Lying about Belt Ranks

[KarateKen]

Agreed.  Here is maybe a better question.  If a student is a BB in Karate and a green belt in TKD, and are competing in a TKD tournament, what belt rank is appropriate for the student to wear? 

[sensei8]

3 hours ago, KarateKen said:

Agreed.  Here is maybe a better question.  If a student is a BB in Karate and a green belt in TKD, and are competing in a TKD tournament, what belt rank is appropriate for the student to wear? 

Interesting how you frame your question. Depending on whom one asks, TKD and Karate are quite similar, especially when tournament sparring is concerned.

To answer your question, I’m of the opinion that the karate black belt that’s a green belt in TKD, and it’s a closed tournament, I’d say that the karate black belt, to be fair to the green belt division, should enter the black belt division.

Maybe it’s just me but for integrity sake, the karate black belt should speak to the arbitrator about this concern. But that might not be necessary especially if said tournament only asks for years of training experience, and therefore, places said competitor according to that criteria.

 

[DarthPenguin]

Yeah i would say the sensible course of action is to talk to the tournament organiser and ask them. What style they do/have done is also relevant

Eg. if the student is a BB in Kyokushin/Ashihara etc. and entering a TKD sparring competition then they likely should be above the green belt division. If they are a bb in one of the styles of karate that has almost no actual kumite then maybe the Green belt division in TKD is appropriate. 

Definitely should be disclosed in a respectful manner and let the organisers make the call

[KarateKen]

Hey a punch is a punch and a kick is a kick.  

 

Am I right people??

 

[DarthPenguin]

8 hours ago, KarateKen said:

Hey a punch is a punch and a kick is a kick.  

 

Am I right people??

 

Not quite sure i get what you mean here?

on the face of it yes a punch is a punch etc. but i think you have to also factor in the constraints under which the techniques were learnt / practiced. Someone who has done a sparring/fighting heavy style such as Muay Thai, Kyokushin, Enshin, TKD will be more likely to apply a punch effectively in competition than someone who learnt it in something like Tai Chi and has never actually punched anyone or anything. The original rise of Judo sorta proved that when Kano added randori and practising techniques against resistance then his Judo Ryu beat the other schools that did older Japanese Jiu Jitsu without resisting partners.

[KarateKen]

16 hours ago, DarthPenguin said:

Not quite sure i get what you mean here?

on the face of it yes a punch is a punch etc. but i think you have to also factor in the constraints under which the techniques were learnt / practiced. Someone who has done a sparring/fighting heavy style such as Muay Thai, Kyokushin, Enshin, TKD will be more likely to apply a punch effectively in competition than someone who learnt it in something like Tai Chi and has never actually punched anyone or anything. The original rise of Judo sorta proved that when Kano added randori and practising techniques against resistance then his Judo Ryu beat the other schools that did older Japanese Jiu Jitsu without resisting partners.

Well without getting into a style debate the argument was always that an armbar in BJJ is the same as an elbow lock JJJ, meaning that you can learn the same techniques in different styles.  Such as Karate and TKD have a lot of overlap.  However, you are correct, different styles can do different tyles of kicks.  Like in a TKD class that is sport focused you might learn to do the slap kick, a roundhouse kick using the instep of your foot to hit your opponent, where in MT you are learning to roundhouse kick with the shin, and in Karate you might be learning to roundhouse kick with the bottom of your foot.  So, yes, I agree they can be different. 

[DarthPenguin]

8 hours ago, KarateKen said:

Well without getting into a style debate the argument was always that an armbar in BJJ is the same as an elbow lock JJJ, meaning that you can learn the same techniques in different styles.  Such as Karate and TKD have a lot of overlap.  However, you are correct, different styles can do different tyles of kicks.  Like in a TKD class that is sport focused you might learn to do the slap kick, a roundhouse kick using the instep of your foot to hit your opponent, where in MT you are learning to roundhouse kick with the shin, and in Karate you might be learning to roundhouse kick with the bottom of your foot.  So, yes, I agree they can be different. 

That is true but not what i meant: i meant that someone who has not trained against resistance is materially different to someone who has done so.

So if someone has never sparred/done kumite/randori and is a black belt then it is probably not as important when they enter some competition in another style that is related as someone who has performed it against  resisting opponent. eg ask me if i want to fight someone who has done Muay Thai for 10years, never fought and only done bagwork or someone who has done it for 2years but spars weekly and had a couple of fights : i will pick the first person every single time

[Spartacus Maximus]

There can be many reasons to find lying about rank objectionable depending on perspective. If it’s done at a competitive event, it is a form of cheating. Much like a pro athlete passing off as an amateur just to compete in a local level tournament. Anyone with a sense of fairplay would justly call cheat/fraud.

[Montana]

On 9/23/2025 at 5:48 PM, KarateKen said:

Hmmm I never thought about it like this.  If a student has a black belt in Judo and a green belt in TKD, and is competing in a TKD tournament, what color belt should the student be wearing? 

In that situation, since Kudo and TKD are totally dissimilar systems from a kata perspective, I'd allow that. Sparring events would depend on the sparring rules.

[Montana]

On 9/24/2025 at 9:00 PM, KarateKen said:

Agreed.  Here is maybe a better question.  If a student is a BB in Karate and a green belt in TKD, and are competing in a TKD tournament, what belt rank is appropriate for the student to wear? 

Definitely wear a black belt. Although they are not the same, they are similar enough to warrant wearing the rank that they hold that is the highest.