"My" Martial Arts Style... Gunlann (better name)

[iolair]

I know I'm one of thousands to try this, but I'm developing my own martial arts style.... called Modern Greenoch. I'M POSTING THIS HERE TO GET PEOPLE'S FEEDBACK ON WHAT THEY THINK OF THIS "STYLE".

 

I realise that there are lots of eclectic MAs already out there, with different people's takes on the set of techniques that are most effective. The difference here is to select a small number of the most effective techniques, so

 

1) with infrequent training, you still have a chance of becoming effective

 

2) with frequent training, these small set of techniques should become very fast and fluent indeed....

 

The technique list

 

There are 5 "quintets" of offensive techniques in different ranges, and also the "zeroth quintet" of basics that are included for all students of the style... the sets of techniques are in the order in which a student would be examined in them for gradings.

 

"Zeroth" 0th quintet - essentials

 

1) Footwork (drilled heavily, techniques are most similar to western boxing)

 

2) Groundwork (the four basic hold positions, transitioning between positions, escaping holds)

 

3) Falling - breakfalls to all directions, forward and side rolls to standing.

 

4) Conditioning

 

5) Blocking (only two blocks are part of the style, however)

 

1st Quintet - Punching

 

1) Jab

 

2) Cross

 

3) Hook

 

4) Backfist

 

5) Uppercut

 

2nd Quintet - Throws

 

1) Hip Throw

 

2) Body drop throw

 

3) "Major outer reaping" (i.e.o soto gari)

 

4) Shoulder throw

 

5) Shoulder wheel

 

3rd Quintet - Kicks

 

1) Front kick

 

2) Roundhouse

 

3) Side thrust kick

 

4) Back kick

 

5) Hook kick (practiced from the same chamber position as side thrust and roundhouse)

 

4th Quintet - Submissions

 

1) Naked Choke

 

2) Cross Body Arm Lock

 

3) Figure 4 Arm Lock

 

4) Single Wing Collar Choke

 

5) Still undecided: probably a knee lock?

 

5th Quintet - Infighting

 

1) Round elbow strike

 

2) Rearwards elbow strike

 

3) Rising knee strike

 

4) Roundhouse knee

 

5) Rising elbow strike

 

Each strike is learnt initially to the most effective target, then alternative targets are practiced later. (For example, side thrust kick would first be targetted at the knee, but advanced learners would also practice targetting the throat and nose).

 

Weapons

 

learnt after adequate unarmed skill reached on all techniques, there are two weapons: Dagger (knife) and Cudgel (heavy 2-foot stick).

 

The name "Modern Greenoch"

 

In the olden days of Usenet when I frequented it in the early 90s, there would often crop up on rec.martial-arts rather silly "My style is better than you're style" type threads. As people got fed up with this, a frequent reply was to invoke the "ancient celtic martial art of Greenoch", a fictional style more effective than any other in which the Greenoch master could (for example) annihalate a troop of Ninjas with a double-reverse-eyebrow-twitch. Personally, I like the name "Greenoch", so when I decided to put together my own style I thought I'd steal the name, but of course as I had no ancient celtic druid Greenoch masters to teach me, this has to be "Modern Greenoch".

 

Grading System

 

The grades are not particularly important (the colours are based on ancient druid ranks - I'll post the details if your interested). Each grading would include technique assessment, fitness assessment and both ground based and standing sparring. Striking-sparring in gradings would be semi-contact for early grades, For senior grades full contact and include exposure to multiple attackers. Again, early gradings would isolate "quintets" for the sparring (i.e. one sparring session would be kicking attacks only), later grades would allow combinations of any striking or grappling techniques as well.

Edited January 23, 2003 by iolair

[Kensai]

Whats Greenoch?

 

Interesting take on druids, sort of like an English Tradtional MA. If it works it works.

 

I am not really pro creating styles unless you are very good at lots of styles and have suffiient knoweldge of techniques to make a discion on what does and does not work. However, you seem to have a good set of techniques there, although limited, but thats what you intention anyway. I would try and beef up your knowledge a little more, perhaps take some Self Defence classes, as well as some of the more Traditional MA. Just so you get the feel as whats the best for your style.

 

Best of luck.

[iolair]

Whats Greenoch?

The original Greenoch is an "ancient celtic martial art", and doesn't exist - it was used in posts on the rec.martial-arts newsgroup a decade ago. I've just stolen the name, and added in the "Modern" to save anyone who remembers the fictional version getting confused.

I am not really pro creating styles unless you are very good at lots of styles and have suffiient knoweldge of techniques to make a discion on what does and does not work.

I think in reality every martial arts practitioner creates their own style. Even practitioners of only 1 art make decisions on which is the best way to apply the techniques they know: those who study multiple arts each take a different interpretation onto the street of how to mix them up!

 

Of course, most people do this unconsciously. The main thing I'm doing different is formalising it and giving it a name. Even if only I use it, I think it will still have been a useful exercise. If anyone else decided to jump on the bandwagon, I won't complain though!

However, you seem to have a good set of techniques there, although limited, but thats what you intention anyway. I would try and beef up your knowledge a little more, perhaps take some Self Defence classes, as well as some of the more Traditional MA. Just so you get the feel as whats the best for your style.

I feel I have enough experience to give this a go... despite the limited grades in my signature file, I actually have quite a lot of experience, namely

 

The following three styles trained formally (started in good clubs)

 

- 16 years Karate (practiced at least every week during that time, except for one year off due to a hip injury)

 

- 12 years Fencing (not always immediately applicable, but leads to a strong understanding of timing, footwork and distance)

 

- 1.5 years Judo

 

And the following studied during the last decade informally (outside of a club, but often with trained practitioners) for a shorter but appreciable length of time

 

- Jiu-Jitsu, Boxing, TKD, Savate, Muay Thai, Amateur Wrestling

 

My lack of grading is because, for personal reasons, I've not formally attended a club (apart from fencing) for the last 10 years. I still train privately and with friends.

 

The most limited part of my experience is streetfighting; I've only been involved in four "real" fights, and I'm not too eager to get into more just for research. So for this aspect I've relied heavily on what I've read: particularly Geoff Thompson's "Dead or Alive" (very good book - highly recommended), Musashi's "Go Rin No Sho" and Sun Tzu's "Art of War".

 

Finally, I've studied many videos of martial arts movies and competitions, not to copy the technique (as in movies the techniques are picked for how they look), but to spot where someone using that technique is open to counterattack.

Best of luck.

Thanks.

[ZeRo]

sounds good, and you do have quite a wide knowledge to arts so i see no reason with alittle bit of tweacking it couldnt be a good style.

 

good luck!

[Kensai]

The thing to remember is that if you are going to use techniques from other styles make sure that they are right. If you teach throws for example and the dynamics are not right you could not only hurt yourself, but those you teach. But I am sure that you know what you are doing, best of luck.

[Karateka_latino]

Looks good, BUT if you are serious about it, you need TEACHING experience...

 

Any style means nothing if you can pass it to your studends, otherwise, that style will died with you.

 

Teaching a new system isn't easy and isn't something that everybody can do.

 

In the Black belt magazine site you'll find a very interesting and very informative article about creating a new martial art that i recommend you and all the people of this forum to read.

 

https://www.blackbeltmag.com

 

then click on " Black belt Search " and put the title "CAUTION: NEW MARTIAL ARTS AHEAD"

[omnifinite]

I'd be nervous about the name I think. I don't think naming your art after an inside joke is the best route to credibility.

[iolair]

Looks good, BUT if you are serious about it, you need TEACHING experience... Any style means nothing if you can pass it to your studends, otherwise, that style will died with you. Teaching a new system isn't easy and isn't something that everybody can do.

Firstly, a large part of this is a personal project; by creating this style I'm improving my own understanding and ability as a martial artist.

 

Secondly, I've no great desire to start up a dojo/club with this style - it will probably be shared with a few friends etc, but I'm not trying to create the "Next Big Thing". The furthest I'm likely to go publicly is a web site.

 

Thirdly, as it happens I actually work as a teacher anyway (science, 11-18 year olds). My specific experience of teaching combat sports is limited to a few months teaching beginners' fencing though.

In the Black belt magazine site you'll find a very interesting and very informative article about creating a new martial art that i recommend you and all the people of this forum to read.

 

https://www.blackbeltmag.com

 

then click on " Black belt Search " and put the title "CAUTION: NEW MARTIAL ARTS AHEAD"

Or the direct link to the article is

 

http://www.blackbeltmag.com/archives/blackbelt/1999/sep99/3.html

[iolair]

http://www.blackbeltmag.com/archives/blackbelt/1999/sep99/3.html

 

I've just read it....

 

Am I as good a fighter as Bruce Lee or Chuck Norris? Not a hope on earth. Have I conducted a comprehensive study of different fighting arts? You betcha!

Another thing that makes most legitimate martial artists sick to their stomach is when the new soke decides to become an eighth-, ninth- or 10th-degree black belt. One day that person was a first-, second-, or third-degree, and the next day he is a high-ranking master.

Here's the thing. Although I have enough knowledge to plan the full scope of this new art, in terms of practice I would consider myself in the MIDDLE of its grade structure. This is actually (on a personal level) very useful, as it gives me the path for improving my own ability. On the other hand, while I'm prepared to share this art and have others train with me, I know I'm not ready to have anyone train under me. IF that happens, it will happen in a few years time when the style has been tested by time in training, and where I have applied it in (at least) sparring while sticking rigidly to the limits of the style, to see fairly how it performs.

 

By the way, the grading structure does not have many "dan grades" or the equivalent. Basically, after all the novice grades (equivalent of kyu grades), there are only three senior grades: black (competent), grey (expert) and white (teacher). The teacher grade does not indicate a higher level of technical ability than grey...

If you wish to create your own combat style, you must look at the big picture, which means you must think about the best interests of your future students. For their benefit, you need to possess lots of knowledge and have a complete understanding of your style and its techniques. To accomplish that, you may have to train for 10 years or more and hold a minimum rank of fourth- or fifth-degree black belt.

As I stated in the last post, I'm not really thinking in terms of future students/opening a school at this point, and may not ever do so. I'd make sure I had several more years experience with the new style before I'd even consider doing so. I do have 16 years experience - though as I said I've not graded for 10 years. Personally, I think grade in previous styles is irrelevant (though of course if I was starting a real club it would be important for credibility).

Which forms will you use? Should you make up your own

Undecided. I'll only include them if I'm completely convinced they aid fighting ability.

The easy way to make all those decisions is to find two or three martial artists who have the maturity, age and wisdom needed to act as mentors and advisors.

This is the kind of reason I'm posting this here, to get feedback from a variety of martial artists from different backgrounds.

[iolair]

I'd be nervous about the name I think. I don't think naming your art after an inside joke is the best route to credibility.

You have a point ... if I was trying to set up the style as a business / or attract lots of students, it would be a dumb name. Even given that I'm not doing so, it may be worth reconsidering - if I can come up with any ideas. I've never been creative at all in that way though! Any suggestions? I'd want the name to reflect that this was a British/Western style rather than an oriental one.

 

[EDIT]Hmm, possibly comhlann (pronounced covlan), which is the Scot's Gaelic word for "combat".[/EDIT]

 

On the other hand, not-taking oneself too seriously is a good thing