only get that way if they are washed... I have two red belts,... one from when I made Black Belt under my old instructor, and another from when I re-tested for Black again with my current instructor. They are both bright red. They are also both well over a decade old... (the DARKER of the two is actually over 20 years old)... There haven't been red belts made that fade through wear for over 25 years.

Belt meanings should always be there,... otherwise there was no rationale for choosing the color to represent the rank in the first place. So each color of a belt in a system should be representative of that level in some way, concrete or abstract. Traditionally, they represented seasons, and there were 4 colors... Other colors were added to ease the anxiety of the beginning students. The problem has come from systems that incorporate MANY colors,... especially when there are more than 10 (10 representing the traditional gup/kyu systems that were first developed, backwards from 10 to 1, then the Dan ranks from 1 to 10,... 10 being reserved for the single head-honcho Master [Grandmaster, Kwan Jang, whatever] of the system, or for dead 9th Dans). Then came along systems which increased Dan rankings beyond 10, made relativley youthful people high level Dans to appease egos, and added all sorts of extra levels within the color belts, to appease the color belts (or their parents) fragile egos and make money. So multiple belt colors (7+) aren't proof of a McDojo/McDojang,... but they are an indicator... as are the implementation of some other dubious marketing schemes (karate birthday parties, karate day care, one fee to make it to a certain level, Black Belt Clubs where the members aren't Black Belts, teams and programs where there are additionals fees paid, etc.). Students need to understand that a martial arts school or program is a business, and must be run that way, on the other hand, the teacher is teaching an art,... and so there needs to be some seperation between the business aspect and the art aspect... Adding all sorts of belt colors into the system smacks of business intruding into art... That is why I am against the practice.

As for forms,... Stances, stances, stances, and, oh yeah,... stances... As far as overall, just go and have fun,... Put forth your best effort and don't expect to win. If you do,... Great! If you don't, then you have learned where you need to improve.

If you are a Fourth Dan in TSD or higher, and are permitted to wear the Ko Dan Di (Master's Belt), then you are a Master, and should not feel any inclination one way or another about putting "Master" before your name... It is not a breach of ettiquete to do so... The protocol and etiquette are very important, but should not be taken to extreme. For instance, when I first made my 4th Dan (Ko Dan Ja ranking), and students would not bow to me at my instructor's school (if I wasn't in uniform, for instance),... I would get offended. I don't anymore. My wife will get offended for me if she sees it happen, and I just tell her, "It doesn't matter to me,... I'm humble." I predict she will be the same way that I am a couple of years into her Master's ranking... The protocol and etiquette are there to make teaching of the arts orderly. You can't have martial arts instruction in chaos and disorder,... things will not get taught and injury will happen. Additionally, it is there to help spill over into a person's everyday life, to make them more polite and disciplined in society. However, the discipline and etiquette should not be there to be an end in and of itself, for vanity's sake. If it gets to that point, then it is too much.

Hmm well, my favorite is between Kong Sang Koon, Hwa Sun, or Chil Song Oh Lo.

Our Dojangs (those in my instructor's federation) very explicitly teach values to our students. We end the class each time with a short lecture. Often we address values like hard work or using the martial arts for self-defense, or acting with honor and respect... sometimes the lectures are just upcoming events updates.

All this talk of time requirements is fine and dandy, but it doesn't change the fact that people learn at different rates. One person spending 5000 hours learning something might take another only 500. My wife learns very slowly. I learn very quickly. It took her 3.5 years to make Black Belt with our instructor, who is a very reputable instructor in Tang Soo Do. It took me 2.5 years under my old instructor. I was a better Black Belt in 2.5 years than she was in 3.5... I don't think she'd dispute either that or the fact that when I earned my 4th Dan, I was more of a Master than she is now that she is earning hers... What matters is dedication and learning. You can put the breaks on someone who isn't maturing well enough to be a Black Belt, but you can't really deny that they have got the material. Not everyone can learn that way. And YES there are some things that require time to learn... But NONE of them are learned at 1st Dan. I made my 1st Dan 21 years ago... So I know... The things that take time to learn get learned AFTER 1st Dan. I don't think that Black Belt means anything different today than it did 20 years ago, or 30 years ago.

Because of something called Roe Pah, meaning splitting waters (tributaries being part of the same river),... it varies from school to school. There is no one way that TSD practitioners spar. It even varies from student to student within a school or federation. Generally no gear or Hogu is worn,... takes to long to put that stuff on (and some say it's for wimps, others say it encourages hard contact without developing control). Generally, the emphasis is on self-defense orientation, as opposed to point fighting rules (but see disclaimer below). Some schools allow light to medium contact. Others don't allow any (liability reasons). Striking edges are generally those that cause the most damage (ball of the foot for round kicks, heel for side kicks, back of the heel for hook kicks and axe kicks, ridge hands, palm stikes, etc.). Some allow hand techniques to the head, or even a light to medium contact no-holds barred style of fighting, complete with take downs and some grappling. Pushes are generally OK with most schools. Others restrict free fighting to tournament point fighting rules for liability reasons. There is no specific combination that is favored other than the practitioner's favorite. Both lead and back leg kicks are used when appropriate. Even soft style technique can be integrated. So how do Tang Soo Do practitioners spar??? Count the Tang Soo Do practitioners,... that many ways...

So, if there are 10 gup levels,... when are they adding the extra belt??? My vote is for fuscia, or teal... or muave,... I like muave,... but then there is tope,... Oh, I'm so confused now...

The belt colors were originally to represent the seasons,... White = Winter, with all the potential under the snow Green = Spring, with blossoming potential Red (or Brown) = Summer, with growing heat/intensity Black (or Midnight Blue) = Fall, cool with maturity like the maturity of the year... Masters' belts had a red stripe (borrowed from the Japanese systems) because after a period of time the black (or Midnight Blue) fabric that had been wrapped around the belt would start to wear through. As people got more money, they represented this by putting a red stripe on one side of the belt (even though belts wear from the edges in... ). Any other colors in the system are for reasons of marketing, rather than grading, as there are 10 gups (kyu in Japanese) on the color belt end of grading, plus Cho Dan Bo (probationary period for 1st Dan) in many systems.

Back in the day, there were none of these crazy colored belts for color belt levels... There was only White, Green, and Red or Brown. Yellow and Orange were added later, after the late 60s. For Black Belts, there was the Black or Midnight Blue belt and the Masters' belt... Fancy belts were reserved for Masters' level. A lot of this belt proliferation is all about giving the consumer some fabric to justify the testing fees...

Can no longer look at Black Belts the way we did before... Hmmm,... I think there are a lot of reasons for that. One of those reasons is that people are more exposed to the martial arts than ever before. You used to be able to ask a 10 year old the difference between karate, kung fu and judo, and they couldn't tell you... Now, a 6 year old can probably tell you. When I started training, martial arts still had a mystique about them. It was fading, but it was still there. No longer. I would say that by the time they hit their 30s, between 33-45% of people, at the very least, have at least tried one martial art... 20-30 years ago that ratio would have been more like 15-25%, possibly less. When I got my black belt, there were probably 12-15 people in my division in a tournament. Now, there are probably 35 people in that division. There are simply more people training nowdays. Back in those days a 2nd degree Black Belt was a big deal. Nowdays, they are a dime a dozen. Half my adult class are Black Belts. I like it because I can teach higher end stuff,... but 24 years ago, that would be unheard of in a YMCA (especially the small one where I teach)... At my instructor's school, there have actually been parents who have become miffed if there wasn't a Master present to teach their 6 year old white belt kid (when he or his higher ranked students weren't in, for example),... Back when I started, the Master was the guy you only got to see once every 6 mos. or so. So does Black Belt mean the same thing??? No. It used to mean rare as well as knowledgeable and skilled. Now, it may only mean knowledgeable and skilled. That alone will diminish it in people's eyes. Another thing that diminises it is that after BEING a Black Belt for 20+ years, you don't hold the rank in as high of esteem as you did. Your knowledge is an exponential function higher. You still see it as a milestone,... but its one you already passed over. I also see it when Black Belts get their nose out of joint when they make the rank... expecting a copious amount of butt kissing directed their way and don't get it. I think people have puffed the rank up to be much more than it is. I think a serious amount of that is because they expect Black Belts to be as rare as they once were. I really don't think the skill level has changed much. What HAS changed is the commitment level, and perhaps the discipline level. But the skill level,... the knowledge level,... no. Doubt this?!?!? Go watch an old Chuck Norris movie (he got his 1st Dan in Tang Soo Do in the early 60s)... See what it is he is doing in the movie that we considered to be so special way back then. I think you'll be surprised at how "un-special" it seems now...

Just be prepared for a lot of quizical and "ticked off" looks from other Korean stylists if you go to open tournaments... It's like the equivalent of using a Japanese "Renshi" belt (Red and White Checkerboard) for a kyu level in a Japanese/Okinawan style...

It's going to confuse a lot of people.

Your "red tag" blue belt with the red stripe through looks dangerously like the Tang Soo Do/Soo Bahk Do Masters' belt... Which can be either Black with a red stripe through or Midnight blue with a red stripe through one side.

I can't speak for the US Soo Bahk Do Moo Duk Kwan, but most federations composed of ex-members have a time requirement more on the order of 3.5 years... There is no such thing as "muscle memory" all memory takes place in the brain. "Automatic" technique requires imprinting the technique into the basal ganglia of the brain... like walking, riding a bike or a dozen other activities... As for time requirements, I seriously doubt that the average black belt, regardless of system (Tang Soo Do, TaeKwonDo, Soo Bahk Do, HwaRangDo, This federation, that federation, whatever) has a truly adequate grasp over their technique... That's despite time limits,... even the 5 year plan Black Belts are the same. I remember as first or second Dan seeing other Black Belts who's technique was so sloppy I couldn't fathom how they were able to be considered a Dan ranking. How do I know this??? Easy, I've trained over 23 years, promoted somewhere around twenty o fmy own students to black belt, sat on somewhere between 40-60 testing boards, and taught so many classes I wouldn't even hazzard to count them. My instructor often takes off to do erunds when I come down to his school and just leaves me to teach... But there are an isolated few,... they can be 11 year old kids, or 50 year old women,... or teenagers,... who just nail their technique and are the exception. Some of them have trained a long time, but others only a short while. I comes down to the individual, their drive, their hard work, and their mental capacity for understanding that determines when they've gotten it. And his Black Belts, my Black Belts, the numerous Black Belts I've seen in countless tournaments,... most of them I can pick out problems with their technique (independant of style, even basic principle). There are some things that only come with time,... but, as I've said before, the skill level associated with 1st Dan doesn't contain much (or any) of that. There are a lot of TaeKwonDo schools that don't teach forms, or don't really care too much for them,... just slap them in for another thing to learn before Black Belt... Less to learn,... easier to make the progression... Again, I think the time requirement is a good thing for most, but you can't generalize and say that NOBODY can earn their Black Belt in 2-3 years. There are always exceptions. There is always the person who can be shown something once and be able to do it like the've been shown. It depends on the student. The problem is allowing the person who doesn't learn that fast to make the same progression, because they are ambitious but lack the ability to back that ambition up. The second problem is the bad blood people start feeling when others start to get promoted ahead of them. It makes them feel inadequate and quit. You can't run a strong school that way. The only way you are able to prevent that is to implement a time requirement. "Special" promotion schedules get mixed up too much with marketing schemes like "Black Belt Clubs" (our Black Belt Club is a club made up of people who have MADE their Black Belts). Most of the people who are arguing that time requirements should be implemented are the ones who took a long time to get their Black Belts. I'm wondering if there isn't a fair amount of egocentrism there,... thinking because that is the way it was for them, that it should be the way for all... A time limit in the 3-4 year range is a nice compromise to getting the "naturals" and the people who just skate through (but aren't lazy enough to fail) to the level...

Go with a middle-weight... Century's heavy canvas wears through too easily... Their contact pant is very nice,... as is their pro pant, if you like the shoelace style lace-up front... Stay away from their heavy jackets though. The collars wear out very easily, and they tend to use cotton thread, as opposed to poly thread for the seams, which means the thread tends to shrink and give-up...