Problem, too traditional!

[Kaju_influenced]

Ok guys i just want ur opinions on the growing problem with the effectivness of traditional martial arts in our ever changing society, i have no problem with tradition its great however it lacks the effectivness in todays street conflicts, i practiced choylayfut and its a great style hoewever it has not at all help me in a combat situation because of the tradition( for something that was created years ago has gone effective to obselete) because it has stuck itself to traditional ways. So give me ur opinion on this particular subject without conflict pls

[Kensai]

Nothing has really changed. The body still has 2 arms and 2 legs. I doubt that CLF is obselete. If the techniques were effective 1000 years ago, they still will be today.

 

I would say its more about YOUR training. In most traditional styles there is not enough FULL CONTACT sparring. This is something that I agree with the MMA/NHB people on. Plus, the traditional styles do take longer to apply. So 3 years in CLF Vs 3 years in Boxing, Boxing is going to come out one top. However, IMHO, 10 years of each then I think CLF would be on a par with any modern style.

 

However, if you train in any traditional style and do lots of San Shou, Jiya Kumite and Randori then I think you'll be a better Martial artist for it.

 

It may just be the case that you could not use CLF. The problem does not always lie with the style, it lies with the practioner. The style you study now, may appel more to your body type and personality, than CLF.

[monkeygirl]

I agree: full-contact sparring is very important. You need to know how to hit someone, and how to be hit! You just can't get that from kata alone (and this is coming from someone who loves katas).

 

Most of the schools in my area don't make ANY CONTACT AT ALL in sparring. None whatsoever!! Not even black belts make contact! I'm sorry, but that's just pretending to be a martial artist. Nothing teaches you to guard your head like a good hook kick!

 

Unfortunately, however, from a business perspective, making contact in fighting can scare off customers, and they don't want that. So, they sacrifice practicality and effective training to get a little more dough in the door. This is the case for many a dojo in the area. In fact, my dojo is one of the only schools who makes contact in sparring. I think we get much more effective training, but that is just my very, very biased opinion. (couldn't you just feel my resentment towards the rival dojos? )

[Kyle-san]

I was reading somewhere about the effectiveness of traditional styles that keep their core teachings and are able to adapt to the changing atmosphere. However, it should be pointed out that not everything is about the fight. Most martial artists will never have to use their skills barring a position in security/law enforcement/etc.

 

Contact during sparring is completely necessary, yes, but how do you define full contact? Does this include no padding and strikes to the head, groin, and other vulnerable areas? If not I'd say that it isn't really "full" contact.

[TJS]

"If a certain stlye of combat does the same thing for the last 100 years without change, I say that they are doing it wrong. Everything changes and should get better. Cars get better, people get bettter, tennis players get better techniques, and soccer players get better techniques......most things in life are evolving all the time, do not stick with old tradition blindly. Dare to change when it feels right. Im not saying stop your respect of old tradition. No, DO respect tradition and keep doing it, but if you are training for fighting you must change and/or improve....dont stand still or the world may pass you by...."

 

-Bas Rutten-The Greatest MMA'ist in the world, 2nd deg black belt in TKD, 2nd Deg in Kyokushin, Muay Thai fighter, Submission wrestler.

 

things get better its a simple as that..people build and improve off of things...

 

To think that you can not improve on things is simply rediculous..something created a long time ago may not be "obsolete" but if you continually improve things there will be more effective routes.

 

this is true for everything yet people still try and say it does not

 

hold true for MA's.

Edited April 3, 2003 by TJS

[TJS]

nevermind

[karatekid1975]

I do TKD. We fight full contact. People might say that TKD isn't effective. BUT in my dojang. The art "adapts" and changes. We grapple (yes it's a shock, but yes it's true).

 

We do TKD and TSD forms and step sparring. BUT we fight full contact. We grapple full contact, and the self defense here is second to none in my area. The self defense drills are done realistically as possible.

 

Then again, it's not just the style. It's the instructor. How realistic is your self defense drills? Do you spar full contact? How often do you do self defense drills?

Edited August 5, 2003 by karatekid1975

[Kaju_influenced]

karatekid said

Then again, it's not just the style. It's the instructor. How realistic is your self defense drills? Do you spar full contact? How often do you do self defense drills?

 

Well i am currently practicing kajukenbo(ultimate style of dirty streetfighting) and our training goes beyond kicks and punches, we essentialy learn to deal with any combat situation. From a opponent to multiple opponents with weapons. As for realism thats a different story, our dicipline is based and respected on one sole thing violence and our great tolerance to it.let me put it this way with a couple of kajukenbo axioms for u-"Sweat more in the dojo and bleed less in the street"or"Training is never truly finished until there is blood on the floor" this is the reality of my dicipline or more the reality of life. Don't get me wrong i love tradition and have a great repect for it however like TJS said

"If a certain stlye of combat does the same thing for the last 100 years without change, I say that they are doing it wrong. Everything changes and should get better.

Which i agree with totaly! Traditional styles that bind themselfs to old ways are obselete in todays "COMBAT"situations not betterment of self so u see its a issue of combat effectiveness.

 

THNX for the replies everyone

 

KEEP TRAINING AND ALWAYS WORK HARD AT IT!

[Treebranch]

Everything changes and should get better. Cars get better, people get bettter, tennis players get better techniques, and soccer players get better techniques......most things in life are evolving all the time, do not stick with old tradition blindly.

 

I agree and disagree, soccer players haven't gotten better, Pele is the best and always will be. Also the equipment and materials and technology of sports equipment gets better, but not the player necessarily. I agree some traditional styles should not be followed blindly and neither should new ones. I think there are very few Martial Artists who have the luxury of being able to train as hard as the warriors of old that's how they made their living. Most MA's are not Warriors fighting hand to hand Combat on a regular basis or being the bodyguard of some Warlord, King, Prince, whatever. Yes there are things that evolve and improve, people are not one of them. Your comment implies that the MA's of new are better the Martial Artists of the past I really think there is no comparison, since the invention of the Gun, there is absolutely no reason to train so vigorously anymore. Martial Artist today do it for sport, or for person growth, or for other reason, but very very few train to fight in actual combat and probably have never faught in combat. Just a thought.

 

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[Treebranch]

Sorry, this posted twice. Edited April 4, 2003 by Treebranch