Aikido (thoughts please)

[Kyle-san]

I thinkI have settled on Kodenkan Jujitsu. Sounds like the perfect ma for me. Thus far anyway. I cannot check out the classes until I get up there though

 

A jujitsu style sounds like what you were looking for. You'll have to let us know how it works out.

[Kfcharlie]

**Original message**

 

4. I want an art that would not hand me a black belt in under 2 years. I want to REALLY have to work to acheive my goal.

 

first of all this goal does not really matter. a black belt does not mean anything, it is just the begining. yes of course there are colored belts or at least one white belt before black but your first blackbelt does not mean that you can handle yourself at all, it just means that you are ready to learn.

 

also, any real martial system is a great choice for self defense, but you have to be careful. many styles are more of sports or "arts" any more. if you are looking for self defense then you need to try and find a budo or something that ends in "do". in the oreint "do" has multiple meanings but in general it means the way. i practice taekwon-do (tkd) and hapki-do and a few other systems and i will be the first to tell you to be leary of a tkd school. while i love the system and all that it embodies, recently it is becoming harder and harder to find a good school that is not focused on the sport of tournament but more so the martial system.

 

when you mentioned sparring as being a way to test yourself you are wrong. becasue no matter what you do sparring is not fighting it is sparring. it has rules and there is such a thing as dirty fighting. however, in a "real life" fight there are no rules, there is no such concept as fighting dirty, anything goes. so one of the best ways, in my opinion, you can practice would be to just do plent of repetition and form and envision your apponent standing in front of you, and some partner drills short from going out and just beating people up.

 

Finally you mentioned something about ki/chi training. let me tell you that any true martial system teaches their style as a 3 step process. the process is body, mind, and spirit. body is no more than physically going through the motions, generally associated with your 1st dgree black belts, this alone will not allow you to properly defend yourself. next comes mind, it allows you to focus and concentrate and understand what you are doing and why. allows you to interpret why things happen the way they do in your system. and the last is spirit. this is the ki, the mystical stuff that you talk about. i too have a strong christian back ground and i believe deeply in ki power. i have even seen people be knocked out by it with out being touched, and have been knocked out my self, i have seen someone hold up a full grown man at shoulder length suporting the mans weight on his arm and keeping this guys feet 2 feet from the ground. but here is the important part, we all have it in us. we just have to learn how to harness it. in the christian religion it can be described as the breath that God breathed into the dust from which adam was born. it can be labeld as the holy spirit woking with in us. remember samson. the main thing to remeber is that it is not in any way saying that you are more powerful than God or that you are un-christian. all it means is that when you get to this piont all three steps have been completed and your body, mind, and spirit act as one. to qoute Bruse Lee form Enter the Dragon, "When i see an opening i do not stike... but it (his fist) strikes true" with out any thought, it becomes instinct.

 

just remeber that aikido is a great system, i have done it before and really like it. but it takes a very long time to become proficient at it. where as it might only take 2-3 years to develop the ability to defend yourself through a striking system, aikido takes around 6-8 years to become good enuff to defend yourself.

 

i hope this is food for thought. any questions or comments just reply. oh, and by the way, my name is Jacob and this is my first time posting on the forum too.

[Dustin1978]

Thanks for all that great info Jacob! IT gave me a lot to think about and set my mind at ease about many aspects of th whole thing. I think I have found the art I will start with and it is Kodenkan Jujitsu. I spoke with the instructor on the phone and she said it has all the joint locks and take downs of aikido but it does not specialize in it. It also has all the Grapple and groudn work of BJJ but liekwise does not specialize in it. She said it is the art which BJJ and Aikido and kenp all stemed from. She seemed to know her stuff. Any thoughts on this particular art?

 

So now I am thinking most likely Kodenkan Jujitsu then I also am considering Kuk Sul Do and Aikido still

 

Thoughts are always great! O and welcoem to this board! I LOVE IT SO FAR! everyone is so helpful and respectful it is outstanding!

[Kensai]

I have never heard of Kodenkan Jujutsu. However it could be one of the styles that O Sensei Ueshiba studied before creating Aikido.

 

I always thought that Kenpo came from Shaolin, not Jujutsu? Anyway go with what you have a feeling for, you wont know whether you really like it or not until ya try it.

 

But like KFcharlie said, Aikido takes along time be able to apply. JJ styles in general take less time.

 

Just did a quick search on the net and found this link:

 

http://www.kodenkan.com/

 

http://www.okugi.org/

 

Hope this helps.

 

HEY ZERO, This style is the brother style to Small Circle JJ. They both have the same line to Henry S Okazaki.

[niel0092]

Kensai, could you or anyone else here that has done akido, describe a "typical class" for us. What do you do, how do you warm up etc.

[Kensai]

Sure,

 

Usually we do basic warm ups, strechs and the like.

 

Then Ukemi/breakfalls, both foward and back ward rolls.

 

Ki exercises. Happo Undo (Eight ways), Furitama (side ways exericese), Nikyo, Kote Gashi, Kokyuho Undo etc. Its difficult to describe these movements.

 

Then some actual Aikido, this is how my class usually progesses.

 

For Dan grades, usually Knife and sometimes Bokken and Jo.

[niel0092]

Thanksfor the quick response. Work was dull there for a moment.

 

What do you mean by "actual" Aikido? I assume that it's locks, escapes from grabs, and that sort of thing. How much time do you spend on those things in a typical class period? Half of the class? More or less?

[Bhayl]

The Aikido class I'm in is structured very similar the Kensai's.

 

First is generic warm ups and stretching followed by ki exercises and then ukemi. Following that the sensei demonstrates the first technique several times then we pair up and practice that technique for 5-10 minutes while he goes from pair to pair offering help and guidance as well as sometimes taking ukemi. Then we line back up, he shows the next technique and so on until class ends. About 2/3rds to 3/4ths of class time would be spent doing "actual techniques", the rest being spent in warm ups and time spent observing the next technique being demonstrated. Hope that helps answer your question.

[Kensai]

I think my class is more a of 50 50 split.

 

Ukemi and Ki are of equal importance in Ki Aikido as the "actual" techniques themselves. So about 50% of the time we do break falls and Ki. As without being about to do proper breakfalls you cant train at full power and without Ki training it starts to look more like JJ than Aikido, more physical anyway.

 

In terms of teaching our class in similar to that of Bhayl. Sensei will do a technique, we pair off with a person of a similar grade. Sensei will visit each group pointing out problems and taking Ukemi and demostrating with a smaller group.

[niel0092]

Thanks guys, that answers my question nicely.