Mixed Martial Arts, Brazilian Ju Jitsu, and Reality

[Treebranch]

JohnnyS said, " would think that someone who had trained in only one style all their life would be more predicatable. E.g. You'd know that a wing-chun guy would have bad takedown defense, or a wrestler bad punches."

 

Yeah if the announcers at a competition told you his style and you knew his style, I agree with you. If you have a confrontation on the street with Wing-Chun guy by the time you found out it be too late. I agree with WC Strayder some MMA practitioner think they have the recipe to success, but your not Mark Kerr , Ruas, or Belfort. Don't look at their results and assume just because you are following in their footstep your going to even be one tenth as effective. MMA is it's own style now, it's a sport and the recipe to win this Sport is MMA. MMA have proven themselves in the ring and they came from the ring. Historically Combat Martial Arts have proven themselves in the Battlefield and the streets, MMA hasn't. So when you go around claiming that MMA is more effective on the street than a Combat Martial Art, where's your proof? All you have to point to is UFC, and I'm very sorry to inform you, that it is not the street.

[MSPav]

I had been in a lot of fights, but I'll never been taken or have taken someone myself to the ground and kept on fighting there.

 

None of your fights went to ground? Ever? Then either you have won all your fights or you've never been up against someone who really wanted to hurt you.

[1ONEfighting]

Yeah, you'll never run into a grappler on the street. Do you realize how many high school and college wrestlers are out there? Half my fights in the street have been against wrestlers. None were wing chun practitioners, however.

 

Historically MMA is not street proven? Seventy years of Gracie challenges? Muay Thai and wrestling unproven?

 

I NEVER said wing chun or any other art was ineffective, I am merely advocating crosstraining and pressure testing in order to further your martial development.

[JohnnyS]

Treebranch wrote: "Historically Combat Martial Arts have proven themselves in the Battlefield and the streets, MMA hasn't. "

 

Where's your proof of the effectiveness of Combat Martial Arts ?

 

Oh, you mean anecdotes and legends ?

 

1ONEfighting is correct. MMA has a long tradition in Brazil of street effectiveness.

[WC-Strayder]

No, I'll never taken a fight to the ground. And that was before I even trained in any MA (except boxing), and maybe so to, not a lot of boxers do there things on the ground!. The man who said that the Grasies didn't let him in was Joe Sayah, a Wing Chun man, livin in LA. (And yes, I think I know what you're gonna say now, but it has nothing to do with my point that I'm a wing Chun guy too! This is the truth, believe me. I had said this no matter what he where from, so don't even start with it please.

 

And to you, JohnnyS, you know better than :

 

" Where's your proof of the effectiveness of Combat Martial Arts ?

 

Oh, you mean anecdotes and legends ? "

 

Or is this all you can come up with?. You know as well as me that at least Wing Chun have a fighting history, and still has back in Hong Kong, so don't pull this on everybody practicing something else, please!.

 

Or maybe you mean we should just stop what we do and start with MMA or BJJ or whatever, coz the so called "traditional" has nothing to offer?. Well, do ya??

[JohnnyS]

WC-Strayder,

 

I'm not suggesting you stop training in WC and start doing BJJ. I couldn't care less. As far as what traditional arts offer I think you'll find that I've posted about how effective an art I though Okinawan Goju-Ryu was for the street.

 

With regard to the Joe Sayah, I've read his biography on the internet where he claims to have fought in Cage events but can't find any other details. I still really doubt that he tried to enter and was knocked back because the Gracies thought he'd be too dangerous to them. Besides, the Gracies had nothing to do with managing after UFC 4 I believe. So it wouldn't have been their call. I have heard that the UFC get a lot of people offering to enter but refuse them - not because they believe they are too dangerous but because they don't believe these people could back it up in the ring.

 

If this guy really wants to fight a Gracie, go to their Torrance Academy with a video camera and challenge them.

 

I don't know why you're being so defensive. No-one here is saying that WC is not good for the street.

[WC-Strayder]

I'm not being defensive, I'm just tired of this "my style is sooo mush better" here all the time. Maybe you don't see this yourself, but try to look at what you and some of the other writes here at this forum and you see what I mean. As soon as anyone says they have a time of there life with something traditional or other stuff that you don't approve you are there. Wham, not only are you stating that what you are doing are so mush better, but you are stepping on every other style as well!. Just look back and see it for yourself!. If you guys had been so long in MA as some of you claim you would know that an art/style can't fight at all, it's the man who learns it thats fight!.

 

I'm not gonna go to their Torrance Academy with a video camera and challenge them, I ain't that dumb, thank you very mush!. And if you see me as defensive I poligise for that, that was not my intension. My intension was what I stated above and I agree with the guy who said you only do MA if you find it fun, coz it's the true.

 

Soo aussie guys, are we still "friends"?.

 

No hard feelings?.

 

I had acctually learned a lot by discussing this with you (besides to look out for those pesky BJJ guys )

 

I spoke to my SiFu to day about you guys and asked him what to do if I ever met a wrestler and he said that it was smart to take it a little easy , so I guess you're right about it after all. He even promiced that he would talk to his sifu to get him implement more ground work, coz we have some ground work, but maybe need some more, just to be a little safer. But then again, I'm not gonna advertize this if I ever had a fight with a wrestler, that will be mine little surprize for him

 

See ya!.

[1ONEfighting]

Can I ask where that groundwork comes from?

[1ONEfighting]

And I checked out Joe Sayah's web site, and checked it against Sherdog's fight finder. They have no record of any Joe Sayah ever fighting in an organized MMA/NHB event.

 

All talk, zero walk.

[JohnnyS]

WC-Strayder,

 

I've never talked trash about the other arts. I've said they have flaws (as all arts do)., but I also get sick of people saying "BJJ is no good because you don't want to be on the ground in the street" or "BJJ doesn't work against multiple opponents".

 

Just an aside, Rick Spain, a William Cheung student, and former world full-contact kung-fu champion, now trains BJJ under my instructor John Will. Rick has John come and do seminars at his school, and also does privates every week with one of my long-term training partners, Anthony Lange.

 

Rick says BJJ goes great with Wing Chun because of the sensitivity training you learn in WC helps in BJJ. Rick also intends on going to Brazil later this year for training and now has his WC class do BJJ twice a week. Rick has shown that smart people can see how BJJ can compliment their stand-up style and embrace it rather than dismiss it. I have nothing but the highest respect for Rick as a martial artist and as a person.