my problem with TKD and Self defense marketing.

[TJS]

First off thins is not meant to bash TKD in any way. I simply want to say I see alot of TKD schools offering "effective" self defense. IMO ANY school that is going to tell people they are learning real self defense should have the following aspects. These are the things i have a problem with as far as many TKD schools and self defense.

 

Ground fighting-Im not a proponet of taking a fight to the ground, and i dont belive all fights end up there. but it is a neccesity..most people are fish out of watter if they are on the ground.

 

Takedown defenses-if you are not going to learn Ground fighting you need to at least learn takedown defense (ex: sprawl , etc). It dosent take a champion wrestler to do a typical shoot and take your legs out.

 

Clinch fighiting-Alot of untrained people will simply try to close the distance and clinch in a fight. kicks are pretty useless and punches arent too effective...You need to learn how to fight form the clinch while contoling and avoiding takedowns.

 

Lack of Facial targeting/striking in sparring, 95% of people will proabably throw punches to the face in a fight as thier main weapon...It's proabably a good idea to get used to Defending them and throwing them. not to mention targeting the top/side of the head is a horrible idea with punches, and it scores a point in TKD sparring.

 

Lack of low kicks and empasis on high kick, i think this speaks for itself..Low kicks are useful in a real fight, and high kick rarely are..im not doubting anyones ability to throw them...but never sparring with low kicks leads to bad habits in both offense and the ability ot defend them.

 

What are your thoughts on these issues? I belive this is an important issue bacuase False confidence can be a very dangerous thing in a real altercation.

[Northren Ogre]

I agree wholeheartedly. You took the words right out of my mouth......theif

[Karateka_latino]

My instructor have a Black Belt In TKD. He used to teach it in a diferent way the other TKD school did.

 

He taught all the basics, forms, Kicks, etc... But he added soooo many other things that TKD don't use to teach...

 

He Teach Boxing punches, Takedowns and takedown defenses, Join locks and throws, GRound Fighting.. there wasn't too much clinch work though but we did trained our Knees and Elbows.

 

Our TKD class was more for combat and self defense than Sport...

 

We used to have 3 rounds of sparring, WTF TKD sparring, Boxing and Combat grappling (strikes and grappling). Our School was trully well rounded and our TKD was Effective.

[TJS]

Glad to hear that, thats what you need. Unfortunatly that is the exception rather than the rule. There are great TKD teachers that offer real fighting/self defense. but the majority try to market normal TKD as effective self defense.

[KickChick]

Can someone please tell me why Tae Kwon do is always singled out as the martial art that allegedly is ineffective in self defense???

 

What about say.... Karate, Aikido (easy Kensai ) or Kung Fu??

 

Honestly, I for one believe that any traditional training should be supplemented with simple self defense training.

 

All schools instruct differently but true "effective self defense" is widely used. Whether or not that particular school does instruct in effective self defense is the question but I don't belive it should apply only to TKD.

 

Now.... I'll jump aboard your bandwagon if you're heading over to Billy Blanks house!

[ramymensa]

Well KickChick, not only TKD is bashed here. Karate and the others are reduced to mere sh..t by some folks here Let them be happy with their opinions, although not so nice expressed. We can do something. Stop training in traditional MAs and start "real" MAs , continue our thing, break something from the anger caused by these quarrels in the forum, or just leave the forum, and go somewhere else (I wouldn't do it cause I like here. )

 

As I've already posted, let's have some respect for each other, OK? When a person spent a good deal of time doing something and believing in it, it's not nice to say they are stupid for chosing the "wrong" MA. There's no perfect style, not even the new ones invented to become more rounded. If there was such a PERFECT style, no one would ever think to come wiht another, cause more perfect than perfect ... doesn't exist. So before throwing the stone, look better on your style's own faults and stop making the others feel miserable and stupid.

 

Peace to all !!!

[TJS]

KickChick, Your right this does not only apply to TKD, I have seen lots of karate, Kung fu etc schools the same way. But I I picked TKD because Ihave personal experience with TKD and I see more TKD schools doing it more than anyone else.

 

ramymensa-People have the right to train in whatever stlye they want. I just think it's good to be open about it and realize some thing...Many people sign up for TKD /karate, etc and think they are going to learn realistic self defense and fighting..this may be tru but many times it is not.

[niel0092]

Arrghhh! Come on folks this is real old

 

More schools than you realise teach good self defense. We boxed, did elbow strikes, some take downs, chokes, escapes from chokes, knees, low kicks, and alot more. You dont see TKD'ist bashing "moden" MA's for their lack of moral development or character building (just an example). Why would we? It's not something you see if you dont do a "modern" MA and we cant make a real comment on the subject. You are entitled to your opinion but this one has been done to death.

 

Edit begins here: OK, that was a bit harsh on my part but I'm tired of every other post being on how my choice of MA sucks. It's enough to make me stop reading the forum. I try to keep an open mind but it seems there are so many that wont listen to what we say. All we want is a bit of curtosy in return.

 

Yes, self defense should include these things and the fact that they are not always there is disturbing to say the least.

[SBN Doug]

Ahhh, but this is when you need to use the calming techniques your "traditional" art has taught you. If you're confident in your art, and in what you are learning, then no one's opinion should be able to get to you.

 

I too am tired of everyone starting out with TKD can't do this or that. Personally, I think it's beacause it's one of the largest, well known arts, so the "Jack's" are always looking to fell the "Giant". However, take a second read through the post. He's stating that he doesn't like schools promoting "Self Defense" when they don't incorporate the list he gave of techniques.

Glad to hear that, thats what you need. Unfortunatly that is the exception rather than the rule. There are great TKD teachers that offer real fighting/self defense. but the majority try to market normal TKD as effective self defense.

 

Notice the praise for a TKD school. Granted, the use of the word "majority" insinuates there was some study done of every single TKD school out there and that at least 51% didn't incorporate those techniques. However, his statements are really all that bad when looked at a little objectively.

[TJS]

KSNdoug- I selcted TKD because I have personal experience with it. THe issued i listed are all not part of TKD, if they are being taught they are added in by the teacher, thus the reason I said the majority of TKD schools.

 

Like i said This is not meant to bash TKD, but as you said it's the biggest group out there..so it should be resposible for what it is teaching.