Whats the difference between BJJ and JJ

[metamorph]

not the exact same thing, Helio Gracie made many changes because of his small size. He adapted it to himself using even more science, that is what is taught today. judo is still good to learn for takedowns

[WC-Strayder]

If you look closer you will notice that the B in front of BJJ is the biggest diffrence from JJ....... No, I really dont know, to be honest...

[Padawon]

i like bjj better

[LOILOI44]

not the exact same thing, Helio Gracie made many changes because of his small size. He adapted it to himself using even more science, that is what is taught today. judo is still good to learn for takedowns

 

Can you explain how he did that? Traditional Jujutsu is very sceientific. It's all about anatomy and physics. Every single techinque I have seen in BJJ exists in TJJ. As far as Judo goes, there is a whole area of training which deals with nothing but ground fighting. It is called Ne-waza. Judo is not all about stand up throws. Check out something called Kosen Judo. It's all about fighting on the ground.

 

The true difference is that BJJ covers a small part of what TJJ covers.

[Raiden]

not the exact same thing, Helio Gracie made many changes because of his small size. He adapted it to himself using even more science, that is what is taught today. judo is still good to learn for takedowns

 

Can you explain how he did that? Traditional Jujutsu is very sceientific. It's all about anatomy and physics. Every single techinque I have seen in BJJ exists in TJJ. As far as Judo goes, there is a whole area of training which deals with nothing but ground fighting. It is called Ne-waza. Judo is not all about stand up throws. Check out something called Kosen Judo. It's all about fighting on the ground.

 

The true difference is that BJJ covers a small part of what TJJ covers.

 

Some of the techniques may look the same, but BJJ makes subtle changes to many of them. Some of the chokes in TJJ require strength, so by make a change to the technique, a weaker practitioner can apply the same choke with less strength by applying the new method developed by the Gracies. You are right, the majority of techniques in BJJ are present in traditional styles of Jiu-Jitsu , but the level of refinement of control and subtlety, especially related to fighting from the guard (on ones back using one’s legs to fend off, overturn, or submit and opponent) is unique to BJJ. There are things in TJJ not studied in BJJ because it is considered ineffective for "real life" (street fighting) situations.

 

Judo is its closest relative in the martial arts world.

[LOILOI44]

Raiden, I am sorry but I disagree with you. I don't know of a single TJJ choke that requires much strength when applied correctly. It was always my impression that TJJ was never about using strength. As far as the guard goes, it is by no means unique to BJJ. It's been in TJJ for hundreds of years. I am just curious what is in TJJ that is not effective for "real life"? As far as Judo goes, every Judo technique is a TJJ technique. With the exception of maybe Kata Garuma (that is a throw similar to what called a Fireman's Carry in wrestling.) Jigoro Kano was a practitioner of Tenshin-Shinyo-Ryu and Kito Ryu Jujutsu.

 

This is by no means any kind of an attack on BJJ. I just think when it comes to TJJ, there are very many misconceptions. You might not have observed much ground work in any of the TJJ schools you have seen, but that doesn't mean it is not there.

[TJS]

Raiden, I am sorry but I disagree with you. I don't know of a single TJJ choke that requires much strength when applied correctly. It was always my impression that TJJ was never about using strength. As far as the guard goes, it is by no means unique to BJJ. It's been in TJJ for hundreds of years. I am just curious what is in TJJ that is not effective for "real life"? As far as Judo goes, every Judo technique is a TJJ technique. With the exception of maybe Kata Garuma (that is a throw similar to what called a Fireman's Carry in wrestling.) Jigoro Kano was a practitioner of Tenshin-Shinyo-Ryu and Kito Ryu Jujutsu.

 

This is by no means any kind of an attack on BJJ. I just think when it comes to TJJ, there are very many misconceptions. You might not have observed much ground work in any of the TJJ schools you have seen, but that doesn't mean it is not there.

 

just out of curiosity why do you think TJJ hasant had 1% of the succes BJJ has in NHB fighting?

[LOILOI44]

just out of curiosity why do you think TJJ hasant had 1% of the succes BJJ has in NHB fighting?

 

Do you think I am saying anything negative about BJJ? Am I saying that TJJ is better than BJJ? I don't think I said anything like that.

 

As far as the NHB fighting thing...Anybody I know who trains in TJJ does not compete in NHB events. I know a few who compete in Judo, who have had a good amount of success. Do you know of any TJJ practitioners who compete in NHB events? I personally have a job and can't devote all my time to training for NHB events. I don't have enough money to train full time and either does anybody I know. Is success in a controlled NHB event the measure of a martial art?

 

I've heard statements like TJJ chokes require strength. That statement is dead wrong. Can somebody tell me a TJJ choke that requires strength to execute? I just think there are many misconceptions about TJJ. I've heard that BJJ is more scientific than TJJ. How is it more scientific? Can you tell me techniques that are in BJJ that TJJ does not have? If you can, please show me an illustration of the technique.

 

The title of this thread is what's difference between BJJ an JJ, not which martial art is better. That argument can never be won. A martial art which is best for me, might not be best for you!

[Sens55]

A martial art which is best for me, might not be best for you!

 

I agree. Everyone should remember that martial arts, be it TJJ, BJJ, TKD or whatever, is a personal journey. And NHB or MMA events are only one way in which some individuals choose to gauge their success. Would either TJJ or BJJ be less effective if they taught a technique that didn't lead to a NHB victory but did allow a victim to gain an upper hand on an attacker and escape physical harm? Which is the true measure of success? Maybe both, maybe neither. It depends on the individual. My belief is that the techniques needed to subdue a trained opponent in a NHB match are not necessarily the ones that would be used to defend oneself if attacked on the street

[pmh1nic]

Interesting discussion. I want to make two points that may not be directly related to the initial question but address some things mentioned in the tread.

 

Safety in the dojo is paramount. Yes, I understand the need to try to make training realistic. I also understand that my boss could care less how I broke my collar bone or fractured an arm or leg in my realistic BJJ or TJJ training. He expects me, and my family is depending on me, to be at my computer on Monday taking care of business. Any dojo where a badge of honor is won based on how many injuries happen each month needs to have a serious review of its training practices.

 

The vast majority of people training in the martial arts are not training to entire NHB competitions. The type of realistic training involved in preparing for a NHB event may require training at a more intense level that presents a high level of risk of injury. Police officers whose occupation pretty much guarantees they're going to face physical confrontations on a regular basis need to train at a higher level of realism.

 

For the average person the desire to increase the intensity of training needs to be balanced against the reality that the vast majority of people may never be involved in a physical confrontation where they will have to use their martial arts skills against another individual let alone another trained individual.

 

Don't get me wrong. I want to learn and teach practical effective techniques. I want and my students need to experience a level of realism during their training. None of our training guarantees success in every situation. The best we can do is increase the odds that we'll survive a confrontation. But the need for realistic training must be balanced with a concern for safety in the dojo and the reality that the vast majority of students do not face a high level of risk of having a serious physical confrontation.