Anti Karateka*interesting*

[KaratekaAikidoist]

I got into a HUGE arguement with my friends the other day. I had a MA book and one of them read something on ki. I explained it the best i could but of course they were like " thats bull****" and that ki is just focused adrenaline. then later, one of them stated that karate only is for medative purposes and could not help anyone in a fight. He also stated that everyone knows every technique from every style but doesn't use them until they get in a life or death fight. I don't really know but Im sure a guy off the street couldn't do a reverse cresent kick or a kata application. It made me mad because i beleive in ki and those comments made me feel like everyone is a black belt in every style(which means i wasted four years in Goju Ryu).Then everyone acted like i was crazy because i was pissed at them. any comments?

[hobbitbob]

Read the thread "Got KI?" on e-budo.com.

[CheekyMusician]

Your friend has a bit of a point.

 

My dad has a friend who was a 3rd dan in Shotokan, a 3rd dan in Judo and who dabbled in many other arts. He said that in his life he'd been in many fights and had never used his martial arts in any of them. He told my dad that possibly martial arts skills could be used in a self defense situation one-on-one (especially with females as there would be the surprize element if they were attacked and the attacker wouldn't expect them to fight back), but he said in a bar brawl situation he found his martial arts experience pretty useless.

 

I'm not saying that that is correct, but I am saying that if a dedicated martial artist believed that his martial arts weren't much use in many street situations, then it is understandable that someone untrained in the martial arts might think the same way.

 

As for the 'ki' thing, I personally believe that 'ki' is "just" focus. Except extreme focus. Focus of everything. I believe it is pure concentration of the mind; focus of the muscles (contraction and relaxing them at the exact right moments etc.) Even if I explain it in a more physiological sense thank you might, it doesn't make it less amazing. To obtain the level of focus I'm talking about it would take years of constant training and practice and few people would ever truly master it. So in that sense it makes it a more amazing concept than some magical energy stream that runs through everyone and everything in the world.

[monkeygirl]

Check out this thread:

 

http://www.karateforums.com/viewtopic.php?t=5430

 

Your case seems to be more serious, but the basic theories still apply. When people don't understand something, they will often attack it rather than understand it. That's just the kind of people they are: closed-minded.

 

The important thing to remember is that they (your anti-karateka friends) really don't know what they're talking about. People like them can make us think and truly reconsider the things we believe in and think we understand. You sound like you love your style, so don't let these people take that away from you. Instead, let them remind you of why you're training, and why your style is incredible and perfect for you (but only if it is).

 

That may have sounded kinda corny, but after hearing all of that negative stuff, I figured you could use some positive

Edited April 21, 2003 by monkeygirl

[KaratekaAikidoist]

I just got me so mad. All of you, especially monkeygirl had well written answers. I hate it when people find it easier to discredit something than try to understand it.

[hobbitbob]

Have you tried bringing them to watch class? When I was an undergrad in the mid 1980s I had friends in my Frat who expressed similar opinions, so I brought them to watch class. The poor suckers are still practicing 20 yrs. later. Somewhere the god of Orthopaedic Surgery is smiling on my offererings!

[KaratekaAikidoist]

Thats another thing that got me. One of the anti karateka was previously thinking of joining my dojo. His parents wouldn't let him even go watch. They both are typical teenagers so I'm sure they could care less. (not to say I'm not a teen but....) His dad was a 5 degree in kung fu i think so you'd expect him to at least not diss anything MA related. Do you know of anyway to persuade them?

[CheekyMusician]

Thats another thing that got me. One of the anti karateka was previously thinking of joining my dojo. His parents wouldn't let him even go watch. They both are typical teenagers so I'm sure they could care less. (not to say I'm not a teen but....) His dad was a 5 degree in kung fu i think so you'd expect him to at least not diss anything MA related. Do you know of anyway to persuade them?

 

You might never convince them. Teenagers tend to be 'smart asses' (me included ). They think they know everything and don't want to appear fools in front of others. Possibly that friend who read your karate book was secretly impressed, but was more concerned with his image than what he read.

 

It doesn't matter what your friends think. You might win them round one day, you might not, but the important thing is that you don't let their views corrupt yours. Keep practicing karate regardless of them.

[Beer-monster]

Real street martial arts does not look like martial arts. If when grabbed I twist, hit their neck, grab their hair, elbow them in face then yank them to the ground by the roots of their hair, I probably just look like a violent b*st*rd. However I have just used the combat bunkai of the opening movements to Naihanchi kata. . In comedy its not the words but the delivery that make the joke. Same for us. It is not the technuiques that make martial arts effective, its the way we do them.

 

Any idiot can throw a punch, but Karate training makes our punches more direct, faster, more powerful and more accurate. Your dads friend who said he never used martial arts in brawl probably did not know he was using them because he did not use high kicks or flashy throws. But by punching someone he was probably doing it the way he was taught and was thus using martial arts.

[CheekyMusician]

Any idiot can throw a punch, but Karate training makes our punches more direct, faster, more powerful and more accurate. Your dads friend who said he never used martial arts in brawl probably did not know he was using them because he did not use high kicks or flashy throws. But by punching someone he was probably doing it the way he was taught and was thus using martial arts.

 

I agree that karate would improve your punches, and my dad's friend understands that karate will have improved his punches, but he has always said that people who he has encountered with no martial arts training who fight frequently in street fights, or people who have had boxing training (which I don't consider a martial art) have the advantage over him and his training.

 

I'm not knocking martial arts training, and it of course is better than no experience at all, but in a 'no-rules' scenario it can fail you. Obviously it is going to change from person to person. After all, different dojos train at different levels of intensity and different people will encounter different types of threat in their life eg. this friend of my dad's had only ever been involved in bar brawls and not one-on-one confrontations outside the dojo.

 

I'm not denying the effectiveness of martial arts training, all I'm saying is that if one person with extensive martial arts training feels that it is not particularly effective for him, then it is understandable that someone who has never trained in the martial arts before may hold the same view.