Ises Posted July 9, 2003 Share Posted July 9, 2003 I'm 33 and I was recently diagnosed with Stage N (whatever that is) Bone on Bone Osteoarthritis in my left knee. I was pretty devastated when I heard this since I have been involved in getting fit and healthy for the last two years. I joined karate a year ago in the hopes of improving my health, fitness and flexiblity (not to mention self confidence!). With the diagnosis, I was told I'm basically going to have to live the rest of my life avoiding getting knee replacement surgery since I'm so young and that there was nothing that could be done except to help the pain with drugs. Now that's the history but I've decided to fight this and continue with my training since I've discovered a love for karate that I will not give up on. My question, finally is this, although I've only been involved in karate for less than a year, I'm finding my kicks are very stiff and I don't seem to be able to get the height that I'd like to. I am sure that the arthritis is part of it but I strongly feel that I should be able to improve this. Has anyone else had this sort of experience with arthritis? If so, what do you do? There are days when I have a ton of power in my kicks but not the height. It's obvious some days will be worse than others but I'd really like to learn as much of what I can apply to my legs to further improve things. I want that height and continued flexibity. I've got a great number of years of my life to enjoy doing karate and I want to be able to do the best I can. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted July 9, 2003 Share Posted July 9, 2003 I am sympathetic to your condition, however, in my opinion you should listen to your doctor. Karate is hard on the knees. Anyone who gives you advice to continue training in lieu of your doctor's recommendation doesn't have your best interests in mind. I have known people with similar situations who continued to train in spite of their physician's advice. The inevitable happened and most of them cannot do karate, and some even have difficulty doing every day things that we take for granted. It isn't worth it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ises Posted July 9, 2003 Author Share Posted July 9, 2003 Hi, sorry. The one thing I did forget to mention was that he didn't tell me to stop doing karate. He suggested I be very careful with kicks, avoid running and jumping. I more or less told him that there was no way I was going to find myself in one of those scooter things in ten years and that I was not going sit back and let life pass me by without being able to enjoy it. So basically I'm going to continue biking, swimming, weighlifting and karate. I'll never run, play squash or tennis but thats okay. I can deal with that. I just want to build these kicks up. Thanks though! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fenris-wolf Posted July 9, 2003 Share Posted July 9, 2003 Well, I assume you've explored all the options in terms of seeing a specialist? Maybe you could try another style of karate? I don't know much about the various styles, but there may be that there is a discipline which focusses a little less on high kicks. It isn't the preferred option, but I guess it depends how much of a problem the kicks are. In what way does the arthritis effect your kicks? You could obviously try strengthening and stretching all the muscles involved, provided you're careful and are willing to spend a lot of time and effort. Sorry, I don't really understand enough to help you properly and I'd really need more details anyway. Still, good luck! Let Us Turn The Jump Rope In Accord With Socialist Principles! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
delta1 Posted July 10, 2003 Share Posted July 10, 2003 ... Maybe you could try another style of karate? I don't know much about the various styles, but there may be that there is a discipline which focusses a little less on high kicks. It isn't the preferred option, but I guess it depends how much of a problem the kicks are. In what way does the arthritis effect your kicks? You could obviously try strengthening and stretching all the muscles involved, F-w, you may not be that experienced, but that is excellent advice you are giving. Ises, is the arthritus due to an old injury? If so, you might be able to avoid further injury by altering your style to not stress that knee. Do your kicks with the right only. Talk with a good physical therapist to set up an exercise routine to strengthen your knees. You should also start a regimin of dietary suppliments to enhance joint health. Glucosimine and chondroiten sulfates and MSM, and vitamin C with the MSM. There are also several herbs to help joint health and reduce inflamation. Also look at modifying your diet. You should talk with a knowlegable Naturepath about this. Possibly changing arts is a good idea. I'd look for one that incorporates softer moves, such as any of the Kenpo styles or internal styles. Also try to find a knowlegable instructor who is willing to work with you. And lay off the high kicks. Even kicking with the right may stress the knee of the supporting leg. Keeping active is important to maintaining joint health, but only if you are careful. I have a similar problem. It isn't the end of your journey, but it does make the journey a little more interesting. Good luck. Freedom isn't free! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ises Posted July 10, 2003 Author Share Posted July 10, 2003 I actually get this horrible feeling in the pit of my stomache when anyone mentions changing or leaving my current karate style. I honestly think I'll be okay but I do have to improvise a few things. My sensei is wonderful that way but I do get frustrated when I have to do things differently from the rest of the class. It's actually not from an old injury but, I'm embarrassed to say, it's wear and tear from so many years of not taking care of my health and letting my weight take over. It's frightening to think of the damage I have done to myself without ever considering what future consequences I'd have to deal with. I'm hoping that changing my lifestyle two years ago will help. It's a bit of a wall to overcome but I think I will. I appreciate the advice on the supplements, diet and naturopathic doctors. I do have a friend that has offered me help for a smaller fee than others would charge. I just have to wait until my income can handle it. I think what I'd like to know is what sort of stretches one can do. I find I can be really flexible somedays and other days its just terrible. For example tonight, I decided to stand with a chair and attempt to hold my leg up on my punching bag. I also took a rope and bound my leg to further extend it both for a hamstring stretch and quad stretch. Over the years I've really been gentle with my quads and now I can't quite bring my leg beyond a 90 degree angle. So I've been doing stretches for it as well since although I have no cartilige in my left knee, I'm hoping to compensate for that with muscluar development. I'd really love to hear what sort of other things you do even normally to increase your height and flexibility of kicks. I'm quite determined to continue with this in the hopes that my determination will pay off. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
delta1 Posted July 10, 2003 Share Posted July 10, 2003 I know the choices are tough. But ballance them against having to give it all up in a few years. And if you think keeping weight under control is a problem now, wait until you can't get around or exercise much! I'd recomend talking with your doctor about specifics, but generally just doing the normal stretches works well for me. But don't overdo it, and I'd lay off adding any kind of mechanical force to your stretches (like ropes). I let pain be my guide, and if it feels like I maybe doing dammage I stop. For this reason I do not take any pain medications. Besides, most pain relievers are NSAIDS, which are not good for arthritus. Freedom isn't free! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SaiFightsMS Posted July 10, 2003 Share Posted July 10, 2003 You didn't mention specifically what your style is. I believe there are modifications that you can make to allow continued training. I think the two biggest are in the areas of learning how far to push stances and kicking drills. Kicking into air will probably not be your best choice of practicing kicks. Light impact would be my choice for working on technique. And as with anyone with challanges you are allready finding that there are some days that are better than others. You have a challange to learn how to identify what you are capable of doing on the differing days of your own ablility without damageing yourself. I think it can be done. Be prepared to advance in rank slower than your classmates. And maybe hit a technique on occasion that is just not practical for you to try to perfect. With what you are saying your knee will deteriorate wether you pursue a physical activity or not. Why not have the satisfaction of trying? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted July 10, 2003 Share Posted July 10, 2003 Yes, what style is it that you practice ??? I practice Matsumura Seito Shorin Ryu and it is relatively easy on the knees. Stances are high, even more so than most styles of shorin. Kicks are low, and are mostly secondary techniques. I don't mean to boast, but I have witnessed it's effectiveness, and it is a very rich style. We get many converts from other styles who don't even look back once they begin Matsumura seito. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ises Posted July 10, 2003 Author Share Posted July 10, 2003 We study Chito-Ryu Karate. Since I'm relatively new to all this I'm really not sure what to compare it to. We also study Jiu Jitsu in the Kawaishi style. I really have to watch that end of it as well when we do the throws, rolls, etc. I find my knee twists easily and it can put me out for a few weeks. I'm really not sure what to compare this style to, whether is milder, rougher, etc. Maybe someone can explain this to me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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