Wado Guy Posted June 4, 2003 Share Posted June 4, 2003 Cool. Small world Sensei Patterson passed away recently. Ironically, it was the same evening of the Shodan exam he officiated over. He died peacefully and without pain during a heart surgery. My best memory of him (other than the seminar of his that i attented) was at a local open tournament. I introduced myself to him, we chatted briefly about my school and my sensei, then he struck up a concersation about the hot dogs they were serving in the concession stand!!! He liked those hot dogs! I know, silly story. But, it struck me as funny, a man that I really respect...even fear to an extent...and we end up talking about hot dogs. heheh...ok...i'll stop babbling. *wa no michi* Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mArTiAl_GiRl Posted June 4, 2003 Share Posted June 4, 2003 MMmmmhh.... well, I've used Karate for self-defence for many times and it helps. So, I think it's pretty god for self-defence, like SaiFights said, it depends on how you train. Kill is love Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zdoshi Posted June 4, 2003 Share Posted June 4, 2003 How an interesting question. Overall i would have to say yes karate is effective in a fight. I would also have to say no its not. See it depends on how you train. Do you train for sport, fittness, and interesting hobby, for perfection of character, or for combat. As mentioned in an earlyer reply karate gained acceptance in part because it comformed to the concepts of budo - martial way. but there is no reason you can not train in karate as a bujutsu - martial skill. The techniques in karate-do and karate-jutsu are the same (maybe karate-jutsu has a few extra) but the way the training is done for those techniques is very different. On another note a range on 1 metre is very static, when we train we train for range varying from almost 2 metres to grappling range(includeing some ground fighting). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guitar_lover Posted June 4, 2003 Share Posted June 4, 2003 Well i think Karate can be affective style, As in my Style they teach both self defence situations and competertive. I meen ive been taught how to counter haymakers as they are the most common attack in england anyway. From idouts and thugs, but yeah stuff like that. I meen i learnt alot of attacks for when people get right close and nasty. But its all good fun. peace PEACE AND LOVE."When the power of love overcomes the love of power the world will know peace" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikS Posted June 4, 2003 Share Posted June 4, 2003 Um, you say that karate is meant for fighting at distance? This is not entirely true. There are many many techniques to deal with close in attackers. 1 of them is the close punch. I know many variations. There are also takedowns and some pretty brutal joint locks to be learned if you get a good teacher. Oh by the way i was forced to fight someone yesterday. I beat his butt with my karate training. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wado Guy Posted June 4, 2003 Share Posted June 4, 2003 Zdoshi makes an excellent point. How one trains can determine if karate is effective. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Motion Posted June 9, 2003 Share Posted June 9, 2003 Another point is the distance to the opponent, in Karate there'S always a distance about one meter, but what if your opponent comes so close to you, that you can't really use techniques or block his attacks because Karate koncentrates more on fighting distant. This is where grappling techniques would come in. We've heard from the Gracies that 95% of real fights will go to the ground. But I'd just say that 95% of real fights will go into grappling range either standing or to the ground. Fighting distance is also something I noticed when I took TKD. We alwaysed kept our distance naturally when sparring. You see the same in boxing. When a clinch(grappling range) happens in boxing the referee will seperate the fighters. There will be no referee to seperate you from an attacker in a real fight. So it will be a good idea to learn some grappling to back you up for these situations. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kirves Posted June 9, 2003 Share Posted June 9, 2003 That 95% came from police statistics - fights involving police officers. They are trained to take the criminal to the ground for handcuffing and control. I don't believe 95% of all street fights go to the ground. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Motion Posted June 9, 2003 Share Posted June 9, 2003 95% of streetfights go into grappling range is what the Gracies are actually saying. This doesn't have to neccessarily mean to the ground. It's natural for real fights to go into clinches. Again you see this in boxing,but also like I said, the referees will seperate the boxers when a clinch happens. It'll be interesting to see what would happen if the referee didn't seperate boxers after a clinch? No one is going to seperate you from an attacker in a real fight,so it will be good to know grappling techniques such as throws and takedowns,and how to handle things after the takedown. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kirves Posted June 9, 2003 Share Posted June 9, 2003 Clinch often happens in boxing because of the rules too. Though I agree with you to some degree. But on the street, usually neither of the fighters want to get down. A mugger or robber knows not to get down as it is dangerous. You as a victim don't want to go there either. In this scenario it only happens if you both trip and fall, or if one of you falls and drags the other one with him. Now, I don't count the kinds of macho fights where both are actually willing participants, they are different. I have seen the kind of fights where two drunken guys start arguing over some stupid issue and then they go at it, slugging it out, then clinching and dragging it to the ground. Usually their pals are cheering around in a circle and there is no intent to seriously harm or kill the opponent, just show him who's the tough one (one bloody nose and that's usually it). Those fights often become a wrestling match, but aren't the kind of fights I'm training self defence for. There's one more fight type that often goes to the ground on the street, and that's rape. The Gracie family has experiences on two kinds of fights: vale tudo tournaments (where they go to ground because they know it is safe) and the tough guy street fights (where they again know it is relatively safe). I have read some stories about how the Gracies have used their skills on the streets and all the stories have involved the kind of argument macho sh it that the crowd was in a circle around them cheering the fighters to slug it out and the fighters were wrestling one-to-one in the middle. They weren't attacked with murderous intent and didn't kill or cripple anyone themselves. That is not the same thing as the normal street situation where you are robbed after you drew cash from the bankomat. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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