JohnnyS Posted July 17, 2003 Posted July 17, 2003 If you're talking strictly striking arts, then I believe the boxer will have the advantage. If it's striking vs grappling, then the grappler will have the advantage, unless the boxer is a lot stronger, bigger and better conditioned, and can make the grappler plays his game. BJJ - Black Belt under John Will (Machado)Shootfighting - 3rd Degree Black BeltTKD - Black Belt
Treebranch Posted July 17, 2003 Posted July 17, 2003 Sansooser If Lennox didn't chase him there would be a fight at all. Takamatsu fought giant from China back in the day he was told to have been extremely powerful. He was said to be able to lift 200 lbs with each hand and was a Master Chinese Boxer. Takamatsu tired he out and was ready to destroy him, and someone begged Takamatsu to stop. They saw that Takamatsu would have killed him, Takamatsu spaired him and they became good friends. You have to think Takamatsu killed people, he knew how to kill. Lennox is a boxer and has never killed anyone to my knowledge. Have you seen when Boxers get in the clinch. They slip one hit and clinch. I know what to do in the clinch, do you? "It is easier to find men who will volunteer to die, than to find those who are willing to endure pain with patience.""Lock em out or Knock em out"
Prodigal Son Posted July 17, 2003 Posted July 17, 2003 The boxers we are refering to here would win every time. You are not taking account of the reach that these guys have - a 5'4" japanese MA guy simply couldn't get close enough to a 6'7" boxer without getting hit. And I know that all the Karate guys think that you can take anyone out with a Gyaka Tzuki - but it's not true. Tyson or Lewis would kill most of us mortals with one good head shot, and they can take punishment from guys their own size all day long - so even if you could hit them 50 times, they'd never go down. The eyes (or a devastatingly good knee-job) are the only way with guys like that - and think how close one would have to be in order to reach up to Tyson's eyes.... And even a good grappler would have difficlty with the sheer strength of those guys - it would be like grappling a wild gorilla ! Martial artists need to repect boxers as martial artists - because they have wicked art and they actually fight. >>>PS<<< ------------------------------------------------------------------------Self-defense is only an illusion, a dark cloak beneath which lurks a razor-sharp dagger waiting to be plunged into the first unwary victim. Sifu Wong.
Treebranch Posted July 17, 2003 Posted July 17, 2003 Prodigal Son. It's not that we don't respect boxers. It just that if you fight a boxer the stupidest thing you can do is try to box them. The length of someone's arms are an advantage in Boxing because the sport of boxing requires the fighters to go toe to toe. I wouldn't dare fight a Boxer that way. I would tie him up and take him down where he has no training. Are you saying MA's can't fight, what do call Belfort, Ruas, Tito Ortiz, Shamrock they're MA's aren't they? I think most Boxers wouldn't want to fight NHB, that takes a certain kind of person to do that stuff. Nobody doubt that a Champion Boxer is well conditioned and can hold his own, but I was referring to a real life and death fight, not a ring match. If you don't see a difference between the two, oh well. "It is easier to find men who will volunteer to die, than to find those who are willing to endure pain with patience.""Lock em out or Knock em out"
sansoouser Posted July 17, 2003 Author Posted July 17, 2003 ya i see tree branch, boxers aren't trained to fight to win, the hard way. They listen for a bell or a reff. But in a fight you listen for the police with guns or you watch your enemy hit the ground. So but Tree are you saying that against a bigger and stronger opponent Takamatsu would just run around them doing rolls and stuff until they got tired and when they let their gaurd down pounce like a tiger and kill? What ma did he take? The amateur shoots his hands out ferociously, but lacks any true power. A master is not so flamboyant, but his touch is as heavy as a mountain.
Prodigal Son Posted July 18, 2003 Posted July 18, 2003 I never said martial artists can't fight, treebranch - I said that martial artists understimate boxers. Read my post again if you are having problems understanding it. This thread is called Champs Against Champs, and that is what I am talking about. Champs Against Chumps is different. And if you want to talk about real fights, some of the best doormen I know are boxers - and they beat up 'black belts' all day long - no bells or silly gloves. >>>PS<<< ------------------------------------------------------------------------Self-defense is only an illusion, a dark cloak beneath which lurks a razor-sharp dagger waiting to be plunged into the first unwary victim. Sifu Wong.
Shorin Ryuu Posted July 19, 2003 Posted July 19, 2003 I'd have to say that it'd depend on the competitors, but I might go with the martial artists. I used to be a boxer, but found it much too limited. Yes, we did learn how to take hits and we had extremely great conditioning, but boxing is still a sport. Size isn't the biggest thing either. I've fought people 30 pounds lighter than me and 30 pounds heavier than me and the hardest hitter was someone who boxed at 119 lbs. Bruce Lee was only 135 lbs. soaking wet. Yeah, I'm sure if I went into the ring again, I can't make any guarantees whether or not I'd win against another boxer, but a real fight isn't just about taking hits and giving them, that is only a basic layer of fighting. Plus, in a good karate system, a karateka should know how to grapple and take things to the ground. Sadly, most people do not realize this... All in all, my money is with the masters. Take the example of Motobu Choki. Some people may have heard this one, but when he was 52 years old, he took on a Russian boxer and knocked him out cold with his bare hands. 52 years old...Might I add, this was during a boxing vs. judo tournament in Kyoto, and the boxers were creaming the judo guys left and right... That being said, I still respect boxers and do not dismiss them out of hand (a lot of my friends are boxers). I'm just saying there is more to a fight than what boxers learn, and while they are no doubt powerful fighters, I'm going to stick with the martial arts masters. Martial Arts Blog:http://bujutsublogger.blogspot.com/
sansoouser Posted July 19, 2003 Author Posted July 19, 2003 ya prod...lol drunk black belts The amateur shoots his hands out ferociously, but lacks any true power. A master is not so flamboyant, but his touch is as heavy as a mountain.
Recommended Posts