Wing Chun punch would break knuckles?

[Treebranch]

JerryLove said "A whip is wielded with defferent mechanics than an epeee, which is handled differently than a claymore, which is not used with the same mechanics of a capoerist who uses different body mechanics than a WC practitioner."

 

I'm not talking about what your arms are doing, I'm talking about what your legs and hips and back are doing, and how they should move as one. You have to stay balanced, right? You should be grounded, right? As for Wing Chun I can't even comment, is Capoera even a Martial Art anymore looks more like a dance, I've never seen a Capoerist fight in competition, have you?

[JerryLove]

When working with an epee, but legs are loweres and I'm pressing off them, my back is generallt straight and angled toward my opponent for reach, I'm not particularly rooted as I'm not looking for power, but speed.

 

When working a whip, one's legs are generall upright. you are no longer pushing off your leg, but looking to maximize movement of your arm. Generally there is far less tension, your standing far taller, and your back is moving far more. Your arms are also more mobile (since you are now after some gross arm movements which are bad wih an epee).

 

When working a claymore, your body is tucked in, your legs are somewhere between the two extremes above. If your oponent is still at range, and if you are using a style similar to the one I trained, then your attack comes from a pivoting of the weapon in place. There is no onvolvement of the legs or back to any real degree.

 

I didn't know competition was the criteria to determine if an art was martial... I suppose you could replace capoeria with TKD if you like. That most certainly competes.

[Treebranch]

Yeah, but it sounds like your talking about transitional movements with the epee and the Claymore. Balance is balance whether your feet are wider apart or not. As for the Whip, what happens if the whip is intercepted or grabbed and now you have use your body to regain it. If you are clashing against somenone you have to be balanced in a solid stance, or you are vulnerable to being taken off balance. Yes, you adjust your stance to accomodate the weapon you are using, but if you are reaching with almost any weapon, your spine can lean forward with the support of the leading leg, like in fencing. The key is the hips and spine should be as one and the adjust accordingly. That is what I mean when I say a strike of any kind comes from the whole body, if your doing it right. If you had to step forward and strike, you should end up balance and stable, at the end of your strike. You should drop your wait if you want your strikes to have power, and you can have speed and power you know.

[Radok]

your bottom two knuckles are floating knuckles, the top two are locked. so no matter how much hand conditioning, the bottom two will still break quicker.

[JerryLove]

Balance is balance whether your feet are wider apart or not.

You are back into the "so basic as to be useless" argument... and again you would be wrong because ground-grappling (such as is popular in arts like BJJ) does not rely on balance. So if balance is an example of body mechanic common to all fighting arts, it's not.

As for the Whip, what happens if the whip is intercepted or grabbed and now you have use your body to regain it.

 

That's just funny. I take it you've never tried that on a whip.

Yes, you adjust your stance to accomodate the weapon you are using, but if you are reaching with almost any weapon, your spine can lean forward with the support of the leading leg, like in fencing.

Unless you are reaching with your foot, then your body's going the other way... unless you are moving forward when reaching with your foot, in which case it's going the same way but simply off-balance forward, unless you are on the ground.

 

The mechanics change based on what you are ding and how you do it.

That is what I mean when I say a strike of any kind comes from the whole body, if your doing it right. If you had to step forward and strike, you should end up balance and stable, at the end of your strike.

If you drop to a bottom grip on a claymore and swing, and miss, you will not eb stable.

You should drop your wait if you want your strikes to have power, and you can have speed and power you know.

 

So you feel dropping your weight on an epee thrust, or a J-shot with a shortsword, or a whip, or even an uppercut will add power?

 

An interesting, if rather fanciful view.

[Treebranch]

Try it with anything, try punching a bag using this I guarantee you will feel the difference.

 

You are back into the "so basic as to be useless" argument... and again you would be wrong because ground-grappling (such as is popular in arts like BJJ) does not rely on balance. So if balance is an example of body mechanic common to all fighting arts, it's not.

 

So when someone is kicking a grappler to keep him away the grappler shouldn't be in a solid stance? Hmm, interesting.

 

That's just funny. I take it you've never tried that on a whip.

 

So if the whip wraps around my arm and I'm wearing armor, that can't happen right? The INVINCIBLE WHIP, yeah.

 

If you drop to a bottom grip on a claymore and swing, and miss, you will not eb stable.

 

May be that is not a good idea, if you swing something and if your doing it right, you should be able to keep control of it. If you miss you should be able to regain control quickly or your dead.

 

Give any weapon you want the Master Hatsumi from Japan and he will show you how to use it. He has studied Europe Martial Arts as well as Japanese ones. He demonstrates this all the time, and try what I am suggesting, it works. Its not flashy or fanciful but it is very effective.

[wingchundroo]

Whoa! Listen you guys this is getting a bit heavy...it seems that people are just arguing for the sake of it now. IMHO the whole body mechanics thing what some one said (i think treebranch) about body mechanics. I thought he/she meant that body mechanics are different for different arts and they are effective for their own reasons.

 

Just because a WC moves differently to a TKD practitioner does not mean that it cannot be effective. I suppose its all swings and roundabouts where there is positive in everything, but in different ways.

[bluez4u2]

wing chun punches appear to be weaker but once that centerline punch is trained well enough, it has a lot of hidden explosive power. we learn to use elbow energy as apposed to throwing our shoulders into it.

 

arm punches will never be as powerful as body punches.

 

look at a boxing punch and look at a WC punch..it's obvious whitch one is more powerful.

 

You all miss the point. Wing Tzun gets it's power from using the whole body instead of just the hips as in boxing. It is obvious to me who has the most power and that is Wing Tzun. What is stronger an arm punch with hips put into it or a flurry of punches with the entire body mass behind it? That is what the Wing Tzun adduction stance teaches you to do. Also since Wing Tzun is good at intercepting and controlling the centerline, the opponent would be falling into our punch so there is a tremendous collision there which makes the punches even more powerful.

 

http://www.awtk.us

[JerryLove]

I thought he/she meant that body mechanics are different for different arts and they are effective for their own reasons.

that would be my argument.

So when someone is kicking a grappler to keep him away the grappler shouldn't be in a solid stance? Hmm, interesting.

 

When a grappler is lunging for a leg-takedown, how stable is that? What stance at all is being done from a guard, or a mount? What if he isn't stable, just well attached?

So if the whip wraps around my arm and I'm wearing armor, that can't happen right? The INVINCIBLE WHIP, yeah.

That's not "catching", nor is it typically how a whip is used outside of movies.

May be that is not a good idea, if you swing something and if your doing it right, you should be able to keep control of it. If you miss you should be able to regain control quickly or your dead.

You have the choice.. swing light and retain conrtol, but weather you hit or not, you will not kill your opponent. Swing harder, and you can't expect to recoil a 20lb blade, but you can expect to kill your opponent if you hit.

 

But regardless of weather you think it's approriate or not, it's true.

Give any weapon you want the Master Hatsumi from Japan and he will show you how to use it. He has studied Europe Martial Arts as well as Japanese ones. He demonstrates this all the time, and try what I am suggesting, it works. Its not flashy or fanciful but it is very effective.

I've personally trained and used the weapons I listed. They are used differently. If you think you can use boxing mechanics with a claymore, I look forward to a copy of the tape.

[tommarker]

As for the Whip, what happens if the whip is intercepted or grabbed and now you have use your body to regain it. I

 

LMFAO