Incompatitbility of Budo and Christianity?

[shotokanwarrior]

many types of buddhism as well as many many types of christians. japanese monks differ from chineese monks from india monks.

[shotokanwarrior]

Zen is the central principal of many forms of budo, mind,body ,spirit. zen should be achieved wile doing forms or kata. do more search on buddhism and budo they go hand in hand.

[JerryLove]

And an explosion is the central principle in an internal combustion engine; but they are not the same thing either.

 

Zen is one group of Buddist beliefs (like "reformist" is one group of Christian beliefs). Not all buddists are Zen (it appears to have first formed when Daoists and pure Buddists intermingled.

 

Budo (a word which is entirely Japanese, so let's look to Japan) is the name of a grouping of schools (Budo schools) which began in the 15th-16th century in Japan. How old the elements of Budo are is irrellevent... until they were put together.

[shotokanwarrior]

It is rellevent because it is more than 400 years old as stated before. Daruma combined the aspects of zen and budo, he also learned a type of fighting art in india being the son of a war loard. yes budo is a japanese word and so is karate ( also translated china hand, as stated by funakoshi ) does not zen mean meditate? I was also clear that zen is not in all buddhism but most. my point is that buddhism and budo martial way is older than christianity.

[JerryLove]

Buddism is about 500 years older than Christianity. Whatever you would like to say Daruma did, it was not create the system of Japanese protocol and schooling known as "Budo". And I challenge you o statistically support your claim that most Buddists are Zen Buddists.

 

I *believe* "zen" comes under Lamaism, which contains only 20 million adherents (as opposed to Theravada which has 124M, and Mahayna which has 185M), but feel free to point to specific information if you have any.

my point is that buddhism and budo martial way is older than christianity.

 

And my point is that we do not have a consistant definition of "Budo". If we are strict (and look at the foundation of the activity "budo"), then we find it's 400 years old. If we are general (and consider any fighting philosophy to count), then we can probably assume it's at least as old as Homo Sapiens (2,000,000 years).

[shotokanwarrior]

The japanese word "DO" means "way", meaning "road to travel by", BUT it can also be interpreted as "abstract spiritual way of life", the concept of "DO" ( TAO IN CHINESE) originates from zenbuddhism where the meaning is "the way to reach enlightment".

 

"DO" in reflection to BUDO can be translated to " the way to develop the human mind through training of a martial art".

[JerryLove]

Dao (Tao) in Chinese exists as a word long Buddism came along... and you are again simply ignoring the issue.

 

If you wish to translate "budo" and ask "how long has the warrior path been in existance", then my answer is "millions of years".

 

If you wish to ask how long the Japanese philosophy/system named "Budo" has been in existance, then my answer is "about 500 years".

 

You may agree with these answeres, disagree with these answers (in which case, please specify your disagreement and support) or argue that neither definition of "budo" is the one you believe is appropriate (in which case, again, support).

 

As a Daoist (Taoist), I assure you that the concept of the Dao does not originate in Zen Buddism.

[shotokanwarrior]

I agree that the warrior path has been around millions of years and that the japanese budo mainly 500 . Taoism dates back like 4000 years and the sage lau tsu is credited for founding it because of his written work, he also left china some 2500 years ago to tibet. zenbuddhism did not originate tao but it all came from the same origins china or if you like go farther back to india.

 

What is the sound of one hand clapping?

[shotokanwarrior]

You seem to know a lot about this topic , I have not yet reaserched furhter into these spiritual traditions but can you tell me the basics of taoism compared to zen?

[Warp Spider]

Well, this debate has been going on for quite a while, so I thought I'd add my opinion: I don't think that martial arts are related in any way to religeon, though I recognize that historically the two may have gone hand in hand. That doesn't necessarily mean they are related though. You can have one without the other as far as I am concerned, even if historically that has not tended to be the case.