What's wrong with karate?

[AndrewGreen]

Again lack of distinction between street attacks and MMA sparring here plus lack of knowledge that the martial art of karate contains strikes, locks, holds, throws, gouges, grabs etc. etc.- all to weak points.

 

Then make the distinction for us.

 

Traditional karate does contain all of those things, but that doesn't mean its training methods are effective at making them functional.

 

Tae bo contains a lot of different strikes, think they'd do well in a kickboxing match because of this?

[Withers M.A.A.]

People think that JuiJitsu is better than karate because of the UFC. Well try rolling around on the street and see how that works for you. I'd rather kick someone in the stomach have them fold over and I'm on my way.

[TJS]

People think that JuiJitsu is better than karate because of the UFC. Well try rolling around on the street and see how that works for you. I'd rather kick someone in the stomach have them fold over and I'm on my way.

 

do you think if you fought a grappler or wrester in the street you would end up on top?

 

they have a much better chance of getting a mount than anyone.

 

I would much rather finish a fight with strikes aswell but thats not always an option..things happen

[fireka]

yes but thats just the reason we study karate, its pretty complete. sure diffrent styles of karate focus more on diffrent aspects but you would still learn to deal with the attacks of a wrestler or Jujitsu artist if you studied carefully. the reason that last post is correct however is because in karate we form a 'blocking menatlitity' were its sdrilled into our heads that blocking is probably the most important skill you can learn. in most cases thats true, but an overhead isnt going to help against a wrestler, youll soon find he uses that arm like a handle on a used wheel barel. so technically if you adjust your self to the appoininet you should do fine against all kinds of attackers in karate.

 

[Rich]

Okay Andrew

 

Range- most street attacks will start off close in or by surprise

 

NHB- ref starts and competitors approach each other

 

Environment- concrete underneath in street lots of times- changes dynamics completely- rewatch NHB and pretend mat is concrete and quite a few things don't work now, not without injury or worse.

 

- accomplices of attacker (cant afford to get into a one on one for too long -zanshin)

 

- obstacles and/or weather- slippery street, glass, people in way etc. etc.

 

- weapons

 

- ma-ai (can't explain this in short paragraph-sorry It is very different tho between two in most of the fight)

 

- lack of rules- groin/ eyes/ ears/ throat- nuff said

 

- emotional content- dont underestimate this- your life could be forfeit in street- changes dynamics majorly

 

- And so the list goes on....

 

"Traditional karate does contain all of those things, but that doesn't mean its training methods are effective at making them functional. "

 

Couldn't agree more- the original Karate (pre 'traditional') was born out of the need for fighting for one's life and this predecessor did have it all.

 

However, there are modern training methods that can complement and enhance older forms definitely. I am a firm believer in aliveness training (and am not anti NHB actually )

 

Sarcasm eh Andrew...?

 

fireka- yeh there is a lot of emphasis on blocking which actually doesnt work very well. If you are interested have a look at the kata bunkai to see that what is usually translated as a block can be a disengagement from a grab, a strangle, a strike etc. Its fascinating and will take your art up a level.

 

Regards

 

Rich

[Withers M.A.A.]

I think what NHB events did was open other styles up into thinking of grappling. I think it is important to train in some type of grappling even as a karate practicioner. But, not to the extent that you take away from your roots. Grappling plays a very important role in any combat situation but I also feel I wouldn't want to take a fight directly to the ground. I think you are more voulnerable on the ground. If you're at a bar and get into a fight where limited space is available it would be way too difficult to execute a mount etc.

[TJS]

you would still learn to deal with the attacks of a wrestler or Jujitsu artist if you studied carefully

 

if you think you can avoid getting slammed on your back then i can honestly say you have never fought an GOOD wrestler.

[Rich]

Withers-

 

grappling is part of your Karate 'roots'. However, when you say you wouldnt want to go to ground I agree, grappling standing up is the best alternative.

[fireka]

right, but when your talking karate for self deffense, its usally training in the worst case senario format. its intresting what you brought up rich, lack of rules eyes, ears, throat, groin ect. in a fight which your life was at stake one should logicaly target these. now im speaking in ignorance because ive never been in a street fight were i thought my life was in danger, but arnt these target areas fairly simple to make contact with? espicially the groin? then isnt karate training only lightly needed if your only motive for studing is self deffense as a civillian? why should grappling even become an issue, but if it does, karate covers both of these fields. however, id suggest anyone taking karate strictly for life deffense in a civillian enviroment take something a little more logical because rich is right, katas are often ignored in real senarios, for better or worse, and if thats all your intrested in, you (and forgive my lack of a better phrase) you dont need a black belt to kick someone in the balls.

 

Fireka

[mandy003]

karate is a number of things it cannot be defined as either kata of kumitie, different people have theirdifferent preferences. I have found that it is good for self defence as i have had to use it on various occasions. kata plays a vital role as the application of it can teach u alot in the art of self defence.